loaner to couple: desperately seeking advice

[TsPoet]

I’m 44 and I’ve always been a selfish loner. I started espousing the value of NOT being a couple when I was 12 (or so I’m told), but I really believe that. I honestly believe that coupling up is something that we are sold and it isn’t necessary or even a benefit. I don’t want to be taken care of and I don’t want to take care of anyone else.
I’m hoping there is someone here that has experienced being a loner to being a couple that can tell me how it worked out (especially when they were old and set in their ways). I’ll happily read anyone’s thoughts on how to live with someone else, regardless of their history.
A few years ago I met a guy via bikejournal. He moved to the same town that I live in (coincidence), so we decided to get together for a ride now and again. For the last couple of years we’ve been friends, very recently our relationship changed. We went from casual friends to a whole lot more in a split second. I can’t believe this and I am flummoxed and confused and tired of arguing with myself – break up with him (I don’t want to, I really l,l,l,lo,lo,like him), tell him that I want to continue, but not so seriously (but I really don’t want to lose him), jump off the bridge and try to be a couple (but, the thought of having someone around all the time makes me a little nauseous, and if I fail then I’ll lose him as a friend).
(there are a few on here who know me, and probably know who I’m talking about and I’m hoping they will be very careful about mentioning this post to anyone, even their wonderful DH since we are all active on other bike forums and facebook friends).

[Veronica]

When I first read this I thought you were trying to loan yourself to a couple - which just seemed weird. :D

I've been with my husband since 1983 - certainly not a loner. However, if you find someone who makes you happy and brings joy to your life, I think you should enjoy it. For however long it lasts.

Why does something have to change now? Can't you continue as more than casual friends? Have you said anything to him about how you feel? If he knows you at all, he's going to know about your previous loner status. Talking about how you're excited and happy but also nervous and concerned about the future might help.

My husband is my best friend. He hears all my weirded out thoughts. :p Poor guy...

Veronica

[ny biker]

Um, talk to him about it? As in, I'm so used to being on my own that I'm nervous about being part of a couple and I don't want to mess it up.

Oops I just saw that Veronica said this much better than I did. So -- what she said!

[TsPoet]

When I first read this I thought you were trying to loan yourself to a couple - which just seemed weird. :D

Veronica

Considering my level of education... my spelling is terrible. Gave myself a good laugh anyway.

Thanks - logic is to talk to him, I'm a coward. When he gets back from RAO (Race across Oregon, he's crewing) this weekend, I'll do that. He's still here now, but I'll procrastinate until he's back.

[Veronica]

Gave myself a good laugh anyway.



Good!

Veronica

[shootingstar]

Let us know later. :)
And make you sure you do want you really want. ('Course it's nice if you knew what he wants long-term.)

Trust in the goodness of each other..whatever the end result if each of your intentions are genuine and you always communicate with one another.

I consider myself more on the loner, independent side..just a couple of close friends makes me happy and loving family also, ..plus him. :) He is similar to me,...both of us friendly hermits that like to socialize with good people. We joke happily with one another about being the slightly hermity couple.

If this makes any sense. :) I didn't meet dearie until I was 31.

[indysteel]

I was an independent 38-year old when I met my now husband. We dated from about an hour's distance for about 15 months before buying a home together last September. We married in February. It was A LOT of change in a short period od time.

The adjustment wasn't nearly as hard as I thought it might be, largely because he understands and respects my independence. He's neither clingy nor needy. We spend a lot of time together, but there's space and time for us to pursue our own interests. He also respects that I have my own opinions, ways of doing things, points of view, etc. He's never implicitly or explicitly suggested that I become something other than what I am. I love him for a lot of reasons, but this is one of the biggies.

I honestly don't feel like I've lost who I was before. I sometimes have to make an effort to stay in touch with "her," but I had to do that at times when I was single, too. Single or married, I will always a work in progress--work that I thrill in doing. I luckily married someone who supports my efforts.

I'm also more than I was before. Not because I'm part of a couple per se, but because I gave myself some room to surprise myself and grow. Loving someone and letting someone love you is a beautiful thing.

So, if you want to pursue this relationship, give it a shot. Be honest with him, and trust that you can do this on your terms. If he's right for you, he'll get that. If he's not right for you, you might still learn something about yourself along the way.

I will say this, too. If you're not ready for this, that's just fine, too. Best wishes with whatever you decide.

