Teaching children: budgeting

[shootingstar]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/household-finances/five-ways-to-stunt-a-childs-financial-growth/article1949455/page1/

Well how did you learn over time?

Looking back, I think it's remarkable that all of us, myself and sibs, have been savers as adults. We don't do terrible things on each other ie. borrow money and never pay back, or pestering each other for loans or leaching off one another. We each have bought homes on our own. We didn't borrow from parents.

And we never got allowance as children nor as teens. Parents just couldn't afford it.

I am not kiddin'. The rule of thumb around the house: was we would have greater freedom of what we wanted when we started to earn our own money.

And we weren't allowed to take on part-time paid jobs until in our final 1-2 years of high school. We had to focus on our studies.

I'm not sure how my parents did it..but with each of us there were some fierce arguments. Whatever we each asked for, it had to have a good reason and be justified, so usually one saved the discussion/debate for something that was hotly desired.

I do credit my parents that they engaged in long thoughtful discussions amongst themselves about their finances...which large part of the time they never hid from us. Of course they didn't have "sinful" spending habits or obsessions where one of them spent an obscene amount of money in a wasteful way.

When I was 12 yrs. my parents told me how much they paid for their first house.

[Crankin]

My parents didn't teach me explicitly. I got an allowance from about age 10, which increased to about $5.00 a week when I graduated HS in 1971. But that was really for fun money. Like going to the movies, etc. My parents paid for everything. When I was young, until about the end of middle school, they had tons of $. Then, my dad lost his job and it was never the same, really, even after he was employed again, but I had grandparents who picked up the slack for a lot.
I started babysitting in 7th grade and made a TON of money. I continued this through my first 2 years of college and then had a work-study job at the university. I bought a lot of my clothes and also spent for social activities. I had a savings account, which I had to use for books and stuff.
If anything, I learned from my parents. Don't do what they did! Get an education and save for retirement. My dad is 86, has nothing to show for many years of hard work. I always had a bit less than everyone else, even when my parents were very, very comfortable. No trips to Europe, no car of my own, etc. We went to Cape Cod every summer (rented a cottage, no second home) with the whole family, no summer camp for 8 weeks like all of my friends. My family is (was) very "Yankee," which means no big show of stuff, despite the fact they were surrounded by wealth.
My own kids had plenty, but always less than their friends. They each got a savings account in first grade. We made them pay for their own ski lessons when we moved here with some of that money! Boy, they hated me for that. They got an allowance for fun stuff, but we paid for most things. They used to pool their birthday and Chanukah money to buy computer games. Oldest son got his first real paid job as soon as he could drive himself there and so did the second one. They also both babysat from age 12 on and made plenty. Especially the younger one; he was besieged with requests from families who had boys when he was the only boy who worked in the child development lab at the high school. In fact, he bought his first bike with that money and that is what started our family cycling.
My kids are both financially independent and responsible. They also both like nice things, which I am pretty sure they learned from us. We made sure they started off with no debt, but the rest was up to them.

[Tri Girl]

I was #7 of 8 kids. Never earned allowance and always had hand-me-downs. In my house you got a job when you turned 13 (babysitting or mowing lawns until it was legal to work). I paid for half my car (parents paid the other half), and I paid my own insurance/gas on that car. Once I got a job my parents didn't pay for ANYTHING (well, aside from the obvious food and shelter in the house).
Once I got a job I paid for clothes, school lunches, extracurricular expenses and anything else I needed/wanted.
I am appreciative of how my parents raised me with finances. I appreciate everything I got because from age 13 on it was bought with my own money.
One bad thing is that I was never taught how to balance a checkbook, so when I got to college I bounced a dozen checks before the bank lady sat down and taught me how to keep up with an account (sad, but true- I was soooo embarrassed :o).

When I got to college I went a little overboard and opened up a credit card and spent WAY too much money on things I didn't need because we had so little growing up. Got smart my senior year of college and got it all paid off. Now I save like a maniac and don't live beyond my means (I live below my means and pump as much as possible into savings and retirement).

[shootingstar]

Once I got a job my parents didn't pay for ANYTHING (well, aside from the obvious food and shelter in the house).
Once I got a job I paid for clothes, school lunches, extracurricular expenses and anything else I needed/wanted.
I am appreciative of how my parents raised me with finances. I appreciate everything I got because from age 13 on it was bought with my own money.


