Ambien?

[jessmarimba]

Alright guys, I'm losing it. I know I'm posting a lot and some of them make no sense (I'm really sorry), but I have no energy to do much but sit around online. And a lot of that comes from the fact that I still am not sleeping through the night because of my back (9 weeks! I could be a new mom or something).

I have tried everything I can think of. Avoiding caffeine, chamomile tea, tylenol PM, beer before bed...haven't tried Nyquil yet but I'd really rather not.

So, has anyone had any luck with Ambien? Or any other remedies? I am considering asking for a prescription at my appointment tomorrow.

Thanks so much!

[OakLeaf]

I'd look to treat the problem directly. If the only reason you aren't sleeping is pain, let the doctor know how poorly your pain is controlled.

I know it's next to impossible to get decent pain relief from a doctor in the current climate ... but that climate makes it difficult to get tranquilizers, too, so it probably won't be any easier to get them. :mad::(:p

[Zen]

Ambien is a 'hypnotic' (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000928) and will definitely let you sleep.
Try a half of one at first.

I can understand the desperation.

[limewave]

I agree with Oak.

I was on ambien for awhile. It was awful. I'd take it usually right before bed, but sometimes DH or housework would distract me and I would black-out and do weird things and say really bizarre stuff that I would not remember the next day. Sometimes DH would have to carry me to bed. And it would also leave me with a sleepy hangover the next day. So I had to get another pill to "wake me up" . . .

:(

I hope you can get the pain under control soon. Sometimes a glass of red wine in the evening does the trick too. Take care!

[jessmarimba]

It isn't pain, exactly. Its more the fact that I am a generally a very restless sleeper, but I can't sleep...restlessly...anymore. Like, I unconsciously try to roll over, and I can't do that unconsciously now, so I wake up. Readjust. Move pillows so I am properly supported. And then nod off again. I do this about 10 times a night. I guess I want something that will encourage me to sleep deeply enough that I won't keep trying to move?

And these guys seem MORE than happy to keep throwing meds my way. I've still got two different prescriptions for percocet and they offered vicodin last week. So that's why I figure one more prescription shouldn't be too hard to get (sadly enough).

[channlluv]

After Heath Ledger's overdose was tied to Ambien, Jack Nicholson said in an interview that he had been on Ambien, too, and had actually had an incident when he woke up a couple of hours after going to bed and he was driving his car down a very twisty-turny-over-the-cliff kind of road near his home, and he never touched the stuff again.

I hope you can find another solution.

Roxy

[KnottedYet]

I took Ambien for 2 weeks, and it was rather terrifying.

I'd prefer to never take it again.

Try a hot shower, hot buttered rum, warm milk, s*x, or something, before Ambien.

[Zen]

I took Ambien, slept quite well and without incident.

[Pedal Wench]

I took Ambien, slept quite well and without incident.

Me too. I only use it when I'm anxious and anticipate a problem that night. So, for me, occasional use hasn't been an issue, and I really feel okay the next day - better than if I hadn't slept well.

[Blueberry]

Benadryl? It's not totally without risks, but if it works for you, it's much gentler than most of what you're looking at. I find that when I'm having trouble sleeping, dropping the temperature, avoiding much liquid before bed - and yes, a small alcoholic drink can all help.

[zoom-zoom]

Me too. I only use it when I'm anxious and anticipate a problem that night. So, for me, occasional use hasn't been an issue, and I really feel okay the next day - better than if I hadn't slept well.

+1. I have a standing 10mg. script, but I frequently cut the pills and take 5mg, as needed. Usually that works pretty well. When I take 10 I am more likely to do silly things like sit back at the computer and type goofy stuff that I don't remember the next AM (for some reason I like to start messing with Photoshop after taking Ambien. :p ) or raid the fridge. But it beats not sleeping and being unable to function. I have no issues with Ambien hangover or truly scary behaviors or side-effects. Mostly it feels like having a few beers or wine without the calories.

