Folding Bikes

[featuretile]

So, I just started to think about getting a folding bike for travel. It seems that I don't want to leave home without a bike..... Anyway, the Bike Friday's seemed so expensive that I was looking at the Dahon's. I tried the 4 best ones today. None of them did I really like enough to buy. They have a one size adjusts to all design, and the one that was most like a road bike (Sport Pro TT) was way too long in the top tube for me to even get out of the parking lot. The lightest weight one (MU SL) had only 9 speeds and a skinny, hard as a rock saddle that you could not change out, but was pretty fast at 20 lbs. The MU 24 had 24 speeds but was quite heavy and used twist shifters. The Vitesse P18 was the most comfortable of the lot. It has 18 speeds, but was also heavy, had trigger shifters and the guy in the bike store could not get it to fold up correctly. I felt like the Goldliocks and the 3 bears.

Does anyone have any of these bikes and can compare them to Bike Friday? The only Bike Friday I have tried was a friends 20 year old model that is really heavy and didn't run very smoothly. Any other suggestions of different folding bikes that are lightweight and handle like a road bike and a reasonable price?

[kmehrzad]

I have a Dahon Jetstream P8 and two Bike Fridays (New World Tourist and a Pocket Rocket). By far I like the Bike Fridays. The Dahon is a quicker fold and is okay for shorter distances, but the Bike Friday is great on long distance rides. It's very comfortable and, in my opinion, worth the extra money. Plus, it's built to your specifications.

[NbyNW]

I have a Dahon Speed Pro TT. Is that what you tried out? I don't know what a Sport Pro is. I'm 5'1" with a short reach and I've been able to adjust the bike so that the reach is comfortable for me, and comparable to my regular road bike. I have the bullhorn handlebars angled up slightly to mimic the angle of the brakes on my regular bike, and the base is as close to me as the joint will allow. You need a hex wrench to make that adjustment, so if the shop left you alone to play with the quick releases you would not have been able to adjust for the best fit for you.

The Speed Pro TT and Mu SL both use a Kore I-Beam seat post. You can change the saddle, but you won't have as many options as you would with a standard seat post. Alternatively, you can get a rail adapter and you could put any seat on the bike.

http://us.dahon.com/accessories/2007/kore-rail-adapter

I switched out the seat on my Speed Pro TT for a Biologic Velvet Saddle, which I can no longer find on the Dahon site, but thorusa still has them, third from bottom at this link:

http://www.thorusa.com/dahon/accessories/seatpost.htm

It's worked very well for me. Another place you can look for I-Beam compatible saddles is www.sdgusa.com

I love my Speed Pro TT. It's light and nimble. When I was commuting to work on it (about 11 miles round trip), it was able to handle Seattle's hills without a problem (gearing felt slightly different from my touring bike), and I could safely stash it under my desk during the day. Plus it made a great conversation piece while waiting at stop lights.

Longest ride I've ever done on it is 24 miles if I remember correctly.

If I ever get up to doing a century I think it would be fun to do it on my Dahon, especially if it were a ride that involved travel.

I haven't tried any of the other makes of folding bikes, but I'm sure you'll get feedback from people who have.

[NbyNW]

One quirky thing about my Speed Pro TT, which is a 2007 model and I'm not sure if it has been addressed in newer bikes is that it came with Shimano Tiagra brifters. The Tiagras have a trim-shift feature (I'm guessing most brifters do?) which is designed to work with a derailleur rather than the internal hub gear. If I accidentally do a trim-shift instead of a full shift, unsettling noises will come out of the hub and peddling will not feel smooth. It's not dangerous or anything, it's just a sign that you haven't fully shifted. Once I figured out what was happening I just made sure that I pushed the gear lever all the way in and that solved the problem. Just something to be aware of if you get a bike with that configuration.

Advantages to internal hub gear: you won't accidentally cross-chain, and you can shift while at a standstill, which is nice if you're stopped at the bottom of a hill.

[Sylvia]

You might be able to pick up a used BikeFriday. BikeFriday will sometimes have them on their site. I've seen them on ebay occasionally, and in addition, the bike shop where I ordered mine sometimes has used BikeFridays as well. I'm getting my bike at Dublin Cyclery, I know that's a bit of a drive from Soquel, but you could call them ahead of time and see what they have in stock and what their prices are.

