intro and saddle prob

[Suechoccy]

Hi,
This looks like a very supportive and useful forum! I've been out of racing for 20 years, back in my teens I was women's 100 mile time trial champion in the UK but then gave up the sport for many years and now in my mid-40s am having a return to the sport and am really enjoying it.

Got a snazzy PlanetX tt bike and loving being back a part of it all, meeting old friends, making new ones (the UK domestic timetrialling scene is very friendly at grassroots level and a real close community too).

Only got one problem though, fairly common one ... aargh, the saddle. I want to ride a 100 this year but at the moment, I can just about stick 25 miles due to soft tissue pressure/friction and eventual raw spots on front of labia. Owww. Didn't have this problem is 80s but then riding position was slightly different - tribars weren't invented so we had bikes with drop handlebars so maybe we weren't so tilted forward onto front of pelvis maybe? Although I look at an old black-and-white photo of myself and I seem to be as tucked forward, pelvis-wise, as I am now. And I don't have a problem holding the modern triposition either, it doesn't seem extreme - in fact it feels more comfy, with the armrests, than the old drops position did.

Started with a Fizik Rondine, stuck that through about 18 races, 10s and 25s, in hope of "getting used to it" but gave up on it as too hard/narrow a couple of weeks ago.

Tried a borrowed WRB Rocket V (man's saddle) in a 10 and it was lovely. Sadly the man wanted it back and it was an older model. I bought a Rocket V but although it looks the same, it doesn't quite feel the same. Ridden it in a 10 (fine) and a 25 (fidgetting after 15 miles or so, ended up sitting to one side to relieve pressure which is daft when you're supposed to be racing).

Stuck an old 1980s Selle italia Turbo man's saddle that I found in the shed on it last night and sat on it but straightaway knew that was a no-no, too hard and unforgiving a nose.

My touring bike, which I commute on and sometimes do evening 10s on, ha tribars but is a more relaxed position with higher height for the tribars than the tt bike, so pelvic angle probably less acute. I have a cushy, wide, heavy Madison ladies' saddle on it and don't have a problem even over 80 mile training rides.

So I've put that on the PX for tonight's 10. It certainly spoils the aerodynamic looks but if it gives my crotch relief, it will be worth it. No idea if it will work or not... It's very wide at the back so I suspect at 180mm it will interfere with my hips and introduce a new and different problem, but it has a nice wide softly cushioned nose at 5.5-4.5mm.

Any more ideas very welcome. I'm loathe to pay out 40-80 quid to buy saddles that may or may not work, but don't know any places in UK that do a try-before-you-buy scheme. Small comfort is knowing many of my fellow female time triallists have gone through 4, 5, 6 saddles before finding one that works.

I've also tried moving the Rondine and the WTB saddle forwards, backwards, up, down, tilted, level. The WTB has been a partial success and I can possibly work on it a bit more.

I'm wondering if I should relook at the Fizik range, perhaps the Arione, with its 30cm length although the nose looks narrow... the Selle Italia Ladies Gel Flow seems to get good reviews but are those reviews from leisure-ladies or serious racing ladies in tribar position I wonder.

Cheers!

Sue

[papaver]

Professional female cyclists mostly use the Selle Italia Diva Gel flow or the Lady Gel flow. I find the Diva slightly better because it's not too soft.

if you have pain in the front you better point the front of the saddle a little (1/2 cm) downwards...

Hope you'll understand my Dunglish. http://www.cheesebuerger.de/images/smilie/konfus/f010.gif

[SheFly]

Welcome to TE!

I am also a TT person, although over a much shorter distance than you ;). On my bike, I use the Fizik Arione and I like it. HOWEVER, it is a bit more rounded on the nose of the saddle, which many claim is pretty uncomfortable. Since my race is so short (9.75 miles), I am usually only on the nose of the saddle anyway. I had DH point the nose slightly lower, and this seems to work for me.

I use the same saddle on my regular racing bike, FWIW, and also find it comfortable there over longer distances.

The issue is that the saddle that works for me might not work for you... There are a few other TT ladies on the forum, so I'm sure that some of them will chime in as well. Good luck!

SheFly

[OakLeaf]

Search this forum on saddle fitting. There's a lot of helpful information on where to start. You can narrow your search quite a bit by knowing:

(1) how wide are your sitbones?
(2) do you need a cut-out, or not (probably more likely in TT position)?
(3) "pear" shaped or "T" shaped?

That information (plus knowing that for long distance performance riding you want something very firm and as light as possible) should get you down to five or six saddles you think you might want to try. IMO the width and length of the nose is fine-tuning.