[Irulan]

Nicely put, Indysteel. I think one has to make allowances to grow and change, and not get locked into an idea that we had at one point that we thought was going to define us for the rest of our life.

[badger]

if the nature of the relationship changed recently, what is the rush?

You can spend time as you have before, keep dating, and when you feel you've reached another level, then you should think about living with someone. Or do you mean living with someone IN your life?

My advice is to just take it slow and don't do anything rash.

[Cataboo]

I guess I'd say - go for it, life is short - but pick your battles and keep your perspective about what's really important. i sometimes think it's easier to become a couple or move in with someone when you're younger and you really don't have a set routine or a set organizational scheme...

I've just listened to a friend rant for 2 days after she flew cross country to spend 5 days with a guy (they're all in love and the rest of that)... She felt very uncomfortable and unwanted in his apartment/space because he had a rule that the toilet seat lid had to be down, chided her everytime she forgot & kept a running percentage of her success rate, was upset she cooked eggs because he hated the smell (so wouldn't leave his bedroom till she'd cooked and eaten them and washed up), and was upset she drank milk. and would only watch certain tv shows after sunset with all the lights off, and other neurotic things. Her mp3 player couldn't be hooked to his stereo so he could listen to her music, because it would ruin the impedance. So - it was pretty obvious that he was completely not used to having anyone in his space... So... I would say, don't be that guy.

[shootingstar]

Jeepers, Catriona I hope your friend breaks off with this guy. It's just so wrong.

I can see the other side where some women are incredibly picky. One good friend who ..is in her early '70's, knows she's a neat freak. And she knows it probably affected her status...as someone who remains single.

Now, dearie is actually neat and organized against slobby me. It's a good thing we don't have young children living with us. It wouldn't be a great situation. So we have our corners of organization and mess. And common areas of relative neatness.

I believe he would be way more freakishly neat...but having had 2 children earlier in his life in his previous marriage, probably tempered this tendency big time plus makes him abit more flexible how he views the world.

We're both first-borns in our respective families...which is why we each have independent tendencies.

[uforgot]

Oh I hear you! I am such a loner. Married, divorced, but I think the marriage lasted as long as it did because we did nothing together, so it was just the kids and me and I was perfectly happy with that. After divorce a long distance relationship for 6 years, and I was content with sporadic contact. I told him that if we were ever lived in the same town I would probably have to have my own place.

I read "Party of One: The Loner's Manifesto" a few years ago, and I feel so much better about it. I highly recommend reading it. The book addresses marriage, friendship, and lots of other things from someone who understands.

http://www.amazon.com/Party-One-Manifesto-Anneli-Rufus/dp/B002ECEVMA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1279841812&sr=8-1

[Zen]

I'm sure I couldn't share a house with anyone for more than a few days.
You keep your space, he keeps his.

I don't want to clean someone elses dirt out of my bathtub.

Loners of the world unite!

Wait. That's not right.

[indysteel]

I'll add I am very happy living alone.

Most of the time.

I was, too. I'm also happy now. Thankfully, it wasn't an either/or. Granted, I'm still in the honeymoon phase, but it "domestic" life hasn't been too difficult. There were moment while unpacking (his stuff) that I thought "OMG, what am I doing? I don't want his tacky decor!" I'm sure he's had similar moments. Like today: he cleaned up my elderly cat's massive vomit all over the house when he got home from work.

That's love! :)

[Irulan]

I started espousing the value of NOT being a couple when I was 12 (or so I’m told), but I really believe that. I honestly believe that coupling up is something that we are sold and it isn’t necessary or even a benefit. I don’t want to be taken care of and I don’t want to take care of anyone else.

I re-read this just to go back to the beginning, and what really struck me is that you say you've had this belief since you were almost before a teen, and also you say that the thought having someone around all the time makes you nauseous

Maybe it's a scary thought, but you might go back to what happened in your life to plant this idea in you, and why you've clung to it so mightily. Not that there's anything wrong with choosing singlehood, but it sounds like maybe you are starting to question this long held belief, and that just maybe you don't want to screw up what could be a good thing because you've closed yourself off to that possibility. Haha, as usual I am going to suggest some personal counseling, taking a look at this core value, where it came from and if it is still valid for where you are now in your life.

[Zen]

Maybe it's a scary thought, but you might go back to what happened in your life to plant this idea in you, and why you've clung to it so mightily.

Some of us are just that way.

Like today: he cleaned up my elderly cat's massive vomit all over the house when he got home from work.

