SI Diva Gel Flow

[Catrin]

My demo saddle was installed this afternoon, and I took my beloved LHT immediately for test ride. Only had 22 miles planned today (34 miles tomorrow morning), but it was interesting.

First of all it was not discomfort free - and my fitter had warned me that there would likely be sit-bone discomfort, and perhaps other kinds as this is a very different kind of saddle. He was right.... and while a little of the discomfort was up front - it wasn't from my girly bits, but more to the sides. I suspect some lubrication will take care of that, and it wasn't all that bad.

I have 2-3 weeks in which to test the saddle before I have to decide one way or another. If the weather doesn't interfere with my brevet training schedule, in three weeks my mileage will have increased to about 50 miles - and all of this should be a great test of this beautiful saddle.

I really want this saddle to work, but time will tell.

Anyone interested in a gently used Brooks-17S :rolleyes:

[Catrin]

I have put 81 miles in 3 rides on the demo Gel Flow saddle. Yes, there is some sit-bone discomfort - was told to expect that and it seems to be easing somewhat. There is some pressure on the, well, front to the sides of my girly bits that approaches discomfort - but I think that is only because of the new saddle design - it disappears as soon as I step off the bike.

I find that I am not shifting my butt around every 3.2 nanoseconds like I was on the Brooks even when there is discomfort - but I did note something this morning after my ride and I am afraid I don't know a delicate way to word this.

There was a little girly bit discomfort this morning after my ride, but it wasn't in the labial area as with the Brooks. This was more forward than that - well - it is my cl*t. Sorry for the directness, but couldn't think of a way to get around it. I did not notice anything during the ride, it was afterwards that I noted it.

I am trying to think what could be going on with my saddle - with the full cutout, that would cause discomfort in such a small area? Everything else is fine...perhaps my saddle is tipped down a tad too far? Perhaps just part of adjusting to a new saddle design? I know there isn't a perfect saddle out there.

I REALLY want to like this saddle - and it is light-years better than the Brooks - I just don't want to ignore something during the testing phase that could be a warning sign - it isn't cheap.

[OakLeaf]

Could be the shorts shifting around and chafing (which could be that they're too small, too large, or just the wrong shape); could be the saddle is too wedge-shaped (see, I don't say "pear" any more ;)) and pushing you forward of the cut-out. I'm inclined to think it's more the shorts, if you're not noticing a problem until you're off the bike. This might be the time to try a dab of lubricant, only on the area that's bothering you, if you're not using any yet.

If it's saddle tilt, it's more likely that the nose is too high rather than too low, especially if you're not noticing extra weight on your hands.

[Catrin]

Could be the shorts shifting around and chafing (which could be that they're too small, too large, or just the wrong shape); could be the saddle is too wedge-shaped (see, I don't say "pear" any more ;)) and pushing you forward of the cut-out. I'm inclined to think it's more the shorts, if you're not noticing a problem until you're off the bike. This might be the time to try a dab of lubricant, only on the area that's bothering you, if you're not using any yet.

If it's saddle tilt, it's more likely that the nose is too high rather than too low, especially if you're not noticing extra weight on your hands.

Thanks for the idea - I did not think about my shorts chafing me - and there was no discomfort at all during the actual ride (unlike my Brooks). I did not use any lubricant at all this morning, so will try that next time and see if that helps. In a couple of weeks am going to finally pick up some bib-shorts - and while the price makes me want to stick with PI, I think that I want to try another brand.

I am not noticing any extra weight on my hands or anything, and can move around just fine on the bike.

I still don't know what shape the Diva Gel Flow is ;) but it doesn't look/feel wedge/pear shaped to me.

[Catrin]

Hmm. I tried this saddle with similar results. I've got it listed under 'for sale' now!

I also had pretty bad chafing all around the area you describe, as well as pain. It felt okay while riding. Standing up afterward and the recovery time were a big problem.

How wide are your sit bones? Mine are 125 mm from point to point, with an outside distance of 160mm. I concluded that the cutout was so wide in the back that the inside edges of the sits were 'falling' into the cutout from both sides. So, it was more like sitting on something only as wide as the cutout. The bones just weren't supported.

I understand how you feel. I wanted to like this saddle too, but I think it requires someone with both a wide distance point to point, and full clearance of the actual cutout.

FYI, I just got a men's Specialized Toupe 143 from my LBS.

It's amazing so far. I can't even feel it! It's almost ridiculously thin.