If many of your sister time-trialists have gone through the search without a trial program being available, then they must have lightly used saddles lying around their basements and garages. What about a team saddle exchange, formal or informal?

Also, in the US, if you order direct from Specialized, you can return the saddle within 30 days if you don't like it. Terry has a similar policy. Check whether they have the same policy in the UK.

[ridebikeme]

Are there any shops in your area that might have a saddle demo program? Lots of shops are incoporating that into their inventory, so hopefully you'll be able to find one.

Congrats for getting back on the bike and racing!!!:)

[Suechoccy]

Just measured my seatbones by sitting on the floor crouched forward with legs bent. They seem to be 130mm point-to-point.

So does that mean I need a saddle at least 140mm wide, or at least 160 to allow 10mm either side of seatbones?

Sadly the only shop that hires out saddles in Cambridge area only hires out touring/commuting saddles, not racing/tri saddles.

I guess I need a cutout or at least a groove because I'm sitting forward in the tri position.

What's T-shape and pear-shape? Please tell me examples of each and I'll google them.

I think I need a soft padded wide nose too. (Reason being that's when I ride the Madison, it has such a nose and seems comfy on the touring bike).

Of the Selle Italia range, I can see 3 models: Diva Gel, Gel Flow and SLK Gel Flow for women. How wide is the nose (measured across about 1cm back from tip) on these saddles? Are they all the same or are they different? Which has the squishiest nose?

Thanks!

Sue

[crazycanuck]

Howdy there! I don't to TT's but thought i might post some links that might give a bit more info...

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=25954

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=28949

There's more around, have a peek at the gear section towards the bottom of the forums & you may just find your pot of gold.

I'm off to bed..

[SheFly]

I guess I need a cutout or at least a groove because I'm sitting forward in the tri position.

I sit in the Tri/TT position on my TT bike and DO NOT have a cut out on my saddle.

SheFly

[Grog]

Sorry I don't have measurements but I just got a Selle Italia SLR Lady Gel FLow (different from the Diva Gel Flow and from the Lady Gel Flow - it's pretty confusing, they have millions on their web site). The cutout is HUGE, which comes with its own problems, but maybe for the TT position it would help. It is a t-shaped saddle, compared to the pear-shaped Lady Gel Flow. Longer nose, more drastic drop between the nose and the sitting area.

If the "scene" is friendly around you, aren't there bike shops that would allow you to try the saddle for a week and bring it back if it doesn't work out? It's pretty common practice here. The saddle just has to be "like new" so obviously you can't ride the hell out of it but it gives you enough time to have at least a tentative "yay" or a definitive "nay."

Perhaps tilting the saddle nose a tiny bit (and I really mean tiny bit) would help? My first day on the SLR Lady Gel Flow was a comedy of pain, and then I dialed the angle just right and I'm a happy camper.

Good luck. I understand that saddles for TT can be a big issue... especially over such long distances!

Enjoy your return to cycling!

[Jiffer]

Can't help with your saddle problem, but wanted to say hello and welcome! :D

Other than your saddle problem, I did want to suggest you try A&D ointment, if you haven't already, or don't already have a "healing" type of lubrication you like. I apply A&D directly onto skin (and under labia where my main issues arise) and then squirt Chamois Buttr into my shorts. The Chamois Buttr gives me lubrication and the A&D heals and protects. I sometimes use A&D when not riding if I'm sore, but I don't have too many issues as long as I use it on long rides. And I imagine with TT, you are pretty much set in that saddle in the same position for LONG periods, which can cause even more problems than a typical cyclist might have that can get up and out of the saddle more often. I have experienced this from riding tandem. Can't move around and stand whenever I want. I have to "coordinate" it with my pilot!

Anyways, welcome to the forum. I'm 39 (40 next month) and just got into cycling a few years ago. Good for you for coming back to it after all these years and congrats on your accomplishments as a young cyclist. That's awesome! Good luck training for your first 100 mile TT! (In however many years it's been.) :) And I hope you find the right saddle soon.

[Jiffer]

By the way, when I bought my Terry Damselfly online, I had I think 30 days to try it and could have sent it back. I bought two different saddles, actually, tried both and sent back the one I didn't want.

