Issues with Hand Pain - not sure what to do?!?

[blueeyesaz]

Hi All,

So the run down is this...I got my Trek Madone 5.2 WSD a little over a month ago (I am new to cycling). I had some minor adjustments made when I first picked up the bike from LBS, have ridden 2-4 times per week (5-30 miles each depending), just had another more complete fitting on Wednesday and am still experiencing hand pain. I have searched all over several forums and it seems as though most people say "if your hands hurt then your fit is all wrong." Before I jump to that conclusion, I would just like to understand if some hand pain in the beginning is normal just because I'm not used to riding a road bike or if it really could be something more serious.

Saddle? Started with a Selle SMP TRK with a huge channel which after a couple of weeks I took off because I am convinced cut-outs/channels may not be for me, was putting way too much pressure and pain on the girly parts up front. Now I have the saddle the bike came with back on, a Bontrager Inform RL WSD. This saddle isn't horridly uncomfortable, little hard on the sit bones but maybe I could get used to it...but it is 160mm wide and when I went in to a LBS to measure my sit bones the other day they said I should fit the 143mm. Anyone think a narrower saddle might make a difference?

Stem length? At my fitting on Wednesday the lady at the LBS switched my stem from an 80mm to a 90mm as she said I looked a bit off with the shorter. Hand pain didn't increase, nor did it decrease.

Riding position? Since most people start telling you your fit is wrong or something needs to be adjusted...could it just be that since I'm so new to all this that I don't know proper form with my body? I try to change hand positions frequently (every 30-60 seconds or so) but maybe I'm not doing it enough or maybe I'm not making a conscious enough effort to shift my body weight back or relax my arms?

One last thing, the LBS I bought my bike from said I could trade out the 160mm saddle for the 143mm if I like but the shop is an hour's drive from where I live so I would hate to go all the way up there with my bike to switch the saddle just to find out that I hate it or it makes no difference.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated!!! Thank you.

[Biciclista]

your hands shouldn't hurt. your hands aren't designed for weight bearing, so 'toughening them up' is not possible.
One thing you can do is move your hands around A LOT. make sure you are not locking your elbows. Make sure you are not leaning on your hands.
Are you doing core exercises? That's what is holding your body up so your hands don't have to do it.
Now, do you have the shallow handlebars? shorter shifters?
do you know what you are doing that hurts (like applying the brakes, maybe?)
I don't think getting a smaller saddle is going to improve your hand problem.

[Biciclista]

ps on long rides i get some hand pain too. I think it's poor posture and age..\
pps bontragers are famous for not being comfortable.

[blueeyesaz]

your hands shouldn't hurt. your hands aren't designed for weight bearing, so 'toughening them up' is not possible.
One thing you can do is move your hands around A LOT. make sure you are not locking your elbows. Make sure you are not leaning on your hands.
Are you doing core exercises? That's what is holding your body up so your hands don't have to do it.
Now, do you have the shallow handlebars? shorter shifters?
do you know what you are doing that hurts (like applying the brakes, maybe?)
I don't think getting a smaller saddle is going to improve your hand problem.

I have caught myself locking my elbows on occasion but I'm trying to make sure I'm not doing that when riding, it's never for more than a moment or two. I am doing core exercises and I play tennis A LOT, hopefully that will get better with time? I do have the shallow handlebars and the shifters are shorter as they are designed for smaller hands being the wsd. Braking and shifting doesn't hurt as I'm just extending my fingers when doing that, it's mostly just when riding, when I'm "resting" my hands on the handlebars.

What throws me off so much on trying to figure out the cause though is that I have had a couple of 25-30 mile rides where my hands haven't significantly bothered me, but for instance the other day I went out and not 10 minutes into my ride my hands were hurting so bad I had to cut it short and head home.

[Biciclista]

be patient. People wiser than me will respond.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

I'm certainly not wiser than Mimi, but I'll respond anyway!

I find that when I don't pay attention, I tend to sag my weight down on my hands because it's the lazy thing to do when daydreaming along. I can get almost all the weight off my hands when I tilt my pelvis back (as in tipping my tailbone down and belly up). This makes me more aware of distributing my weight more evenly between hands, feet, and seat. I also sometimes make a game of riding with just my fingertips lightly touching the bars, sort of training my core to do more to hold me up.
Perhaps this might help you.
Sounds like with all that tennis and such, your hands should be quite strong enough already. Good to avoid the elbow locking thing at all costs though- as soon as you lock your elbows, all your torso weight tends to go right onto your hands.