Wow, Tri Girl, starting to pay for serious stuff at 13...

My parents were quite poor but still they didn't ask that out of us and if we weren't allowed to have a job at that time, well then nothing was possible.

Actually even at university for my 2 degrees, I was flabbergasted that many students went off south into Florida to vacation for a few days. None of my friends did, and they came from families with more money. As soon as I started to earn money for full time work after university parents told me to start saving abit for retirement.

I started to listen them ...3-4 yrs. later, socking abit of money lazily away, not truly understanding what I was doing in terms of making money grow. Then I snapped out of it when I started to consider a home...

Wow Murrien no credit card. That is an achievement. And I'm a person that has only had to pay interest twice in my lifetime on overdue credit card bills. I consider it an achievement that I don't used debit card. So M. you are remarkable.

[Tri Girl]

Wow, Tri Girl, starting to pay for serious stuff at 13...

My parents were quite poor but still they didn't ask that out of us and if we weren't allowed to have a job at that time, well then nothing was possible.



Don't mean to make them sound like slave-drivers. I think they just really wanted us to know the value of a dollar and to not take anything for granted. And plus, with so many kids I truly think they just needed help with expenses- and none of us minded. I didn't know any better so it didn't seem unreasonable. I earned about $20/week from babysitting and that was enough to buy lunch at school (seriously- all I wanted to eat at lunch was a pizza pocket for $1 at lunch) and the clothes I wanted (even then I was a Goodwill/thrift store kind of person). By the time I got a real job and started driving I earned a lot more. Acadmeics were VERY important to them, too, and we had to toe the line with our schoolwork. I worked hard academically to get a scholarship to college because I knew that scholarship and loans were the only way to get a degree.

I take that back- they always took us clothes shopping at the start of the school year and they bought us a new pair of shoes and a new outfit. I'm sure that set them back quite a chunk of change. They worked sooooo hard (mom worked 2 jobs, dad worked one with very long hours). They did the best they could with limited educations and resources. I never felt like I wanted for anything or that I went without. I never felt poor, until I became an adult and realized what little we had. We only took two family vacations growing up- when I was 11 we went to the Grand Canyon and when I was 14 we went to Disneyland. Those were the BEST vacations I've ever had (even better than some I've had as an adult).

[jessmarimba]

I grew up with my aunts' old toys and thrift-store clothes. We would go on vacation in the motor home for a month in the summer, but it was the thriftiest summer vacation you ever saw - my sister and I would save the coins we found to buy candy :) We didn't get an allowance, even when we did we couldn't "have" it (It went in the bank), we brought bag lunches to school and field trips, and I don't remember seeing a movie outside of the $1 theater growing up.

One thing I'm really good at now is vacationing on a budget (it helps that I like to camp!) But in reality, the only "fun" thing I spend money on now is plane tickets to go see my guy.

[lph]

My son has his first job now at 13, delivering the paper 3 times a week. It's 2 hours of hard work each time, and he deserves the money he makes, which is considerable for a 13.yr.old. So far he's free to spend it on anything he likes, but we cover food and lodging (of course), most public transport, basic clothing (which he cares zip about) and basic used sports equipment - bike, skis and skates. If he wants new gear or expensive clothes he'll have to pay for them himself, but so far I think all he's paid for is a computer game or two and a couple of outings with friends. If he was just spending money all over the place instead of saving it we might ask him to pay more himself, but since he's that thrifty we don't.

[tangentgirl]

One big thing I regret is not starting contributing to a 401k earlier. Dangit, I worked at <big company> for 5 years starting at age 18. They matched, but I was so young and dumb and retirement seemed stupid and far away and why would I put my money into something I didn't understand, when I could have an extra $5 in my pocket right then? I remember even trying to turn them down for health insurance, cause I didn't want to pay the extra $4 a week or whatever it was. Luckily that didn't fly. Yeah.

That kind of stuff just wasn't valued or talked about in my family. My parents didn't have jobs with *fancy* things like retirement or insurance.

High school, on the other hand, could have done a better job. There should be mandatory classes on personal finance. I didn't really figure things out until my early 30s, after making a concerted effort to learn more and change bad habits.