This is their website. http://www.dublincyclery.com/

[roguedog]

I was looking to get Xootr's folding bike. It's gotten really good reviews and I like that they've used standard parts. And it's really reasonably priced. From the gallery you can see folks have totally customized it to their needs. there are racing ones, touring ones, and all the ones in between.

Seems flexible and reasonably priced.


http://www.xootr.com/folding-bicycle.html

[featuretile]

It's great to get so much feedback!

NbyNW - Obviously the person at the bike store knew nothing about the Dahon Speed Pro TT (not Sport Pro - oops). All he did was change the height of the seat. This is not my LBS. No one carries them except this place about an hour away. I am 5'3", so I guess it might be possible to fit, but I hate to buy one without trying and the problem is that at this bike shop the price is full retail, and you can get one online for substantially less. I don't really want to use up all their time getting it adjusted and then not buy it there. Not sure where to go with that. I also found your saddle changing info a good thing for the MU SL, since again, they did not know. But, I'm still not in love with these bikes and they are not inexpensive.

I will still keep trolling Ebay and craigslist for used Bike Fridays.

roguedog - I looked up Xootr again. I had not considered them because they don't fold up as much. But when I looked again, they could be disassembled further if you went on a plane. The gearing is still to high, but you can add a front derailleur and faster tires. I put in some questions to them and will see what response I get and let you know. Does anyone have one of those? I really feel hesitant to just order one without trying it out.

[NbyNW]

Wow, that's unfortunate that the bike store was not more knowledgeable about the products they are selling! How do they expect to sell anything? Maybe you can wait until they are clearing out their inventory for next year and go back and try the bikes again.

Also understandable about wanting to find a bike you love for the right price and wanting to be fair to the retail store. Can be tricky with folders since they're regarded as a niche item.

If I lived closer to you I'd let you take mine out for a test ride.

Another good resource is www.gaerlan.com. They have some good articles on their website and I have bought parts from them. They're about 4 hours from you, so they may be worth a phone call. They may also have other brands, but it seems that Dahon is their focus.

[PscyclePath]

I found a used (ahem... "previously loved," according to the BF folks) Tikit through the network at the LBS, and it's done pretty good service for the three trips where I've used it. What I really liked was the ease and speed of folding it; what was frustrating was that another LBS around here had whittled one of the studs down on it a hair... that's also the stud that latches the frame together when you fold it ;-)

I was also very surprised at how well it rides. It currently curls up and sleeps under my desk at the office, for quick noon errands and random rides around the business park here...

[galfromdownundr]

Full disclosure here - I work for BF. But I was a customer for many years prior and went thought the same thought processes. (Like, what a GOOFY bike, get me a Gary Fisher Reynolds 503 with S&S couplers NOW!)

If you're considering spending hard earned cash on a new, used or abused BF, it's valuable to get some informative background reading. Since I've prepped most of the articles on the BF site, I've culled the highlights of the past 10 years in one convenient article:

http://www.bikefriday.com/decadeoffridays

I'm sure you will know precisely what you want to do after digesting all that!

A few other notes ...

I believe TE's Susan O. has/had a BF so you could always ask her for an unbiased opinion! Here's a story she sent some time ago:
http://community.bikefriday.com/node/1345

My own 13 years of travel on a BF (since 1997, 5 years before joining the company):
http://www.galfromdownunder.com/bfgallery

So as to the point about expensive, I actually think it's a good investment, even on my very modest bike industry salary - then again, I don't have hubby, kids, mortgage, car, expensive addictions. Frame has a lifetime warranty - it breaks, BF fix or replace it.

I never just tell people to buy a BF, even though I work for them. Even the sales people at BF will grill you carefully to see if a BF is the best choice for you as opposed to another bike, because a small local company paying local labor costs has to have happy customers to survive.

It's a a matter of prioritizing what's important to you and choosing a folder on that basis. E.g. Ride quality, size/speed of fold, weight, price, packability, easy to get parts for, customer service, made in America/China/elsewhere, etc etc. The right choice will pop out of doing that exercise. Get a piece of paper and rank the importance.