Good luck!

[Loraura]

My hands used to kill me. And go numb. To the point that I have permanant (I'm guessing?) numbness in my pointer fingers.

My bike was TOO BIG.

Also, my core was weak, so all the upper body weight fell straight to my hands, rather than my abs and back muscles supporting me.

Also, in desperation I switched to Giro Xero gloves that have no padding.

The combination of a smaller bike, core strength, and less padding has just about eliminated my hand pain.

I also have to remember to move my hands around a lot, and sometimes ride with one hand while I shake out the other and restore bloodflow.

[Thorn]

Not wiser, but different experience. After my bike fit I was having problems with my hands and wrists.

Prior to the new bike, I had almost all my weight on my butt--the bikes I was riding were too long. My current bike better distributed the weight between my bit and hands.

So, first, a new situation of weight on hands, but, the final fit had a small kink in the bend between my arms and hands. No amount of relaxing the elbows could take it out. The end result was pain in the hands.

I played around with hand positions trying to figure out what I could do that would generate a straight line between my forearms and hands. In the end, I put on slightly wider handle bars and a stem that brought the bars up a short centimeter. No more hand pain.

This may have no relation to you, but I would suggest not just looking at hand position, but the relationship between the forearm and hand--make sure you're not pinching a nerve.

Oh, and glove/handlebar padding? Are you getting pressure points from your gloves? Some gloves really bug me--and, some new models of old favorites are now off the list. Look at where the pain is and then look to see if there are any external factors causing the problem.

[bmccasland]

Have you had a proper fitting at your LBS? This should take more than 15 minutes.

Cork wrap your handle bars? I've had to do this on Doctor's orders as I managed to pinch a nerve. Nothing quite like your hand no longer functioning - didn't hurt, but didn't work either. The cork wrap under regular handle bar tap will pad your bars.

Different gloves?



Hope your hands feel better.

[Cataboo]

Could you describe the hand pain - just general hand pain or? The only hand pain i can think of getting while riding is between my thumb and the rest of my hand sometimes. I'll just make suggestions based on what helped with my wrist pain - and some of this really may have already been addressed with your fittings, so sorry if it's way off.


Things you can look at - the angle you hold your hands on the handlebar - it should be neutral, not bending back the bar.

Move your hands while riding - don't keep them in the same place, periodically flex them.

Gel padding under your handlebar could help.

Getting a handlebar that has a wide flat spot instead of a round bar to hold on to may help - I use FSA wings.

Don't rest your weight on your hands - if you saddle tilts forwards some, this may cause you to put weight on your hands.

[HappyTexasMom]

I find that when I don't pay attention, I tend to sag my weight down on my hands because it's the lazy thing to do when daydreaming along. I can get almost all the weight off my hands when I tilt my pelvis back (as in tipping my tailbone down and belly up). This makes me more aware of distributing my weight more evenly between hands, feet, and seat. I also sometimes make a game of riding with just my fingertips lightly touching the bars, sort of training my core to do more to hold me up.

+1 to all this. I finally "clicked" with what people meant when they said your core should be holding you up. What I found with me is that if I position myself properly so that that's happening, I *can't* reach my handlebars (I can just graze them with my fingertips). So either I need to change my handlebar adjustment, or my bike is just too big. I've got handlebars on their way right now that I'm hoping will help.

Hopefully your bike being too big/handlebars inproperly adjusted shouldn't be an issue since you've had it professionally fitted!

[NadiaMac]

something to consider about the saddle-- some cut-out "crotch saving" saddles have a "valley" between the padded bit that contacts the sit bones and nose. The selle italia atola is an example of this-- it has a diamond shape cutout, but also this valley that you can see if you look at the saddle from the side. Kind of a dip in the saddle, which I believe is supposed to help relieve pressure. Anyhow, I had some hand/arm discomfort with my newish custom bike (that otherwise fits fantastically well) and it was traced to my saddle. although the width was good for my sit bones, I tended to slide into the valley when riding (so, sliding a bit forward, off the padded bit) and compensated for this by holding myself in position farther back on the saddle with my arms. A new saddle that is more stable has eliminated this issue.