It sounds like it might be different for me - I have no problems with walking or recovery afterwards, it was just that one spot that got chafed - but what a spot to chaff :eek:

The jury is still out though - I've a 40 mile ride planned for Saturday morning plus whatever work and the weather will allow me to get in before then. I will see if lubrication will help and see what I feel like after the 40 mile ride.

[Catrin]

Good Luck!

Thanks! This is a demo saddle, so it is great to be able to try it out for a couple of weeks. It sounds like my sit-bones might be more narrow than yours at 110mm - but I have never been confident with that measurement. It came from a fitter who has since turned out to have been incorrect on other things. Don't know how he could have gotten this wrong though - regardless I want to measure myself again.

I know the sit bones are supported because I can feel them on the saddle - they got sore :p

[Catrin]

Thanks for telling me of your experiences with the saddle. The 40 mile ride Saturday will be the real test of the Gel Flow- though it did fine Saturday with the 34 miles. It was the 25 miles on Monday where there was a little chafing - which had me wondering. One more weekend and we will see...

[Catrin]

Thankfully my LBS tests saddles, but of course not all brands. They also test Fisiks (spelling?) and WTB saddles. There is a 4th brand but I can't think of the name. I prefer to test the saddles they have first - though am still hoping this saddle works.

I assume the "regular" Diva is the same width? I am going to re-check my sit-bone width in the next couple of days. I just don't believe they are that narrow. If I can feel them on the saddle, then the saddle has to be supporting them...

[Owlie]

Muirenn, how wide is the cutout in back? I'm trying to decide whether this saddle might work. The SI saddle I have is certainly wide enough for my sit bones (131 point-to-point, 151 at the outsides*), but it feels like there isn't quite enough cutout if I want to play around in the drops.

*I'm taking the measurements with a grain of salt, since I used my mom's ancient tape measure. (It's almost as old as I am!)

[nscrbug]

I definitely felt my sitbones supported on the Diva. And it felt fine until I was done biking. Then they hurt EXACTLY as you described! Pretty sure the culprit is the unusual cutout plus a too wide saddle. If your sitbones are at least as narrow as mine, then the cutout and size probably affected your comfort. If they are only 110 mm, then I'm positive! Even on a Diva without a cutout, I suspect you need a much narrower size. The Diva is 160 mm!

Check out this link:

http://www.specialized.com/specs/spec.jsp?speccode=bodygeometrysaddles&tablewidth=400&cellwidth=350

If you scroll down to the chart, you'll see your recommended saddle is either the 130 or 143. I just bought a 143 and can't believe how perfect it feels. Keep in mind I just got it, but it is so different from the Fizik (155 mm), Terry (160), Diva (says 160, but actually narrower by about 2 cm than the Terry), and SI Lady SLK I tried!

SLK may have been okay except for the fact that the 'split' disappeared when I mounted it to the seatpost. The two halves squished together so there was no cutout. Could sit upright, but couldn't go into the drops, that may have been due to it being an older model though. Not sure. SLK was only 143. But it had other issues obviously.

I actually made playdoh out of flour, (one part salt, two parts flour, mix with water until it's right for modeling) rolled it about an inch thick, covered it with aluminum foil so it wouldn't be sticky, and presto! instant butt mold! Very easy to measure both inside diameter and outside. Keep in mind that when you lean forward, the sitbones come closer together. There are a lot of threads on here that describe the best sitting position. (Oakleaf and Knotted Yet come to mind. Thanks guys, you're info has been priceless!).

Sorry, don't mean to go on and on. I've become saddle-obsessed!

Can you be a bit more specific on the measurements for playdoh? Like...how many cups of flour did you use to get a good butt reading? Would 2 cups of flour and 1 cup of salt (seems like a lot) be sufficient? Thanks!

Linda

[withm]

every time I see this thread I think it's yet another Diva Cup thread. :rolleyes:

[Veronica]

NSCRBUG,

I notice you have the Lady SLK. Do the two halves of yours end up squishing together resulting in really no cutout? Or was the one I tried a little different? The one I tried was some leftover stock, and did appear to have a narrower 'split' in between the two halves. Other than that, I thought it was a great saddle.

Thanks:)

Not NSCRBUG, but I have 3 of the SLKs and none of mine squish together as you have described. I spend a hefty chunk of my time down in the drops with no issues. I almost always ride in tri shorts, wet ones during a race :D so not much padding. Frankly, I wonder if overly padded shorts are the cause of many "saddle" woes.

Veronica

[Catrin]

I just measured myself with the play-dough method. Apparently my original fitter was wrong about this as well - instead of being 110 mm, they are actually 133.5 mm, or 5.25 inches. That is closer to the Gel Flow.