**Editing because I'm still shaking my head at my 18yo self. I remember literally thinking that the 401k stuff must be a scam and people who gave their money to it were suckers. Geez!**

[shootingstar]

My son has his first job now at 13, delivering the paper 3 times a week. It's 2 hours of hard work each time, and he deserves the money he makes, which is considerable for a 13.yr.old. So far he's free to spend it on anything he likes, but we cover food and lodging (of course), most public transport, basic clothing (which he cares zip about) and basic used sports equipment - bike, skis and skates. If he wants new gear or expensive clothes he'll have to pay for them himself, but so far I think all he's paid for is a computer game or two and a couple of outings with friends. If he was just spending money all over the place instead of saving it we might ask him to pay more himself, but since he's that thrifty we don't.

Great, lph. My dearie has his story of his paper route which he had back then at that age and biking around in the winter through the snow to deliver newspapers. :) They were poor enough, he actually offered to his mother, to pay for some food at times. Can you imagine, at that age? I know his mother took on knitting (this was the 1950's) and other work to make money. His stepfather occasionally drank too much.. and was not as frugal as his mother.

Technology these days, is just one more type of stuff for anyone to covet these days. Especially kids unless they have other passions/distractions.

I do have a favourite memory of my mother sewing a shirt for my father with standup collars, tailored cuffs.....by using expensive Viyella lightweight plaid wool from Scotland. He wore it nearly every wk. It was her way of "treating" him with a gift, I supppose. She spent a certain amount of time with him to select the fabric, etc.

[shootingstar]

I do get annoyed when there is a strong perception that kids from poor families are deficient ..in many different ways. That they are deprived of certain experiences.

True I did not go on any overnight trips..my parents just weren't into camping. We only went on day trips by car to Toronto/southern Ontario for the day.. several times per year.

I never travelled beyond until I started to earn money. So yes, later cycle-touring has given me some amazing experiences. Now I've travelled enough to have seen parts of my own country, more than some of my friends.

True, there was no money to enroll me in art classes, no music lessons for any of us, no courses for anything for anyone in family as kids. But academically, we were scoring in the top 10-15% in school. Yes, I got into furious debates about getting art supplies, which parents eventually relented. Over time, they realized it was wiser to have allow this, since they knew it kept me busy, happy and occupied at home. :)

So it was resorting to outdoor play, the library, sewing our own clothes (to remain fashionable), later, cheap coffee with friends, etc. Life was not easy, but not horrible. If my parents continuously ragged on how poor we were, then it would have been a complete drag.

[tulip]

I've always been horrible with money. It stems from my family never having any, growing up on food stamps until I was 12, and general anxiety about it. My mother never has never been in debt, but she's never had any money, either. My father has been in debt, but he always manages to lurch out of it, and then into it again. So I swing from being being in debt to just being broke. Fun!

Mind you, I have two houses, a relatively new car, three nice bikes, and a fabulous kitchen...so things could be worse. Now I just have to pay for those things.

Since January, however, I've come leaps and bounds with some education, a new philosophy, and some very useful software. For the first time, I have money in the bank and I'm not spending it. I have a plan to pay off my debt, and I'm working the plan. I have a budget and it's incredibly powerful, but I'm not "starving" so I know I won't "binge."

Of course I wish I had done things differently in the past, but all we can do is start where we are.

[limewave]

I do remember getting an allowance at a young age. I also remember, around 8-10 years old, my parents taking me to the bank to open my first savings account. We did Christmas Club through the bank: every month we added a little bit of money so that at Christmas time we had money for gifts. I still have the same Chirstmas account.

I feel like my parents did a good job of teaching us about money. They did help us out, but everything they did was working towards financial independence for us. For example, when I was 16 my brother and I shared a car that my parents bought and paid for the insurance--but we had to pay for gas and repairs. Then when I was 19 years old, I bought my own car and my parents paid the insurance, but only for the first 12 months. That was also when I got my first job and first apartment!

Only once, as an adult, I had to ask my parents to borrow money. It was to buy a computer to start my own freelance design business. It was an interest-free loan. I had a small monthly payment I had to make and then he also got a percentage of the profits from my free-lance jobs until he was paid in full. Hopefully I never need to borrow money from them again!

[redrhodie]

I got my first job at 12, working in a church rectory. My mom was the church secretary, so I'd come after school and work, and we'd drive home together. I didn't get an allowance once I had a job. I didn't work steadily, but had summer jobs and babysat regularly through high school.