Anyhow, just another factor to consider, along with reach issues (stem, bars (reach to brakes, etc) as noted by others in the thread

[indysteel]

I, too, would be interested to know exactly where the pain is and is it accompanied by any numbness either during or after the ride.

I got a new custom bike this past March and have struggled with bad hand pain. From my experience, hand pain can be (1) an indication that you aren't balanced between front and back. Ideally, you want most (but not all) of your weight behind your crank. (2) an indication that your reach and/or saddle-to-bar drop are off. Unfortunately, figuring out where in space your handlebars should be is no easy task as it is a function of saddle drop, saddle for and aft position, the spacers under your stem, your stem length and rise and your handlebars themselves; (3) a function of the bars themselves, how they are designed and tilted, the bartape, and your gloves; (4) an indication that you have a weak core.

Sound complicated? It is. I've been to two fitters and changed nearly every element I mentioned above, and my hands (while better) still hurt. :(

[blueeyesaz]

As far as where the pain is located, the best way I can describe it is on the bottom of my palm and a bit it the sides on the opposite side of my hand from where my thumb is. Not a tingling or numbness, just plain ole pressure and soreness.

I'm thinking it is probably a combination of my posture/laziness, not switching my hand position enough, and my gloves may not be the best for me (looks like they have stretched some and the gel pad is now farther over to the side of my hand as opposed to on the meatier part of my palm).

I really don't think my bike is too big for me as I rode several before I purchased this one both bigger and smaller and this felt the best. I am 5ft 4.5in tall, 140lbs and ended up getting a 50cm frame.

Looks like I will head up to LBS today to at least trade out saddle, can't hurt right? I'll have him take his best guess as to what might be causing the hand pain while I'm there. I got my actual fitting at a different LBS than where I bought my bike.

[indysteel]

As far as where the pain is located, the best way I can describe it is on the bottom of my palm and a bit it the sides on the opposite side of my hand from where my thumb is. Not a tingling or numbness, just plain ole pressure and soreness.

I'm thinking it is probably a combination of my posture/laziness, not switching my hand position enough, and my gloves may not be the best for me (looks like they have stretched some and the gel pad is now farther over to the side of my hand as opposed to on the meatier part of my palm).

I really don't think my bike is too big for me as I rode several before I purchased this one both bigger and smaller and this felt the best. I am 5ft 4.5in tall, 140lbs and ended up getting a 50cm frame.

Looks like I will head up to LBS today to at least trade out saddle, can't hurt right? I'll have him take his best guess as to what might be causing the hand pain while I'm there. I got my actual fitting at a different LBS than where I bought my bike.

I'd add that hand pain can result from too cramped a set up, too. That was largely by problem. My handlebars needed to come up and out from their original set up. So my reach was both too low and too short. I actually do think we've made some progress with my issues. The nerves in my hands were SO irritated though that it might be some time--and maybe the winter break--to find complete relief.

In any event, the only thing you can really do is experiment. Change a bit at a time.

Good luck!

[Loraura]

I am 5ft 4.5in tall, 140lbs and ended up getting a 50cm frame.


That sounds about right for sizing unless you have an unusually short torsoe with long legs. 50cm effective top tube (not necessarily printed frame size) is what fits me best at 5'3''.

Even very small changes in saddle height and bar height make big difference on pressure to the hands. A stem with a bit of a rise can make a big difference compared to a 90 degree stem.

I often practice just riding with my hands hovering over the handlebars, not touching, but just hovering there. I can feel it in my core that my muscles there have to kick in to keep me in that position without having my hands to support me.

Short reach shifters also work well for me. I rode standard reach 105's for several months, then got a new bike with Short Reach shifters, and it's fabulous:

http://www.coloradocyclist.com/product/item/SSFHAWTT

For use with double or triple gearing configurations
Weight: 490 g./pair
10-spd compatible

Ergonomic innovation is probably more critical to the higher standard of the Ultegra levers than the added gearing. The ST-R700 was designed for people with smaller hands. By the use of a 4-degree or 8-degree shim, you can reduce the reach respectively by 10 or 20mm.
They are Ultegra level in quality.

I used to get blisters on long rides between my thumb and pointer finger even with gloves on with the 105's.

[Kymber]

I've put 200+ miles on my new bike in the first month and have tried all sorts of things to keep my hands from tingling, hurting then going numb altogether. More core exercises helped some, but didn't solve the problem. Finally I lowered the bike seat, which only bought me a strained hamstring and upper glute:eek:

On my THIRD bike fitting, a guy at LBS finally looked at my shoulders and said, "your reach is 2 inches too wide on either side, I need to cut your handlebars."