[solobiker]

I had trouble sleeping for over 1.5 years before I went to the Drs with c/o not sleeping. (I am kind of stubborn) I tried all sorts of things including natural sleep aids. Nothing seemed to work at all. They tried me on Amatriptyline for sleep. I had an alergic reaction to that where my throat closed up on my. Not a fun experince at all. He then put me on Ambien. I tried it for a bit and it did work, however I started to not feel very well during the day. I was dizzy, light headed and felt like I had the flu so I no longer took that. I also started to have a hard time talking at times and with word finding..
I did some research and talked with a friend and now I take on a rare occasion Calms Forte which seems to help...I also stepped down from a rather stressful positoin at work. PM if you have any questions because I do know how it feels not to sleep. I was sent on a sleep study at the end of last year and the results were... "YOu don't sleep at all"..gosh, tell me something I didn't already know. The rest of the results were that I never entered REM sleep and I woke up over 19 times per hour. So needless to say I feel your pain. Just don't wait like I did.

[malkin]

I took Ambien, slept quite well and without incident.


Brewer and me too.

[moonfroggy]

i have pretty sever insomnia which is i think part of some pretty sever ptsd i also have. i take Valerian to help me sleep and it really works quiet well and has less side affects than the various prescriptions i have tried over the years. i have never tried ambien. also i sometimes take benadryl when i am having a lot of trouble with sleep and it really makes me sleep. benadryl doesn't work for everyone some people get hyper on it. definitly speak with a doctor. actually it was my doc that told me about valerian when i got sick of all the prescriptions.

[itself]

More recently I tried two products from Pure Encapsulation:

L-Tryptophan
Gaba

To my surprise both work amazingly well. The Gaba calms the anxiety beautifully.

Hope this helps!

[Possegal]

Benadryl?

I doubt that will be of any help since she's already tried Tylenol PM. The PM part of that is benadryl (25 mg of diphenhydramine).

I hope you find relief soon. Perhaps it is worth talking to someone that specializes in sleep as your issue seems to be very specific. There are lots of reasons for sleep disorders, and for me that means lots of ways to handle it. I feel your pain because although I've never been a 'good' sleeper, I went through a period where I woke up every dang morning at about 2AM. Mine was depression and the minute the antidepressants kicked in, I slept through the night. There may have been other meds that would have helped me sleep, but this adressed the real issue. Hence why I think it wouldn't hurt to find someone that maybe will take an interest in trying to help you with the cause.

I have no real answers, just lots of sympathy. I hope you feel better soon and get a full night's sleep soon too!

[wnyrider]

I still am not sleeping through the night because of my back (9 weeks! ...


... I was sent on a sleep study at the end of last year and the results were... "YOu don't sleep at all"..gosh, tell me something I didn't already know. The rest of the results were that I never entered REM sleep and I woke up over 19 times per hour. ...

Long story short... I was diagnosed with Sleep Apnea. The insomnia may or may not be a result of that. My body may have been conditioned to keep me aroused to enable my breathing. On the other hand, because of health issues, my sleep position has been altered which may have contributed to the apnea symptoms. My new MD steered me into a Sleep Study. My constant fatigue and mental complaints were what prompted him to consider Apnea.

I use a CPAP/APAP machine now. This is not to say my insomnia is completely cured. I still work to recondition my body for sleep. For example, I consciously re-focus my thoughts to deep breathing into my abdomen or relaxing body parts. It is like a bad habit and you have to concentrate on breaking those contributing traits. I will say that I feel much more mentally refreshed and my body feels much better since using the breathing machine. I can feel the difference when I don't use it. It is the lack of oxygen that effects me in so many ways. I have hypopnia more so than apnea.

If you are able to have a Sleep Study I would definitely do one. It is direct method of examining your sleep patterns. It is something concrete that you can cross off your list in trying to find out the cause of your problem.

[jessmarimba]

Thanks a bunch guys! I actually did a little research last night and I guess Ambien is supposed to help you fall asleep, but doesn't really help you stay asleep. It'd probably have the same effect as the Tylenol PM, where I pass out fine but wake up feeling really drugged about 10 times a night anyway.

Pretty sure I can't stay asleep because I'm not allowed (and really physically just can't) sleep how I'm comfortable. Hopefully the doctor will be able to help today. Or maybe after a few weeks of PT (soon!) I'll have the core strength to roll over in my sleep again :)

[Possegal]

Yeah, you definitely have a distinctly different reason for your sleeping problems than what most of us here have likely experienced. So odds are what has worked for us, may not be what would work for you. I'm assuming you've tried muscle relaxants, given that your problem is ultimately your back? That was the first thing I thought of when you describe what is happening. Wondering if the muscle relaxant would put you into a deeper sleep and by nature of the relaxing of the muscles, cause you to move less while asleep. Just sort of thinking out loud.