After high school, I took a year off, and got a full time job. I lived at home, and my mother charged me rent. Her philosophy was that if I worked, I contributed. At the time, I couldn't believe I suddenly had to pay for what had always been free, but in hindsight, it was really smart and kind on her part.

There were times we really struggled, briefly on welfare, when my mom couldn't find work. We got government assistance for heat. I don't remember ever being on food stamps, but I do remember standing in line to get free cheese. We often didn't have a car, and when we did, it was never a reliable one. Going to the grocery store was a nightmare. My mother would rarely ask anyone for help, even for just a ride to the store. I think she was embarrassed, and too proud.

When I went to college, I lived at home to save money, and I didn't have to pay rent since I was in school. My dad chipped in more at this point, but I still maxed out my student loans. My mom and brother helped me pay them off after I graduated, which I'm still amazed about, and grateful for. As soon as I could afford to pay the balances myself, I took over their share. I ended up paying them off years early. I was lucky and had a good job. I helped her financially when she needed it, but it always made her feel bad to accept money from me. She never did have a good relationship with money on her own, but somehow, she taught me well.

[Crankin]

ShootingStar, I think the main thing with the thought that "poor kids" are deprived is that they are educationally deprived, or not encouraged to do well in school, for a variety of reasons. That certainly wasn't the case for you, as it was a core value in your family. And, I guess it could be debated that lack of exposure to art, music, travel makes you deprived. I had exposure to art as a kid, but music? Forget it. My dad played a lot of jazz at home, but that was it. No one played an instrument and no one traveled. My family even made fun of those who traveled :(. It took me a long time to get over that one. My family had the $ to do all of these things, but it just wasn't imporant to them. I didn't feel deprived, though, even though everyone else took music lessons and traveled. When one of my kids signed up for music lessons at school, I was amazed he had talent. It definitely comes from DH's side. Then, when DS #2 stated he didn't want lessons (by this time we had mooved to a community where everyone is required to take lessons in elementary school) in middle school, my friends really tried to tell me I was depriving him and I should make him. I assured him I had lived without having music lessons. And the music teacher in his elective class really did not believe him, when my son told him that he couldn't read music or play an instrument, especially since his brother was so talented. It was such a core value in the community, this was seen as odd.

[Melalvai]

I'm mostly glad that we are (still) struggling to make ends meet. I'm worried that we won't be able to buy a house and save for retirement, but we're proud of being debt free (except for student loans) and I feel really good each month about saying "I can by this and this, but that will have to wait until next month". It's the second half of that sentence that makes me feel good.

My daughter gets a small allowance, which mostly she saves. We buy everything she needs and I make sure she has spending money (either from her allowance or I'll just supply it)--but despite that she herself has ample money she is SO worried about money all the time, and she hates parting with it! I love her dearly but I don't know how she came to be such a tight a$$! She's been that way since she was quite little. We aren't like that, neither are we the opposite, I'd say we used to spend a little more than we ought and now we are a lot better at saving--but still not unwilling to part with money like she is.

[sfa]

I think my parents did a great job teaching us about finances and budgeting. I was one of six kids and Dad was a teacher, so there was never much money around (like Tri Girl--I lived in hand-me-downs, even wearing my brother's old clothes). We got allowances starting at age six--50 cents base pay, then every year on our birthday we'd get a five cents a week raise. So at my peak (around age 11) I was bringing in roughly $1.00 a week. They did this entirely to teach us about budgeting--Dad ran a "store" at home, where he'd keep the extra school supplies and we could buy them out of our allowance (and he'd sell them one crayon at a time!). I was always the saver in the family--I remember going on one family vacation and I was the richest kid in the family, with $21 saved up.

Once we hit middle school, we were expected to earn our own money--allowances stopped at age 12, so I babysat and delivered newspapers for a while back when kids used to be able to do those things. As soon as I was 16 I got a job at a garden center. We got checking accounts along with these jobs, and Dad taught us how to balance the checkbook (odd now that I think about it--Mom always was the one who paid bills at home, but Dad was the financial teacher). Throughout high school I was expected to pay for everything myself except school books and supplies and any activity done with the family. But clothes, entertainment, any activity I did with my friends, gifts for others, etc.--I paid for all of that. We each had to pay a portion of our college costs too (whatever the Financial Aid people said was our contribution, my parents asked for at the start of each year to pay the bill, so I'd earn money all summer and hand it over in August, and we all took out the maximum allowed amount in student loans), and all of everything in college (same as high school, only now paying for books, supplies, and all of our "household" stuff like toiletries and laundry supplies.). And absolutely no cars--they were clear on that from when we were little. We could use the family car when it was free once we could drive, but we had to pay for gas and insurance ourselves.