TA-DA! a shorter handlebar and moving my seat back and up just a smidge completely fixed my ride. 20 mile trip w/o so much as a twinge or a tingle!

Bike fitter says clue is that your arms should never reach out in a V to the grips. Now I reach straight forward to the grips with my elbows slightly bent.

I don't know if this works for everyone, but it might b worth considering.

[Kano]

Core strength, Saddle position -- angle, and gloves. Those are the things to think about, IMO.

After fitting the other day, my hands are bothering me again. My saddle (Bontrager Inform that I deliberately purchased, btw, and which has made a big difference in my comfort level in a good way, even if Bontrager saddles are "famous" for being uncomfortable) was too low. Corey raised it about 2.3cm. (almost an inch!) I knew this needed to be done, though I didn't expect that much change, and that it was going to affect the all kinds of other things too, which is why I took it to the fitter. My bar height was adjusted too, by changing the angle of my stem 2 degrees. He says that's it -- put it any higher and downhill will be scary. Living where I do, with hills to cope with on every ride, I don't need descents to be any more spooky.

Anyway, that changes my upper body angle, so I've got to get still stronger in the core to help myself support that change. That's okay. I can do that. I've got a few other muscles to strengthen too, and my trainer is delighted to devise new tortures for me!

I realized something else today though -- my new "favorite" gloves are NOT my favorite gloves anymore! I've been wearing PI symphony gloves (http://www.pearlizumi.com/product.php?mode=view&pc_id=336&product_id=1236296) for a couple of years now. They've worked well for me for the most part. I wore size large two seasons ago. Last year, medium was better -- the large would slide on my hands and I had all kinds of interesting pain. This year, I needed to buy some in Small. One day, I forgot them when I went on a shop ride, so I figured no biggie, I'll pick up another pair -- I'm at the LBS anyway, eh? I bought the medium. They felt good when I put them on.

Shouldn't have done that. They were pretty blue ones, and until this morning, they've been my favorites because they're the pretty blue ones.

My hands have been bothering me a bit lately, but now, with the change in my bike's set up, and the new body position to get used to, my hands have been BOTHERING me! My gloves are "sawing" into the "webs" between my fingers, the padding is TOTALLY in the wrong places, they're just all wrong. Back to my yellow gloves! I really do like my blue ones, and I did like having two pair, darn it!

Good thing tonight is a shopping night with my daughters. I'll add one more stop to my list, before I meet them, since the bike shop isn't their favorite place to go like it is mine!

Karen in Boise

[Crankin]

The horrible pain I had in my hands when I started cycling was purely from gloves with gel pads. I cannot take even the tiniest amount of padding or gel in my gloves. It is very hard to find gloves with hardly any!

[Seal]

You might want to try a horseback riding store to find gloves w/out gel. They will probably be spendy and have fingers but no gel.

[kenyonchris]

You might want to try a horseback riding store to find gloves w/out gel. They will probably be spendy and have fingers but no gel.

Riding gloves may work, but you might find them too restrictive. The hand position for riding a bike is more open than holding a rein. And, because of the need for riding gloves to take a lot of friction and abuse, they tend to be pretty thick and reinforced in the finger area.
I don't like any gel under my bar tape, and I don't like cycling gloves because of the gel pads in them. I am a full body sweater and that includes my hands and arms...the gel pads wind up creasing in weird ways.
The best I found were driving gloves. They are much, much thinner than riding gloves without the reinforcements that come with riding gloves. They are pricey, tho.

[mtbdarby]

Here's just an alternative thought for those that do have the bike dialed in and still get hand pain. C7. I had a LOT of hand pain after a road crash a couple years ago and had my bike dialed in, went to PT, orthopedic hand dr., cortizone injection, etc. Then I went to my chiropractor. After an adjustment to my neck the swelling in my hand went away and so did the hand pain. FWIW...