When I injured my knee, sleeping was hard because I had this fear of what would happen when I slept and moved while asleep. I found that sleeping on my couch, where I was less able to toss and turn, actually helped me. Though I suppose sleeping on a couch had its own sleep problems too. :) I never actually had the problem that when my body was trying to toss and turn, it woke me up because my body couldn't do it. So not really much of a comparison. But that's the closest I've got. :)

[ClockworkOrange]

Hi Jess

I can't come up with any solution but hopefully your doctor has.

Now, you are doing well despite the sleep problem, I do believe you are now through the worst 2 months?

The comment about light at the end of the tunnel, well, there's loads of it. ;)

I also agree that sitting is quite literally a pain. I'm missing the hospital bed where I could prop myself to 60 degrees without wearing the brace.

The hardest thing i've had to do, I think, is change clothes. I need a shirt UNDER the brace, which involves a bunch of logrolling back and forth to pull down correctly.

See, you've come on heaps, am sure you will get into a regular sleep pattern soon.

Clock

[OakLeaf]

Medical marijuana is legal in Colorado. Will your doctor give you a script? That should help with both the pain and the insomnia.

[jessmarimba]

Ya know Oak...I was mulling that over this morning. I don't know.

Actually my doctor was next to useless. I told him that I haven't slept through the night since the surgery, since I can't roll over and sleep on my stomach. He repeats back, "so the tenderness at the hardware has made it difficult to sleep lately? If you can't sleep by the next appointment (in 4 weeks) we can inject a muscle relaxant into the muscles that go over the screws."

Ummm no, that's not what I told you at all. (P.S. nice weak dead-fish handshake, my friend). I almost cried after I left. I figure I'll try the triage nurse again in a few days, they seem like they'll call in anything.

But Clock, you're absolutely right. Woohoo, I can still walk! And a week til I can start PT and not wear this stupid brace ever again!!

(Possegal, you may be closer than you think. I'm not sure if it's a physical problem of rolling in my sleep, or if part of it IS knowing that I shouldn't sleep on my side without the pillows or on my stomach at all, and I wake up in fear)

[Dogmama]

As somebody else mentioned, a different sleeping place might help. When I had my neck fused, I slept in a recliner so that I did not have to worry about tossing & turning. Took a percoset first & usually managed 4 hours of continuous sleep. It wasn't my preferred way of sleeping but it beat hanging upside down like a bat.

I'd be cautious about Ambien, given that it has made people do weird stuff. You may wake up doing the rumba. An elderly gentleman friend of mine (80 years old) wandered outside in his underwear in the middle of the night. He woke up when the cops got there. A tad embarrassing.

Sounds like your doc is a jerk. Fatigue can exacerbate pain. I agree with the Possegal - maybe a muscle relaxant would help?

[emily_in_nc]

I took Ambien, slept quite well and without incident.

Ditto. The key is to take it right as you are getting into bed. Don't take it and then piddle around the house or (heaven forbid) go anywhere, drive, etc.... Also, for my body weight (105ish), I split each pill in half, which also saved a bunch of $ and had the same effect (zzzzzzzzzzz) :o I don't take it anymore, but it was a lifesaver in getting me through a couple of rough patches in the past when I just couldn't fall asleep due to my mind going over and over things, no matter if I did everything else right to prepare myself for a good night of sleep. Lunesta also worked well for me but was a lot more $$$$ than generic Ambien.

I have fast metabolism so pills don't last all that long on me, so I did still tend to wake up too early on Ambien. Considered asking for Ambien CR (continuous release) but was scared that might give me a hangover, so I never bothered. For your situation (staying asleep), the CR version may be just the ticket to helping you to wake less during the night.

Good luck! Waking up over and over and being uncomfortable is no fun.

[badger]

melatonin works very well for me, though I've read some conflicting reports on its safety. I just take it when I need it or when I'm traveling.

Valerian does work well, but sometimes I find there's a bit of a "hangover" the next morning.

I must be weird, because GABA actually makes me agitated. My face would get all tingly, and I get a weird sensation/taste in my mouth. I once took it to sleep and as I drifted off suddenly bolted upright with my heart racing and feeling rather frightenend. I didn't put two and two together until I took GABA again a few nights later with the same result. I guess we're all wired differently!