That's love! :)

Ahhh, the honeymooon phase.
My xh used to do nice things for me, too ;)

[indysteel]

Ditto

Lordy. Maybe I should end my marriage now ...before my DH stops doing nice things for me, too.

[esmorin]

So, I am only 26 and don't have any divorce war stories to share....but I do share the panic of being with only one person, and the panic if losing my personal space.

My husband I have been married for 4 years next month, and it seems like every couple of months I get this claustrophobic feeling, and consider what it would be like to be single again. But, he is my best friend. Like V said, he hear all my weird ideas and supports me (or tells me they're weird!), but he still listens. I don't always want to share everything, and in fact I have "my" stuff and he has "his" stuff, and really, I like him to ask permission to use my things. I think its respectful, and it just kind of reminds him that more importantly than us being a "we", we are a "me and him", living together in a house.

I like to think of it as: I have my life, and he has his life, and then we have a life we share. I really need to be able to have my own life, my own friends (thought we have many common friends!), my own job, my own interests etc, but then we have all of those things that we share too.

I guess the one thing that I work very hard at every day (which has already been discussed), is that I try to never tell him what to do. I believe he is a "big boy" who can make his own decisions and bear the responsibility for his own actions. And by giving him this - it not only makes makes him very happy (as a VERY un-henpecked husband), but it sets up the expectation of how I expect to be respected and treated in return. I understand that it can be hard when jealousies come into play...and I'm not saying that it's not hard work sometimes. But I just have to remind myself that him as an individual - that I love and respect - is more important than him as my 'husband'.

I get to live my own life, but he cooks for me, and I get to glimpse his cute butt when he's cleaning up our cat vomit :)

[Zen]

Lots of sick cats around here :p

[NoNo]

I have no advice, I just feel a whole lot better knowing there are other loners out there. When I see all my friends getting married and having kids (I'm 29), there's part of me that wonders if there's something wrong with me. Then there's the other part that thinks there's plenty of time left for that stuff. I'm getting to live my life and chase my dreams in a way I probably couldn't if I had a family to deal with. I also grew up watching several unhappy marriages continue because we're traditional Italians and divorce just wasn't an option, and grew up listening to my grandmother bemoan how she didn't have the opportunities women have today and if she did she'd never have gotten married!

I say go with your gut, but talking to him probably couldn't hurt. Guys, in my limited experience, are incredibly imperceptive and need to be told outright what's going through your mind.

[Zen]

Guys, in my limited experience, are incredibly imperceptive and need to be told outright what's going through your mind.

In my all too vast experience that is so true.

[TsPoet]

These perspectives are all wonderful to hear and think about. Thank you all. It is nice to know there are other loners out there. I've always been perfectly happy by myself. But, maybe being with someone else will be OK, too.
There is time.

[Catrin]

I was married once, back in the dark ages. Been divorced for 28 years - did I actually say that I am old enough to have been divorced for that long :eek:
Somewhere along the line I've become comfortable as a single person and don't allow being alone to keep me from doing much.

I will admit though, at 50 years old, I do start to wonder what it would be like to not be alone...but I don't worry about it. It would certainly be a challenge to adjust to someone being around most of the time so it would have to be someone very special. I figure that anyone I would be interested in at this point is already married/otherwise attached so I don't worry about it.

But if I were to meet a single cyclist of the right age that I am compatible with I just might give it serious consideration...

[Crankin]

I think Irulan made a very valid point. A decision you make at age 12 might not be the only way to go when you are 30 or 40 or 50. And yes, while some people are more naturally loners than others, humans generally have a need to make connections with others... not just romantic connections, but connections.
That said, you certainly can be independent and be in a relationship. And not all men are clueless. From what I see, there's a lot of clueless women, too. This is why it's important to talk about your situation to your guy. It probably does seem really scary to make this kind of change, but people *do* change.
Maybe I am not the best one to give advice here, as I've been with my husband for 31 years. No one would call me dependent, either. At this point in my life, I'd rather be with him than anyone else. Sure, I have friends, and we have very different and separate careers, but both of us tend to want to "get home" so we can be together. We support each other.
When we first started living together, he would be home before me. I would always be in a "bad mood" when I got home and would be mean to him. I thought that coming home and being "nice-nice" was a sign of weakness. Well, after he told me what I was doing and gave me a dose of of my own medicine, I stopped that!
While I know I am perfectly capable of living on my own (and I did for a few years when i was younger), I think I would be very lonely at this point in my life.