I did notice that my sit-bones are not in line with each other - so my measuring tape was angled to reach from center to center. I also measured without angling the tape and it was extremely close to the same measurement of course.

I had a ride tonight, though it was the shortest ride I've had on that saddle it was much more comfortable afterwards - indeed I noticed no pressure at all while riding and no repeat of Monday's...problem. However it was only 10 miles, so will see what happens this weekend.

Owlie, the cutout in the back is right at 4 inches. Does that help?

Diva Cup info here (http://www.divacup.com/) Glad that a rather large surgery two years ago removed this concern for me :)

[withm]

Diva Cup. Diva Cup.

Should I know what that is?

My imagination is coming up with some interesting ideas. :eek:

LOL it's an alternative to Tampax. There are MANY threads about this. Fortunately I no longer have any use for these things

[Catrin]

Yes, I googled it after I posted. Eeeu! Gross. I can't believe I made it 40 years without ever hearing about this. But I guess they are often used after pregnancy? I don't have any children.

Diva Cup. The mind boggles. No offense to anyone, but sounds gross!

It does, doesn't it?

[nscrbug]

NSCRBUG,
I notice you have the Lady SLK. Do the two halves of yours end up squishing together resulting in really no cutout? Or was the one I tried a little different? The one I tried was some leftover stock, and did appear to have a narrower 'split' in between the two halves. Other than that, I thought it was a great saddle.




Funny you should ask that...because after I read your post it dawned on me that my SLK does the exact same thing! There is absolutely NO separation of the two halves...whatsoever...so basically, there is NO cut-out. I also started another thread awhile back, about another issue that I was having with my SLK. The left side had started to sag or drop lower than the right side. Did you experience this with your SLK saddle? I know that the 2 sides are supposed to "flex" with the rider's pedal stroke...but it got to the point where I was actually able to feel a "ridge" where the left side had dropped down and it was causing some chaffing and pain. I contacted the place where I bought it (gottaridebikes.com) and mentioned it to them and they suggested that I send it back to their distributor for warranty evaluation. But when I contacted the distributor directly, they made it sound like it was my fault and that the ONLY way the saddle would become uneven like that is if the rails were bent (which they are not). So I never bothered sending it back to them...figuring that they would just tell me there is nothing can do about it anyway. I ended up relegating that saddle to my "back-up" bike for now.

Linda

[KnottedYet]

every time I see this thread I think it's yet another Diva Cup thread. :rolleyes:

No! No! AAAAAAAGH!
<fingers in ears> La la la, I'm not listening!

[Catrin]

I figured that today's 40 mile ride would prove one way or the other about this saddle.... and it was fine. NO problems at all after well over 3 hours in the saddle. I am happy.

I guess that my butt just needed to get accustomed to the new kind of saddle! Pity the Brooks didn't work for me, but if I felt this good after 40 miles, then it should work fine for even longer rides.

Thanks for all of the input!

Oakleaf, in the end, I think that you nailed it. I did use a dab of lubrication on that single spot - but frankly I don't know that it was actually needed. I will keep doing that though until I am confident it isn't really needed. Thanks!

[Catrin]

Yeah, the 40 mile ride was fine, but getting a little numbing when riding multiple days in a row. Saw my fitter today and I am going to demo the regular Diva - he thinks the full cutout might be creating more pressure on the sides - and it is true that my stock Trek saddle doesn't cause girly bit issues (it has a cutout - just not a full one).

Fitter also put my bike on his fork-mounted trainer and he spent over an hour measuring and tweaking and measuring some more...come to find out the saddle itself was uneven on the rails - he fixed that. He also moved my saddle up 2 centimeters. It may be the uneven saddle was the culprit - but time will tell tomorrow as I have a 50 mile ride scheduled if the heat doesn't get me first. So time will tell.

[makbike]

I have the Diva saddle on my Orbea Diva and I must admit it is the most comfortable saddle I've ever used. No issues whatsoever with this one. I absolutely love it. I hope the new saddle works for you. Hang in there you will find the one that best works for you.

[Catrin]

I have the Diva saddle on my Orbea Diva and I must admit it is the most comfortable saddle I've ever used. No issues whatsoever with this one. I absolutely love it. I hope the new saddle works for you. Hang in there you will find the one that best works for you.

Thanks - I really hope this works. The Diva Gel Flow feels great regardless of the length of the ride - as long as I skip a day between rides. This is not an option. To prepare for the brevet I really need to ride 4 days a week whenever possible - so I can't skip a day after each ride.