5-HTP's supposed to be good for insomnia, too.

[malkin]

Ditto. The key is to take it right as you are getting into bed. Don't take it and then piddle around the house or (heaven forbid) go anywhere, drive, etc.... .

ABSOLUTELY!

Do not take Ambien and then stay up waiting to go to bed until you feel sleepy!
Just go to bed.

[KnottedYet]

My doc told me to take it IN bed, and not to get out of bed until morning.

Which I did.

But I couldn't tolerate Ambien.

[redrhodie]

Have you tried anything like using a full body pillow? I can't imagine the position you're forced to be in right now. Would more propping help?

[jessmarimba]

I love the full body pillow - it has actually helped immensely.

New plan is to wait until my first PT session. If they say it's ok to relax a little with the sleeping positions then I might be ok. Like most of you guys, I'm not all that fond of the idea of taking ambien. I don't know if the CR would work, but if I'm going to keep waking up I'd rather not be drugged.

I am considering the melatonin though.

The cats have taken to sleeping on my chest too, which makes me less likely to try to roll over in my sleep :)

Thanks for all of the advice so far!

[malkin]

(((cats on the chest))))

[emily_in_nc]

Melatonin doesn't help me much when I'm having problems sleeping but probably can't hurt. It has anti-oxidant properties and may help fight cancer.

Read more here:

http://www.cancer.org/Treatment/TreatmentsandSideEffects/ComplementaryandAlternativeMedicine/PharmacologicalandBiologicalTreatment/melatonin

[Pedal Wench]

My doc told me to take it IN bed, and not to get out of bed until morning.

Which I did.

But I couldn't tolerate Ambien.

K- what couldn't you tolerate? I'm one of those who takes it without much incidence, but I want to know what problems to look for.

[VeloVT]

I have had bouts of terrible insomnia (no "medical" cause, but anxiety definitely played a role). I have used Ambien and I think it is *awesome*. When I am having trouble sleeping, I have BOTH trouble falling asleep and tend to wake up at 2am and can't get back to sleep. Ambien will put me out 20 minutes after I take it and keep me out for 7-8 hours. I wake up rested and ready to lick my weight in tigers.

[SlowButSteady]

I spent five years on sleeping pills. My doctor toggled me back and forth between ambien and restoril, changing when one began to lose effectiveness.

I also did various holistic things, herbal teas, home remedies and even took a Reike class and practiced Reike on myself.

My problem was never falling asleep, it was staying asleep. It was waking up in the middle of the night and not being able to go back to sleep. The longer things went on, the more panicky I would be when I woke up and the less able I was to go back to sleep.

Eventually he put me on the Ambien CR (controlled release) but it really didin't help either.

I hated it!!! The whole time I took it, I had a pathologically bad taste in my mouth.

I quit using it when I had severe asthmatic bronchitis (I was afraid I would die if I couldn't wake up while having trouble breathing).

Immediately, the bad taste went away AND I was able to sleep AND not panic when I woke up during the night.

I hope you find a solution, it's truly miserable to not be able to sleep.

[jessmarimba]

Yeesh - I'm up to about 5-6 hours of sleep now but only if I stay up to the point where I am beyond exhausted. But I'm a little more flexible now so it should start to get easier, I think!

[makbike]

I'm using Ambien and it does help me get a good 8 hours of sleep. I don't wake up feeling drugged or "hungover." I just have to make sure I take it at the right time so it is out of my system when the alarm goes off in the morning.

[KnottedYet]

K- what couldn't you tolerate? I'm one of those who takes it without much incidence, but I want to know what problems to look for.

Terrible mental fog and confusion, going into semi-dream states during the day, emotionally labile.

Bad stuff for me, and I had to stop taking it. It made me sleep just fine, but even at half dose I just couldn't shake it off during the day.

[Aggie_Ama]

After my Nanny died my anxiety and depression started to trigger insomnia. I could not sleep through the night, one to two hours and then wake up. I have always been a heavy sleeper so it was horrible. I was about to fall over I was so exhausted. I do not get sleepy off Benedryl so most OTC stuff was out of the question. I did try cutting caffeine out completely, camomile tea, using lavender scents in my room, trying to stay out of the bedroom for anything but sleeping and Lunasom but nothing helped. Finally we figured out my existing anxiety issues were the root and the not sleeping was just amplifying them because I was anxious I couldn't sleep!