[Selkie]

I'm a loner married to a loner. It's worked for 22 years.

Follow your heart and be happy. Love is the most wonderful thing (it can last 22 years, longer, if nutured).

[colby]

I have no advice, I just feel a whole lot better knowing there are other loners out there. When I see all my friends getting married and having kids (I'm 29), there's part of me that wonders if there's something wrong with me. Then there's the other part that thinks there's plenty of time left for that stuff. I'm getting to live my life and chase my dreams in a way I probably couldn't if I had a family to deal with.

I'm married, so it's not quite the same, but I feel this way about having children. So many people (I'm 31) are focused on it that sometimes I have an "is something wrong with me?" moment, and I sit back and think... I just want to live MY life before I decide if I want to share it. I know it's not OVER for me if I have kids (like it wasn't when I got married), but I just want to be me for me (or us for us) right now. Selfish? Yes. But that's my prerogative.

To the OP, I would be honest with him as others have said. You will need time to decide if this is what you want - it is possible for something you once thought as inconceivable to become reality, but you need to do that on your terms. Just because your relationship is becoming "a relationship" doesn't mean you have to share all your space at once - be yourself first.

Honestly, finding the balance between "me" and "we" is something that is not always easy even after you've decided you're willing to do it, and it's something that you constantly adapt as your situations change (jobs, families, children, hobbies, whatever). Some of it comes naturally, some doesn't, but we all face it on some level.

Being with someone doesn't have to mean not being true to yourself. :)

[Veronica]

I'm married, so it's not quite the same, but I feel this way about having children. So many people (I'm 31) are focused on it that sometimes I have an "is something wrong with me?" moment, and I sit back and think... I just want to live MY life before I decide if I want to share it. I know it's not OVER for me if I have kids (like it wasn't when I got married), but I just want to be me for me (or us for us) right now. Selfish? Yes. But that's my prerogative.



Having children is a A LOT of work. I know I don't want to put that much effort into children. I wish more people would realize how much effort it is and that they don't really want to make the commitment, before they actually made the commitment. It would make teaching a lot easier. Maybe then NCLB might actually work. :D

Veronica

[GLC1968]

My experience is very similiar to Indysteel's. I met my husband when I was 34 and married him at 35. I had already had TWO careers before he came around. I had my own life and I was 100% happy with it. He had also already had two careers and had his own life. And he told me in our first conversation that he had no interest in marriage. Now we are (like Selkie), two loners sharing our lives. We've been married 7 years and while the honeymoon stage is definitely over, it still works beautifully.

I'm of the belief that if you know yourself and believe in yourself, the people you gravitate towards will love you for who you are. No man in my past would ever have made it through my front door if they didn't recognize and respect a strong, independent woman who sometimes needed her own space. When one did make it to that point, it didn't take us long to seal the deal (9 months to engagement, 9 more months to marriage). I guess that comes from 34 years of getting to know oneself. We had a few issues about space when we moved in together (prior to marriage and I'm very glad we did), but we worked through them.

And I also agree that both of us are still growing and learning...daily.

Just as a little background - when I was 10, I started saying that I wouldn't even consider marriage until after I was 28 and had made my first million on my own. I'm still working on that million, though! :p

Oh, so my belief is that if you talk to this guy about this, he's going to be fine with it. He likes you for who you are, right? And you've never misrepresented yourself, have you? You've been friends for awhile, so I honestly think that you are going to be pleasantly surprised. You have probably found the type of guy who is attracted to an independent person...in fact, he may be relieved to learn once and for all that you are not the clingy type! ;)

[Zen]

Loner and loaner are two very different things, especially in this context.

[GLC1968]

Loner and loaner are two very different things, especially in this context.


Indeed! Corrected my mistake. :o

[ivorygorgon]

Another loner married to a loner. We have been together for over 22 years. I think about this issue a lot. When we first got together I used to tell DH that I wanted my bed. Then after a few years I used to say I wanted my own room. Now I tell him I want my own house LOL!!!

I am not going to tell you it is easy to be with another person. I certainly don't find it so. I will tell you that it is certainly worth it, and I wouldn't give him up for anything. I will also tell you that I firmly believe that if it hadn't worked out with us, for whatever reason, it wouldn't have been the end all of my existence. I also think I could be extremely happy, overall, living alone.