Dad did some formal education with us about investments and how interest rates and mortgages worked, but it was always a one-time thing so I remember that he talked about it, but when the time came for me to deal with these things I couldn't remember most of what he said. I got into a bit of trouble with credit card debt--that was one thing not on his radar when we were young because people pretty much didn't have credit cards, and if they did, it meant they were financially pretty secure. When I was in college the cc companies started with the easy credit stuff, but it still wasn't out of control until much later. My cc debt problems happened after having a second child and not enough money to pay for child care, so we were using credit cards for daily expenses.

More than anything, my parents taught by example--they lived extraordinarily frugally and taught us to do the same. I have to admit that as stressful as it is to have DH unemployed for nearly two years now, I'm very proud that we've been able to cut expenses enough that we aren't behind on any of our bills and haven't taken on any more debt.

[shootingstar]

ShootingStar, I think the main thing with the thought that "poor kids" are deprived is that they are educationally deprived, or not encouraged to do well in school, for a variety of reasons. That certainly wasn't the case for you, as it was a core value in your family. And, I guess it could be debated that lack of exposure to art, music, travel makes you deprived. I had exposure to art as a kid, but music? Forget it. My dad played a lot of jazz at home, but that was it. No one played an instrument and no one traveled. My family even made fun of those who traveled :(. It took me a long time to get over that one. My family had the $ to do all of these things, but it just wasn't imporant to them. I didn't feel deprived, though, even though everyone else took music lessons and traveled.

I appreciate your perspective as an experienced teacher for several decades.
It's just irritating that there is still the tendency to equate money (lots of it/enough of it) with becoming a "better" person. Tell that to a priest who has taken a vow of poverty.

Yes, not only parents valued education as a mechanism, providing tools, to help oneself and to also help others better..but it does run through our entire extended family, cousins, children of cousins, etc. I know my sisters are working patiently with their spouses to pass on this value together to their children also.

[Irulan]

For those of you that wish you had better budgeting skills, Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace is a really terrific program/class/book resource. The fact that he's a compassionate Christian may turn some of you off, but his teaching on finances ( how to budget, get and stay out of debt, what/how to save for) is priceless. Highly recommended. His radio show is very good too.

[Crankin]

Well, even though I know I had a "privileged" upbringing, two things have influenced my thinking about the subject of "deprived" kids. First, many cultures put a huge value on education and that seems to be irrespective of financial status. Those were the parents that would actually believe you when you told them that there was something that needed to be addressed. Secondly, passing these values down is hugely important and something one needs to work at. It doesn't just happen.
When my youngest son dropped out of college to join the Marines, it was probably the worst thing that could have happened to me; not because of the military, but rather for the fact he was leaving school. It was like a slap in my face to my values. Now, after 7 years, it seems possible that he actually realizes that he might need that degree.
My DH's family gave their kids absolutely no encouragement for education. In fact, they were all told they were "stupid." DH finished college after we were married, with one kid, a business, and a house we had just bought. If it hadn't been for me and the encouragement of my parents, it never would have happened.

[shootingstar]

More than anything, my parents taught by example--they lived extraordinarily frugally and taught us to do the same. I have to admit that as stressful as it is to have DH unemployed for nearly two years now, I'm very proud that we've been able to cut expenses enough that we aren't behind on any of our bills and haven't taken on any more debt.

That's excellent sfa. Hopefully a job will materialize after the big job chase. Look where it got me: in a different city (that's colder :o ) but I can't complain about a job that gives me great benefits and personal time.

Melavi: better that your daughter tends to save rather than the contrary. My manager, who is a single mother vents abit that her live-at-home daughter in her final year of university and who makes good money working part-time, doesn't save hardly any of her money. Now that, would be abit worrisome, as a parent.

So for me to have 4 bikes, given my family background, sounds excessive. But not really, it can't beat the cost of a car and operating it. :rolleyes:

But all of this probably explains why I can live somewhere where 80% of my possessions are still in a different province, elsewhere at this time. I live VERY simply right now.
In fact, when I move to my new place, I still won't have a couch. I ended up buying a new computer first when I moved out here. My next load of stuff: is more clothing, some of my artwork to adorn place... There will not be a TV for awhile, if any.