Not sure if you can do that with the types of saddles you are looking at, but you might find a site that will let you. Also, work on developing a good relationship with a local bike shop. We have a good relationship with ours and the owner lets my dh try out saddles. I don't know if they would have done that when he was a brand new customer, but we have bought a tandem, two nice road bikes, two kids bikes and all kinds of misc. bike stuff there over the years ... and sent them lots of business. Not only does the owner allow dh to try saddles, but he brings them over to the house! He's like the pizza delivery guy. :) He was also going to give my husband a nice loaner bike while his was being worked on, but he didn't really need it. Anyway, you may not be able to do this now, but if you build a relationship somewhere, maybe you'll be able to do this sort of thing in the future.

[alpinerabbit]

I'll recommend my SMP any day, but they are pricey except for the TRK, or a wide-nosed TT/Tri saddle.

[TxDoc]

Hi Sue and welcome back to the cycling scene :)
Not sure it helps, since saddles are a very personal choice, but this is what I use:
-on my road bikes, I have the Selle San Marco aspide carbon superleggera. Here it is: http://www.glorycycles.com/sanmaassuca.html it does have sort of a groove so really there is no pressure at all. The downside is that it is expensive :(
Before buying this one I had a seat with a cutout, Selle Italia SLR gel flow. It is very comfortable, one of my favorites over the years, but a little bit too padded. I like the plain carbon better because it has no padding on top and it makes the ride more comfortable.
-on my time trial bike I keep an old Selle San Marco Era arrowhead gelaround (they don't make this anymore, but it was wonderful although still a little bit too padded). I might try to switch to the carbon for that bike too, but haven't decided yet.
An all of my bikes, the saddle nose is actually pointed downwards, always been like that in over 30 years.
Hope this helps and good luck!

[tctrek]

Hi, Sue and Welcome to TE! Saddles are a little bit like men.. you have to kiss a lot of frogs to find your prince :D. I would buy them with as long as they were returnable. Try it, return it. I ended up with the Selle San Marco Aspide Glamour. Haven't had any saddle soreness every since!

[tantrumbean]

Hello, there is definitely quite a few bikes shops that will let you try saddles - unfortunately the only one I can think of at the moment is Paul Hewitt and Leyland is a bit out of the way for someone living in Cambridge.

TE is a great forum, but it might be an idea to post your query on cycle chat for a bit more local knowledge - I'm sure someone on there would be able to recommend a shop near you that will let you try racing saddles...

[Suechoccy]

tctrek wrote: "Saddles are a little bit like men.. you have to kiss a lot of frogs to find your prince"


Oh dear, I hope not. I kissed far too many frogs to find my prince among men!

I went to a local bikeshop yesterday, got my butt measured on the Specialized butt-foam measurer, 138 or so, so bit the bullet (and the wallet) and now have a Jett to try. Rode it in last night's Cambridge CC 10 and the cut-out channel was a revelation (ah, bliss) but over a longer distance I wonder if the rails along each side will be too hard... so am reserving judgement until after this weekend, got a 30 on Sunday which will be a good test.

Not sure about chamois cream or other lubes, mainly because I never used it and have never had a problem with infections/sweat in that area, so am a bit wary of clogging up pores and causing a new problem. But I'll bear it in mind as another thing worth trying, along with shorts.

Fingers crossed for a comfy tush for me this Sunday please, or else there'll be a twice-used Jett coming up for sale shortly!

[papaver]

good luck!

[Jiffer]

tctrek wrote:
Not sure about chamois cream or other lubes, mainly because I never used it and have never had a problem with infections/sweat in that area, so am a bit wary of clogging up pores and causing a new problem. But I'll bear it in mind as another thing worth trying, along with shorts.

I mentioned the A&D in particular, because you mentioned getting raw spots. For me, it helps prevent and/or heal them. It's sort of thick and sticky, so the slipperiness of the Chamois Buttr helps prevent raw spots in a different way. But lubrication of any kind is another one of those personal preferences. Everyone is different.

[yetigooch]

Try the SMP saddles.....they are designed with the nose of the saddle pointed downward.......I've not used them myself but have friends that have them and like them very much.

[Suechoccy]

Well the jury is still out on the Jett.

I rode it in Saturday's 10 and no problem.

Sunday was a bigger test - 30 mile time trial. I had some moments of pain underneath and shifted around in the saddle to relieve them but overall I spent more time comfy than uncomfy.

Upshot is nothing's raw or numb or tingling but I have a feeling of bruising right at the front of my bits. So it's a sort of progress...

I'll tip the saddletip down a bit more and see if that's an improvement.

It's a very hard saddle and every bump inthe road seemed to transmit straight through the saddle nose rather than the saddle seat, probably because I was in the tri-position, and frame geometry is stiff and tyres were pumped hard, so there was no give anywhere - except in me!