There is good and bad to living alone, there is good and bad in living with another person. That is just the way life is. Don't overthink things. If it is right, it is right. I think you will know it in your heart.

[TsPoet]

We talked.
He got back a day early. I’ve got to say, any faults that he might have are shared. We discussed the past
Me “um, I’m really a loner”
Him “so am I!”
… and it all went quite well. Then I tried to discuss the future and the conversation was over – we both just sort of avoid things we aren’t sure how to answer, no answer means something like ‘I don’t know’ or ‘maybe’. But, that’s actually a good thing. I think women are future oriented more than men and it’s nice to be the girl in a conversation for once, LOL.
All in all, I’m much happier and calmer now, after reading all of your input.
Thank you all!

[indigoiis]

My DH is a loner. It took him a long time (ten years and a year and a half break) before he could open up to let me be a part of his life. The wait was worth it to me. Although it is hard for me sometimes (I am not a loner, but I am not exactly a social butterfly, either) because he is not typical or conventional in any way, and is very true to himself and quite honest - and sometimes that can get on my nerves. But I let love guide me. Love always wins. I truly believe this! If your heart wants this thing to happen, let it happen, and enjoy it. You can maintain your integrity and sense of independence while still being a part of someone else's life. Especially if you let your heart be your guide!

[RolliePollie]

TsPoet - I hope things work out great for you guys!!! As a long time singler person/loner, I'm sure I would feel some of the same hesitation that you're feeling. It's great that you guys talked and that things seem better now!

I am having the opposite issue with my best friend who is a single guy. For the first time in a rather long friendship (like years), he is seeing someone. And I haven't dated during our friendship either. Unfortunately for me, I didn't realize the depth of feelings I had for him until he started seeing someone else. Evidently I've been living on the hope that he'd change his mind about me. Now I'm feeling completely heart-broken. I can't even eat, which is not something I've ever experienced before! I think the only thing I can do at this point is just stay away from him. I just need to get over my feelings for him because I can't go through this heart break again. I wish him happiness but at the same time I am so incredibly sad for me. Wah :(

So two totally different endings to single man/single woman friendships I guess? I always thought I'd love to end up marrying my best friend. I guess sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I'm glad yours seems to be working out!!!

[shootingstar]

TsPoet - I hope things work out great for you guys!!! As a long time singler person/loner, I'm sure I would feel some of the same hesitation that you're feeling. It's great that you guys talked and that things seem better now!

I am having the opposite issue with my best friend who is a single guy. For the first time in a rather long friendship (like years), he is seeing someone. And I haven't dated during our friendship either. Unfortunately for me, I didn't realize the depth of feelings I had for him until he started seeing someone else. Evidently I've been living on the hope that he'd change his mind about me. Now I'm feeling completely heart-broken. I can't even eat, which is not something I've ever experienced before! I think the only thing I can do at this point is just stay away from him. I just need to get over my feelings for him because I can't go through this heart break again. I wish him happiness but at the same time I am so incredibly sad for me. Wah :(

So two totally different endings to single man/single woman friendships I guess? I always thought I'd love to end up marrying my best friend. I guess sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I'm glad yours seems to be working out!!!

Rollie, after awhile, men and also some women, cannot read each other's minds. Sometimes one just has to express heart-felt feelings in a nice way.

I'm sorry the realization came abit too late for you.

[RolliePollie]

Rollie, after awhile, men and also some women, cannot read each other's minds. Sometimes one just has to express heart-felt feelings in a nice way.

I'm sorry the realization came abit too late for you.


Yeah, true. I'm sure, though, that he does know my feelings for him run deeper than his for me. I've told him that I'd be interested in trying out more than friends but he wouldn't go there. I guess you can't force someone to love you or even like you more than they do and I'm thankful for the friendship we've had. Just sad now that I think it's coming to an end. I really would've loved for things to turn out differently.

[deeaimond]

I have no advice, I just feel a whole lot better knowing there are other loners out there. When I see all my friends getting married and having kids (I'm 29), there's part of me that wonders if there's something wrong with me. Then there's the other part that thinks there's plenty of time left for that stuff. I'm getting to live my life and chase my dreams in a way I probably couldn't if I had a family to deal with. I also grew up watching several unhappy marriages continue because we're traditional Italians and divorce just wasn't an option, and grew up listening to my grandmother bemoan how she didn't have the opportunities women have today and if she did she'd never have gotten married!