My hands feel great though, even after 4 hours on the bike and without road bars! Arthritis in my palms was the main reason for the conversion and my very upright position. I know that conventional wisdom says that I shouldn't be comfortable over long distances with my bike configuration - but so far so good - and the current saddle is light years more comfy than the Brooks - even on the third day in a row :D

With 50 miles planned this afternoon - in 94 F heat :eek:, a short ride possible tomorrow and a hill ride planned for early Sunday morning - I will know by the end of the weekend what effect the changes had.

[kermit]

Take a look in the favorite saddles thread. I wrote about my max flite after trying all the women's specific wider saddles. I am really happy with it.

[Catrin]

Has anyone noticed if the regular Diva is slightly more pear-shaped than the Gel Flow? I am now testing the regular Diva and it looks that way to me. However it could be an optical illusion as well.

It was fine for a 25 mile ride - but that was just 25 miles. Tomorrow is a 50 mile ride, and the third day of riding in a row - so that should tell me something. The gel flow was fine as long as I took a day between rides... no numbness the first day regardless of distance, a little bit the second day... LOTs on the third. We will see.

[KnottedYet]

Has anyone noticed if the regular Diva is slightly more pear-shaped than the Gel Flow? I am now testing the regular Diva and it looks that way to me. However it could be an optical illusion as well.


Pear or T only matters if you have a problem with the saddle when you ride.

The ride reveals all!

Ride lots. (of times. of bikes. of saddles.) :)

[Catrin]

Have you ever tried Specialized?
Just hope you don't end up feeling obligated to buy from them even if they don't have what you need.

Good luck on:

As the Saddle Turns, the Ongoing Saga :cool:

The Gel Flow was almost perfect - it was the multi-day consecutive rides that revealed the problem. My fitter wonders if the cut-out added just enough pressure to the sides to cause the problem that did develop.

They also demo Fisik(spelling?) and WTB saddles.


Pear or T only matters if you have a problem with the saddle when you ride.

The ride reveals all!

Ride lots. (of times. of bikes. of saddles.) :)

Indeed :) Today is the 4th riding day in a row with the most mileage. Yesterday I was aware of the saddle when I started but at some point it seemed to disappear beneath me. Felt great when ride was over - but just 25 miles. 50 miles today will reveal more :)

[KnottedYet]

I like Fizik saddles. Can't remember which one I had, but it was the very best of the saddles that didn't fit me right.

It was less wrong than the others? Ummm, not as bad?

Anyway, if I couldn't have a leather saddle I'd probably be looking for another Fizik. Even though it didn't fit, there was almost no padding so my c-to-c was able to juuuuuust get onto the saddle. No squishing, but minimal sit bone contact and it was easy to miss the saddle when I scootched around.

[Catrin]

The Fizik I had was too wide and I ended up sliding forward until my crotch rested on the neck of the saddle.

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Today did 4:40 in the saddle and this saddle was better. Not saddle "nirvana" after that long in the saddle (not that I expected it to be), but better. We will see how it feels tomorrow if I am not too sore to ride after today.

[Catrin]

I like Fizik saddles. Can't remember which one I had, but it was the very best of the saddles that didn't fit me right.

It was less wrong than the others? Ummm, not as bad?

Anyway, if I couldn't have a leather saddle I'd probably be looking for another Fizik. Even though it didn't fit, there was almost no padding so my c-to-c was able to juuuuuust get onto the saddle. No squishing, but minimal sit bone contact and it was easy to miss the saddle when I scootched around.

I noted also today that my LBS had a SI Flite demo saddle. I could try one of the Fizik saddles if my SI experiment fails.

I do have a little soft tissue soreness after today's ride - but I was in the saddle a long time. There are much longer rides to come...and at some point I figure there will be discomfort regardless of the saddle. No numbness at all though - which is an improvement. This could be the chamois though, all of my shorts have the same PI 3D chamois, I need to try a thinner version.

[Catrin]

I have ordered the SI Lady Gel Flow - I think that it will work for me.

[malkin]

I'm just wondering if the people that came up with the name "Lady Gel Flow" are the same people that came up with the name for the "iPad."

Sorry. I know. I am incorrigible.

[Catrin]

I'm just wondering if the people that came up with the name "Lady Gel Flow" are the same people that came up with the name for the "iPad."

Sorry. I know. I am incorrigible.

Then there is the saddle I settled on - the Lady Gel Flow...

[malkin]

Well, I hope the saddle works out for you, no matter what they call it.