So use your imagination... :p

[jelee1311]

Growing up we had money but my mom grew up very poor and made sure we understood the value of it. When I was 9 I got horsebackriding lessons that I eventually paid for myself by cleaning out stalls. When I got my first horse I had quite a nice stall cleaning business and paid for my saddles and more lessons. Ilearned about hard work and I learned how to save money. Unfortunatly somewhere after I became an adult I also became compulsive about shopping. I do better now but saving still eludes me,much to my husbands chagrin. We are trying to teach our 9 year old about money and its not easy. Kids these days are so entilted and as a parent its sometimes hard not to fall into that trap.I make my daughter save half her allowance for a future car. She knows how to save but she also wants the instant gratification of shopping. I usually make her wait at least a week if she wants to purchase something for $10. Then we discuss why she should get whatever it is. I also have her get rid of toys,clothes,stuff before Christmas,and her birthday and she helps decide what family we adopt every year for Christmas. I think the best thiing we did together about spending money recently was go to a local shopping district and we each could only spend a 10 dollar bill. We had fun looking and making decisions on how to spend money and she came home with $6

[tulip]

For those of you that wish you had better budgeting skills, Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace is a really terrific program/class/book resource. The fact that he's a compassionate Christian may turn some of you off, but his teaching on finances ( how to budget, get and stay out of debt, what/how to save for) is priceless. Highly recommended. His radio show is very good too.

DR + YNAB = awesome!

[shootingstar]

That's great jesteele with that $10.00 max. spending shopping spree and time with daughter. she'll probably remember that. :)

[Melalvai]

For those of you that wish you had better budgeting skills, Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace is a really terrific program/class/book resource. The fact that he's a compassionate Christian may turn some of you off, but his teaching on finances ( how to budget, get and stay out of debt, what/how to save for) is priceless. Highly recommended. His radio show is very good too.
+1 to that. I am someone who DOES get turned off when things turn out to be a soapbox for religion, but I find his book & radio show are fine. He doesn't shove his religion in your face. He shoves his financial lifestyle in your face. That's what I want.

[Crankin]

I guess it's good that a lot of you like a particular plan, but I don't think I could follow someone else's directives, knowing myself...
Frankly, the key for me was 1) having a spouse who has the same thinking about money/saving/etc. because so many people are with a partner who has totally different ideas on this topic and that is a real problem; 2) frankly what helped us the most was knowing that DS#1 was going to be going to college in X # of years. That gave us a date to be debt free by. A couple of stock option sales (not huge amounts, but enough) and DH getting a job with bonuses and other savings options for him, based on his level in the company at around the same time was what pushed us to use the added income wisely. We were living on his income without using any of mine for a few years before I quit work to go back to school. Even though we knew we could, it was scary to give up the safety net of my teaching income, which was quite good at that point. During those years, I used my income to pay for DS's college, buy him a car, and make other major purchases for our home, as well as invest. I felt really good that I could do this for my son and family. Our goal was to have him graduate without debt, and if he listened to our teachings, he would be set. Of course, going to a state school helped.
So many (all?) of my friends did not work when their kids were young. I had to. While, it's true that my personality would not have done so well being a stay at home mom, I think I might have liked to work part time. But, I made the choice because I was not willing to give up what I already had and it was important to me that my kids have the same things I had as a kid. Somehow, it all worked out, and now I can do what I want.

[deeaimond]

This thread is so apt because... later after work i am going to the bank and .... paying off my interest-charging student loan in full! :)

I'm so excited. In the last one year I saved up a substantial amt from my salary and I was wondering what i should do with it and it didnt occur to me that i should clear my debt. so silly. After I pay this i'll have not much money left and i'll have to start saving really hard again but at least i know i'm not losing paying money to the bank for nothing.

I have another loan but it's interest free so i will spread that out over the maximum number of years. It's only $200 a month so thats ok.

I don't own a house, or a car. Just 2 bicycles and a Chanel bag. I shop, and use expensive cosmetics and such. I still live with my parents :p I don't pay rent (but granted its like a... $350 a month mortgage)

I do save alot compared to my peers though. Almost 35% of my take home pay. I could do more though. So that will be my next target. :)

[TxDoc]

I've always been horrible with money.