I say go with your gut, but talking to him probably couldn't hurt. Guys, in my limited experience, are incredibly imperceptive and need to be told outright what's going through your mind.

I feel exactly the same way NoNo!

I'm 26 this year, but in my line of work (teaching) most people are happily married or attached or pregnant. even those who are my age are all in stable relationships headed towards marriage.... so for awhile i wondered if there was something wrong with me.

I just ended my relationship of 3.5 yrs. nothing much, just that it was long distance and it didnt seem to be headed anywhere because to be with him i'd have to drop my entire life and move to another continent.

Of course breaking up was hard, but i've realised since how much i sort of lost myself when i was in the relationship because so much of what i did was for US rather than for MYSELF. I learnt something valuable from this break-up. Be more selfish and think of myself more.

Here, most people pair off. its strange to actually want to be a loner. or if you're unmarried in your 30s people look at you strange.

I love these posts for all the thoughts and ideas that TE ladies put up. so many life experiences. Thank you all for sharing.

[Jane Honda]

After I had been divorced for just a few years (and two very horrible relationships named Mike) I was happy being alone. I am a loner at heart. I LOVE LOVE LOVE my alone time, whether its biking, riding my motorcycle, or my horse, driving... etc. You get the idea.

When Eric and I found each other, we moved in after 6 months. (I hedged for three of those months after he asked me too.) He allows my alone time, I allow his. He is a person I actually WANT to be around. He's the right man for me.

You have found someone you enjoy. Go with it! Just communicate and be sure that he understands you need your 'loner time', and that it has nothing to do with him. It's healthy.;)



Oops, I just saw your response that you guys had a 'scussion.

[arielmoon]

I guess I'd say - go for it, life is short - but pick your battles and keep your perspective about what's really important. i sometimes think it's easier to become a couple or move in with someone when you're younger and you really don't have a set routine or a set organizational scheme...

I've just listened to a friend rant for 2 days after she flew cross country to spend 5 days with a guy (they're all in love and the rest of that)... She felt very uncomfortable and unwanted in his apartment/space because he had a rule that the toilet seat lid had to be down, chided her everytime she forgot & kept a running percentage of her success rate, was upset she cooked eggs because he hated the smell (so wouldn't leave his bedroom till she'd cooked and eaten them and washed up), and was upset she drank milk. and would only watch certain tv shows after sunset with all the lights off, and other neurotic things. Her mp3 player couldn't be hooked to his stereo so he could listen to her music, because it would ruin the impedance. So - it was pretty obvious that he was completely not used to having anyone in his space... So... I would say, don't be that guy.

OMG, I think I am that guy!!

And I am a loner. I think if I met the right guy I would feel differently but now I am happy this way.

[OakLeaf]

I'd just add that "loner with loner" creates a big opportunity to become overly dependent on each other.

I've just skimmed through this thread and don't remember who it was whose DH felt that her life was interfering with their together time ... DH and I struggle with this, and we're both retired! IME it's got nothing to do with how much time you actually have or spend with each other, and everything to do with how much you rely on each other for human contact and intellectual stimulation.

For all we go over and over it, I don't seem to be able to explain that normal people have jobs, normal couples have one job each, and my 2-3 hours a week job and 12-20 hours a week training are NOT what's keeping DH from doing what he wants to do.

[indysteel]

For whatever reason, I want to clarify that I wasn't a "loner" before I got married. I was single, which is different. I had (and still do) any number of deeply gratifying friendships and a strong social circle. My biggest challenge as a newlywed has been finding enough time to nurture my marriage, as well as those friendships. Both are vitally important to me.

Thankfully, I do have DH's support in maintaining those friendships, but I find myself pressed for time and energy. Over the last couple of months, I've tried to make a greater effort to invest more energy into my friendships. Admittedly though, it's never going to be easy, especially given that I live about 25 miles south of most of my friends now. But having my husband in my life--as wonderful he is--simply does not answer all of my emotional or intellectual needs. I didn't want or expect it to.

[shootingstar]

I'd just add that "loner with loner" creates a big opportunity to become overly dependent on each other.

I've just skimmed through this thread and don't remember who it was whose DH felt that her life was interfering with their together time ... DH and I struggle with this, and we're both retired! IME it's got nothing to do with how much time you actually have or spend with each other, and everything to do with how much you rely on each other for human contact and intellectual stimulation.

This is something, that if it's the right chemistry between 2 loners, they still carry on some of their "loner' activities by themselves or with other friends, along with shared interests as a couple.