With BF, the ride quality - we're talking touring/road bike feel here - has always been #1. That's the main reason why serious cyclists ride them: http://www.bikefriday.com/famous

The fold always has been secondary, until the tikit was invented. Some versions of it - e.g. Speeding tikit, are getting pretty nice: http://www.bikefriday.com/roundup08
- actually, this is the bike I'm riding at the moment.

In short, BF is not some kind of miracle machine but a wide variety of people have managed to do a lot of cool things with it:
http://www.bikefriday.com/littlewheellongway

Hope the background reading helps.

Lynette Chiang aka Galfromdownunder @ BF (remotely)

Lynette Chiang aka Galfromdownunder | www.galfromdownunder.com
Check out my Traffic Cone Bag™ | www.galfromdownunder.com/trafficconebag
Bike Friday Customer Evangelist | www.bikefriday.com
Phone 541-513-7711 (USA)

[tulip]

No comparison. While you might be fine on a Dahon on short rides (I used to have one), longer rides will likely be a different story. I ride my Bike Friday Pocket Rocket Pro for longer club rides, organized rides, and multiple-day supported tours. I can't say enough good things about the bike. I also have a Luna and it's a hard to decide which bike to ride. It took me a year to pay for my Bike Friday, but I am so glad I have it.

(hi Lynette! 2009 PAC Tour white PRP here!)

[MartianDestiny]

Question out of curiosity:

You mentioned travel. Have you considered a bike with couplers or another breakaway mechanism other than folding? I can understand the appeal of a folder, especially for commuting concerns, but wondering why you ruled out other "break down" mechanisms if it's primarily for other types of travel concerns?

[Jaclyn]

I currently own two travel bikes - a Pocket Crusoe by Bike Friday and a Co-Pilot S&S coupled Co-Motion Tandem. I've traveled quite a bit with both (as well as my partner's Ritchey Breakaway 'cross bike). There are advantages and disadvantages to both, but I really like the S&S system. I like it so much that I'm sending one of my older bikes this spring to be retrofitted with couplers. If you have a bike that can be retrofit, the cost is around $600-$900.

Another option (if you are tall enough) is a Ritchey Breakaway. My partner has a Ritchey 'cross bike and loves it.

[Thorn]

(Hi Lynette! Another 2009 Pac Tour-ite, but I rode a "big bike" so you probably didn't notice me :) )

I own an S&S coupled bike, although I seriously gave thought to a BF. I went S&S because I'm an odd fit and I had a relationship with the frame builder for the S&S.

That said, if you're the least bit mechanically dis-inclined, you'd want to lean toward the BF. I am a slow and methodical mechanic, but the BF's were packed in 1/2 the time of my S&S -- much less disassembly. I love my S&S and, for me, the packing/unpacking is part of my vacation catharsis; others may disagree.

[DebW]

Packing an S&S coupled bike is a 1-2 hour job which includes (for me anyway) removing the right crank, both derailleurs, front brake, handlebars, seatpost, then padding every frame tube, and fitting everything very carefully and precisely into the case. Reassembly is quicker, and cable adjustments aren't required if you have cable splitters.

[Jaclyn]

Thanks, Deb, for sharing your packing times.

For the Bike Friday, I remove the front wheel, stem, handlebars, seatpost, and pedals. I use foam pipe insulation to protect the frame and the skewer for the fork. There's usually a bit of struggle to figure out how to arrange everything in the travel case. It takes me about 20 minutes if I've done it recently, and 30 minutes if it has been awhile. Reassembling goes a faster but then there's a lot of fiddling and adjustments the first ride or two.

For the tandem, we have to separate cables (we use cable splitters) - including a drag brake cable, remove (and deflate) both wheels, two handlebars, two seatposts, four pedals, one derailleur, one crank, and misc. accessories. We use a lot of pipe insulation, too. We work together and it takes at least an hour. We allow two hours, minimum, because it is stressful if we are rushed.

I'm having Bilenky retrofit the S&S couplers to my Carl Strong ti bike. I guess I thought it would pack in only 30 minutes, but based on your experience it sounds like it will take much longer than the Bike Friday. That's good to know!