That makes two of us Tulip - I can say I'm quite horrible with finances as well.
Regardless of whether I have way more than I can reasonably spend, or just enough - I'm never able to save a cent.
Growing up I was surrounded by more money that we could find a way to spend, invest, or give away (those times are gone unfortunately), while now I just have to work for a living, so to speak - but never in my life I have been able to save or build anything.

Ironically enough, my mother was very good with finances - and still, at some point all of our assets just crumbled. Gone, just like that.
I guess that's why I really don't care anymore. I spent 30 years with my family building more and more wealth - to just watch it all disappear in like a minute with a turn of the winds. The way I see it, it's just not worth the headaches.
Or, I guess that's just my excuse for not even making an effort to save... :rolleyes:

On the other hand, the debt burden growing on the younger generations is of concern. When I think of my students, and all the student loans that many of them have to take up in order to graduate... Sometimes I feel as if some of it is our responsibility - as if we did not build enough wealth to secure the future for them, to allow them to begin their adult lives and careers without debt. In a way, when I observe our generation compared to the one before us - sometimes I wonder if some of us have failed to meet a standard as productive citizens.
Our parents provided for the community and also provided for us, and among other things they allowed us to study and graduate and train completely debt free. Conversely, us - or at least some of us - we are failing to provide the same 'protected environment' for the younger generations. In a way it makes me feel like if I fell short on the world's expectations - or maybe just on my own...
I guess I'm not as perfect as I would like to be ;)

[Crankin]

I can relate, TxDoc. I think when you see the younger generation (Gen Y) saddled with all of that debt, it is very dependent on what circles you travel in professionally and where you live.
When I lived in AZ nobody, well hardly anybody, thought of going to a private college out of state. There were no private colleges around. Most people I knew lived at home, worked, went to a cc and then transferred to ASU or U of A. Most took more than 4 years to graduate. Here, you are considered somewhat sub-human if you go to a state school. It's all supply and demand. The private universities here have done a great job of brainwashing everyone, from upper middle class to those with little money for school that you have to go to a private college to be anything. Hence, a lot of kids are saddled with unbelievable debt from this. They think they are going to be "rulers of the world" because they went to such and such university.
When I didn't have a lot of money, I never thought of saving. I wasn't in horrible debt, but I just lived paycheck to paycheck. I think an awful lot of people are like that. On a certain level, I agree with you, because my family had tons of money, too, that was gone in an instant, because of changes in one particular industry and my dad's lack of a college degree. Sometimes we have no control. My dad grew up with servants and is now 86 and is living on Social Security. So, this is why DH and I have been aggressive in investing and saving in the past few years. Despite our late start, we are well on our way to being able to enjoy life when DH stops working. But, I do admit, I was not willing to give up certain luxuries when my kids were young. It all worked out, though.

[TxDoc]

I can relate, TxDoc. I think when you see the younger generation (Gen Y) saddled with all of that debt, it is very dependent on what circles you travel in professionally and where you live.

Yes, this is very true. My experience is limited to observing my students and residents - so what I see is the enormous debt of the student loans for medical school. We have grad students and nursing, OT, PT, RC also on our campus - but I only teach in medical school so I have really no idea what their situation is. The burden of debt on medical students is scary though.

[shootingstar]

True, cost of education is high.

"as if we did not build enough wealth to secure the future for them, to allow them to begin their adult lives and careers without debt. In a way, when I observe our generation compared to the one before us - sometimes I wonder if some of us have failed to meet a standard as productive citizens.
Our parents provided for the community and also provided for us, and among other things they allowed us to study and graduate and train completely debt free. Conversely, us - or at least some of us - we are failing to provide the same 'protected environment' for the younger generations."

My parents made enormous self-sacrifices which I'm not sure alot of parents would make these days. For instance: my parents only went on day vacation trips with family...less than 2-3 times annually. My mother spent very little money on premade clothing for herself. She must sewn 90% of her own wardrobe.

And so on.

Neither hardly ever used a credit card. So hardly any debt from there.

There are some children who are expecting big inheritances from their parent(s) and some are just cruising along. It is of course a big huge mistake to think one's parents will give you the windfall. I think the reason why myself and all siblings have saved money without going to huge debt is because we already know there's gonna to be very little money left for us after nursing home /hospice care bills are paid..when my parents will need that type of care down the road.