I am always intrigued to hear of some people who are "lost" when they can't stand their partner taking a business or bike trip for a few days/weeks. And these are couples who don't have children at home anymore (or never had any). And I know it's not really a trust issue. It's because the person is more social, feels alone.

[TsPoet]

I'm very glad I posted this initial plee, just because of all of the answers and perspectives. I'm not the oddball I thought I was.
I hated, then loved this video. In the end, I just loved it.
"how to be alone" by Tanya Davis
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7X7sZzSXYs

[Crankin]

Shootingstar, I am one of those people who doesn't like it at all when DH goes away. And you are right, it's because I am very social and we spend tons of time together, which fulfills social needs. When he goes away, I make lots of social plans and the time goes quickly. Otherwise, I don't like the emptiness and quiet of the house. I like my "home" or quiet time, because I have and had a career where I am dealing with difficult people. I feel like my home is my oasis, and pretty much why I don't want to move to the city (besides the cycling!). I like the quiet atmosphere, but I don't like being alone. When I was single I was always out with people, even though I lived alone for 3 years.
My DH traveled so much during fifteen years of our thirty year marriage; now I wouldn't like that at all. But, I was working and had growing kids during that time.
I'm the one who is always making plans, whether to ride, go out to dinner, travel, etc. DH likes to putter around the house, as he is very mechanical. But, he is pretty social, too. It's not that I don't go places alone, but, I get lonely very easily. I wonder if it's because I was an only child for 11 years; the way I dealt with that was by having tons of friends and having sleepovers/going out with friends every Friday & Saturday when I was a kid.

[evangundy]

Hi TS - the best words of advice I have is to keep the lines of communication open, be totally honest, but don't try to push for or against changes in the relationship too fast. You have been friends for quite awhile, so you really do know each other well. You are both used to being on your own, so don't rush changes. There's nothing that says you "have to" move on to the next step of becoming a couple, unless it's what you both want.

I personally know quite a few couples who have been together for years, but live in separate homes. They see each other exclusively, overnight at each other's places, vacation together, attend family gatherings as a couple, but by living in their own places, they still have that alone time and keep their own space to themselves. It can work that way for you, if that is what you both want.

Part of making a relationship work, is compromise, but it has to be by both people. Take small steps, see how it feels, then decide whether to back up, stay there for awhile, or take the next small step....... wash - rinse - repeat :-)

Edna (ps: knowing you both, I'm thinking it's gonna work out just fine)

[shootingstar]

I personally know quite a few couples who have been together for years, but live in separate homes. They see each other exclusively, overnight at each other's places, vacation together, attend family gatherings as a couple, but by living in their own places, they still have that alone time and keep their own space to themselves. It can work that way for you, if that is what you both want.

Part of making a relationship work, is compromise, but it has to be by both people. Take small steps, see how it feels, then decide whether to back up, stay there for awhile, or take the next small step....... wash - rinse - repeat :-)

Edna (ps: knowing you both, I'm thinking it's gonna work out just fine)

We're were like that TS, before we both moved to Vancouver. I bought my own home about 6 months before he entered into my life. I had sort of 'given up' meeting any special guy in my life.

But after knowing him more, it was really a matter of independence and personal pride for me to keep, live in for several years and pay for my own home. I'm so glad I did this..it was important to me ..for self-growth.

When there is no biological ticking...you have tons of time to know each other. :)

[evangundy]

So, curious minds wanna know - how are things going? Yes, it's none of my business, and you don't hafta tell me. Just wondering because I care.
Edna
PS: do you have any idea how hard it has been to not tell anyone else? But I have been good, and told no one :-)

[TsPoet]

So, curious minds wanna know - how are things going? Yes, it's none of my business, and you don't hafta tell me. Just wondering because I care.
Edna
PS: do you have any idea how hard it has been to not tell anyone else? But I have been good, and told no one :-)

Thanks, I knew I could count on you, or I wouldn't have posted.
We aren't a secret, He told Mandy and ? the other guy who crewed for Alex - and that was about the same time I figured it out, LOL.
Actually it's going quite well, we went up to Mozama last weekend and spent 3.5 days together, that's a true test at this point in my life.
We just got back from riding our bikes to grocery shop. He bought 2 cases of beer. Gotta love a guy who can carry 2 cases of beer on an xtracycle up the hill we have to ride up.

[Irulan]

you guys having a party?