I tried Ambien and felt drowsy the next day, I felt worse than if I didn't take it plus I had really vivid dreams including every detail of my Nanny's death, even the hospital smell and how my aunt's sweater felt. I tried Lunesta and woke up even when the dose was increased. Finally my doctor put me on trazadone which was developed as an anti-depressant but puts people to sleep. It doesn't knock me out like Ambien did but it does turn my brain down a notch so I can drift into sleep. I hope you continue to sleep better.

Oh and a funny story but scary story about people doing odd things on Ambien. An old co-worker of mine took it when he went to bed. The next morning he was looking at his bank account and couldn't figure out why he had a charge at the local grocery store from the same day, he hadn't been. He went home and found he had bought 6 bottles of tabasco sauce at 1:30 that morning (according to the receipt). He didn't remember going and said he didn't even like tabasco unless in a bloody mary which he wasn't drinking alcohol until he was off the Ambien.

[trista]

What about Lunesta? I take 1/2 a pill just about every night to cure my insomnia. Puts me right to sleep for the whole night. I feel great in the morning.

[jessmarimba]

Well, it sounds fantastic, but so far they won't give me anything. My therapist has a big note in my file ("patient would like to sleep") but the surgeon just offered to inject a muscle relaxant into my back if I still can't sleep by my follow-up in 2 weeks.

I've decided that I don't care WHEN I sleep anymore. If I'm tired, and I can pass out, it's naptime. I had been trying not to do that believing it would make night sleeping even worse, but I don't care anymore.

Thanks for all of the suggestions though :)

[Ered_Lithui]

*Hugs.* I got nothin'. I just really hope you can sleep well soon.

[emily_in_nc]

Well, it sounds fantastic, but so far they won't give me anything. My therapist has a big note in my file ("patient would like to sleep") but the surgeon just offered to inject a muscle relaxant into my back if I still can't sleep by my follow-up in 2 weeks.

That's really strange...I had no problems getting an Rx when I told my doc I wasn't sleeping and it was affecting my ability to do my job. And she'll renew it anytime. Fortunately, I haven't needed it for awhile, but it's nice to know that if another super stressful time comes, I can get an Rx. Wonder why your doc is so reluctant to give you a short-term Rx just to get you over the hump? :confused:

[Aggie_Ama]

It is odd they won't give you anything, my doctor had no problems giving it to me knowing I needed to sleep. But he wouldn't give me refills or at most one. Not being able to get sleep and desperately wanting sleep is one of the worst feelings I have ever had. It took over my brain, all I wanted, all I begged for was sleep. I just wanted to feel rested. My doctor did tell me if my insomnia continues he would like me to see a sleep doctor but mine is much more of a mental issue, yours seems very much a physical issue.

[jessmarimba]

Just an update...I just found an entire forum on a spine health website dedicated to sleeping problems. I think I'm in heaven.

[malkin]

Nice!

[Aggie_Ama]

Just an update...I just found an entire forum on a spine health website dedicated to sleeping problems. I think I'm in heaven.

Awesome news! I hope you are able to start getting some rest.

[Ered_Lithui]

I can't help finding these bot-posts hilarious in addition to supremely annoying. :P

[OakLeaf]

At least she didn't attach some random image. :D

[snapdragen]

Bye bye bot! :D

jess -- a friend of mine has sleep issues too, he's been prescribed medical marijuana. I hates to smoke, so he gets it infused in honey. A pinkie finger of honey, and it's off to bed. :cool:

Is this the spine forum you found?

http://www.spine-health.com/forum

I lived here when I had my neck surgery.

[jessmarimba]

Yep, that's it. The doc said Wednesday that in the next 6 weeks to 3months I should start to feel more comfortable and sleep better. I dread the prospect of it taking anywhere near that long. And my therapist is reluctant to push for a prescription bc she doesn't want me to NOT wake up and readjust if I'm not comfortable. It's getting hard to do anything bc I'm so tired all the time. And I'm so quick to have emotional breakdowns now...so glad I'm not in the corporate office.

[mamani]

I have severe case of excercise induced insomnia but recently right after my workout I try a 10-15 minutes dry saunna which has solved 99% of this problem!