There's been a discussion about traveling with tandems over on the Hobbes list. In my experience, the airlines are increasingly weighing (50 lbs max) and measuring (62 inches width x height x depth max) luggage. At LiveStrong Austin last fall I was very disappointed to see my fellow fundraisers charged as much as $350 to travel with their bicycles. The large number of bikes that weekend (both Livestrong and a Triathlon in Austin) resulted in a huge amount of oversize luggage fees. Other people report that they don't get charged; I don't like to worry about not enjoying my bicycling vacation due to problems checking in my bike(s).

[Thorn]

30 for a BF, yep...that's what I was seeing, but I'm with Deb in the 1-2 hours. However, I don't disassemble quite as much. I don't take off the crank or the front derrailleur, but I do take the fork out. We pack DH's teeny little bike the same way--not that he needs quite that much disassembly but just for consistency.

As for flying, you're not carrying a bike, but "sports equipement" or "mechanical parts" Some of the airlines will charge you even if you're within size and within weight if they know the box contains a bike (as apparently they did in Austin). My next flight is Southwest where they actually state that Bike Friday's and S&S bikes are standard luggage if less than 50 pounds. I've never flown them before but their bike policy (and pricing) had me switch this time.

[Tri Girl]

Apparently American Airlines will accept a bike as a checked back if it's 50 lbs or less and not oversized. That's what I heard from 2 friends (of friends) who just flew to Europe. Don't know firsthand if that's true or not...

[galfromdownundr]

No comparison. While you might be fine on a Dahon on short rides (I used to have one), longer rides will likely be a different story. I ride my Bike Friday Pocket Rocket Pro for longer club rides, organized rides, and multiple-day supported tours. I can't say enough good things about the bike. I also have a Luna and it's a hard to decide which bike to ride. It took me a year to pay for my Bike Friday, but I am so glad I have it.

(hi Lynette! 2009 PAC Tour white PRP (http://www.galfromdownunder.com/galleries/WEB-desertcamp09-gallery/pages/IMG_2754.html) here!)

Cool bananas Julienne! Ooops, blew your cover ...

[featuretile]

I've been getting lots of great information. After trying the Dahon's, I'm not impressed enough to get one. A woman in my bike club has a Pocket Rocket and she is going to let me try it. I really need 2 bikes, one for me (5'3") and one for my husband (6'2"). Would consider used.

I've also had some really good emails from Xootr Swift folks. I had not considered them at first because the bikes have only 8 speeds and reviews said that they don't fold as small. The rest of the reviews are really good. They come in 3 sizes for the very reasonable price of $679/free shipping. However, on closer looking at the website, they have a front derailleur kit that can double the speeds and give good low gears. They have skinnier Schwalbe tires that can be substituted for less weight and more speed. And if you disassemble them more, they get smaller. There is a shop in Berkeley that carries them, so some time next month I am going to go up and take a look/ride (after I try the Pocket Rocket).

I don't think I want the other types of bikes mentioned because I don't want to have to totally dismantle the bike to fit it in a case. One thing that I don't get is that when I read the folded dimensions of the bike and go look on the web for a hard shell suitcase (the one that seems to be recommended is the Samsonite Oyster), the measurements are less than the folded bike dimensions, so how do they fit? I also think the Bike Friday cases are really expensive.

I just want to be able to bring a bike on a plane so that when we visit kids back East or go on a trip, we would not have to rent overpriced, heavy hybrids or spend nutty amounts to ship our road bikes. I also think it would be really fun to take them on a cruise ship and get off and ride away. Probably most of you don't go on cruise ships. We started because my sister-in-law lives in Alaska, and it was cheaper to take a cruise there than to fly and stay in hotels. Now, we have figured out how to use them by only going on cruises that stop in ports every day (in the cheapest inside cabin), skipping the 'shore excursions' and using them as a moving hotel. We went on a river boat cruise last year, and I was just dying to have a bike as the boat docked out of town and we had to find buses and change currency.

Anyway, I'll let everyone know if and when I get something.

[moderncyclista]

I've been eyeballing Bromptons for awhile now too. Would love to get a folding bike at some point. *sigh* Someday.

[NbyNW]

If you're looking for a bike for your husband, too, there's a largish BF Pocket Rocket listed in the For Sale forum!

[ClockworkOrange]

For short rides with no hills AND something that will fit inside my Mini Convertible, I am thinking about getting a Strida folding bike, second-hand on ebay.

Real quirky, I guess you love 'em or hate 'em.

Wonder if anybody has ridden on one on this site?

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