[pinkpedalpusher]

Some possible solutions to your hand pain:
1. If the nose of your saddle is tilted down to much it puts more weight on your hands.
2. You could try raising your handlebar height or rotating your bars so the hoods are higher to see if it's more comfortable.
3. Adjusting your position on the bike will help, but it will take some time for your contact points to get accustomed to riding. You shouldn't have to adjust your hand position every minute. If you have a genuine wrist issue you may try some of the elastic wrist bands that weight lifters use for added support.
PPP

[Triskeliongirl]

Sometimes hand pain is caused by having your position on the bike being too far forward, which results in too much weight being supported by your hands. Rather than giving you a longer stem, I am wondering if pushing your saddle back may have done the trick. Its hard to know without seeing you on the bike, but that is what I would try next if it were me.

Also, make sure the angles of the brifters and bars are such that there is no bend in your wrist as you contact them. It should be like a smooth handshake.

[redrhodie]

Sometimes hand pain is caused by having your position on the bike being too far forward, which results in too much weight being supported by your hands. Rather than giving you a longer stem, I am wondering if pushing your saddle back may have done the trick. Its hard to know without seeing you on the bike, but that is what I would try next if it were me.



Pushing the saddle back will change the position of her knee over her pedal.

[Triskeliongirl]

Pushing the saddle back will change the position of her knee over her pedal.

I am well aware of that, but it will also take the weight off her hands. The ideal KOP postion can vary with the individual. Generally for road riding (not time trialling) a position of 0-2 cm behind the pedal axle is ideal. Being further back is better for hill climbing, being further forward is better for flat time trialling (that is why time trialists will have their knee even in front of the pedal axle).

So, unless her knee is already 2 cm behind the pedal axle, which I doubt it is but of course anything is possible (I did say its hard to do this without seeing her actual position), then I think shifting her weight further back on the bike is the next logical thing to try.

[redrhodie]

I am well aware of that,

But the OP, new to cycling, may not be. I thought it was useful info she may not know.

[nscrbug]

I too, have been struggling with hand/wrist pain and numbing. I ride a 51cm Cervelo Soloist Carbon (I'm 5'6", 148lbs) with a Terry Butterfly Tri gel saddle, that I was professionally fitted on. I informed the fitter that I had hand/wrist issues on my previous bike (which was too big for me - a 54cm Trek 2100 WSD), so I was really hoping that it would be eliminated with the combination of a "pro" fitting and a correctly sized bike...but unfortunately, that hasn't been the case.

The pain and numbness will vary from ride to ride. Sometimes it comes on early into the ride (10 minutes), and other times, it may hit about an hour into the ride. My rides are generally between 50-80 miles, so when the pain strikes early...it makes for a long, miserable ride. Actually, to be perfectly honest...I can't recall a single ride where my hands didn't go numb or were in pain at some point...so, basically every ride is long and miserable! The pain and numbness can be so severe at times, that it makes it difficult to shift and brake because I cannot feel my controls. :eek:

For gloves, I'm currently wearing a pair of Spenco Ironman T.2 Elite, size small...which were fantastic for about the first 6 months. But now, they feel uncomfortable. I'm getting that "sawing into the webs between my fingers" feeling that someone else mentioned, and the padding no longer seems sufficient. I'm guessing they are just worn out and I need new ones, but I'm not sure if I should stick with the same glove or not. A riding buddy of mine suggested I look at the Specialized BG Gel gloves. I've also tried other gloves over the last 2 years, including various styles of Pearl Izumi and Specialized gloves, as well as a pair of Castelli gloves...none of which felt as good as the Ironman gloves.

I'm so frustrated at this point, that I'm ready to try a different fitter just for another opinion. I hope the OP is able to get her hand pain issues sorted out...because it can really suck the enjoyment out of a nice ride. :(

Linda

[lunacycles]

Generally for road riding (not time trialling) a position of 0-2 cm behind the pedal axle is ideal.

That's a bit generalizing, I would say. For example, if you have any kind of low back issues or hamstring tightness, being behind the pedal axle is usually to be avoided....

...back to the OP. It is really hard to know what is going on given the info you have been able to provide. I often find hand pain or numbness, like Indysteel suggested, is by having too short of a reach, generally combined with too big of a drop between saddle height and grip (handlebar) height. This results in too much weight being borne by the hands, holding the body upright. But, again, it is really hard to know without knowing more specifics about your body and position.

My suggestion is to go somewhere completely unaffiliated with the shop who sold you the bike, and get a complete, professional fitting. Get a fit not influenced by the shop or the brand you have a relationship with. Just because you are 5'4" does not mean WSD is for you. WSD is definitely geared for those shorter in the torso relative to leg length. Is that you?