Never judge people on their appearance...

[papaver]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3aCCjjoKC8

:)

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

That truly is inspiring and wonderful.

[Pax]

That was brilliant!

[channlluv]

Wow. Just wow.

[uforgot]

Here's a link (http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,25329373-5006024,00.html) to an article about her performance. Good for her!

[roadie gal]

OMG, I was crying. How wonderful for her.

[SadieKate]

I watched the US version a few times and it was too excruciating. Too many contestants picked for the physical package and not the talent.

Britain seems to be able to do the opposite. Bravo for them.

This is the first season's winner.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_5W4t_CBzg&feature=related

[Pedal Wench]

Just inspiring. The song is one of my favorites, and from her mouth, the words are so much more meaningful.

[uforgot]

I watched the US version a few times and it was too excruciating. Too many contestants picked for the physical package and not the talent.



Happens too often, and not just on American Idol.

[smilingcat]

Thank you for the link. So wonderful and to brighten up my day! And I love her attitude.

Gonna share this my friends.

[spindizzy]

I'm crying as well.. Susan was inspiring, so spunky, no fear of failure..she just crushed it. Bravo!!

Papaver, thanks for sharing that link.

[NbyNW]

That was just awesome. And so brave of her to put herself out there, on a show where people can be cruel. She knew she would win them over.

GO SUSAN!

[Zen]

American Idol is a joke. If they don't have age limits in Britain why do they have them in our version?

[twin]

That was beautiful and thanks for the link.

[7rider]

American Idol is a joke. If they don't have age limits in Britain why do they have them in our version?

Because AI is looking for a pop star....geared towards the teeny-bopper audience. So they want a young star to click with a young audience.
Paul Potts...this woman....BGT is looking for a completely different niche. You'd never see an opera singer on AI.
Besides....it's well known that America idolizes youth.

[oxysback]

American Idol is a joke. If they don't have age limits in Britain why do they have them in our version?

Actually, their version of American Idol is Pop Idol. I think the age requirements for both shows are the same (or similar).

The show you just watched was Brittain's Got Talent. Our version is America's Got Talent. Anyone can perform whatever talent they want, not just singers.

[Softie]

Wow, that was amazing. She is absolutely as good as anyone I have seen perform on stage. As a fan of live performances I'm sad the world was deprived of her singing in major productions this long.

[Zen]

Meh.
"Pop stars" we got. Give me talent, I say!

[Flybye]

What a phenomenal display of talent and confidence.

[wackyjacky1]

That was...WOW!

[Serendipity]

Thanks for the link.
That was incredible - I hope we hear more of her!

[Mr. Bloom]

I had SilverSon run it on Yahoo! News. I teared up! Her voice resonated at that point that touches my soul!

[badgercat]

What a voice! Thanks for posting this. :)

[Softie]

As a PS. I'd love to hear how this is going for her, but don't have a TV. If anyone watches it would be great to know the outcomes!

[Trek420]

Wow, just wow.

I love watching the expressions of the judges. At about 4:01 Simon exhales right along with her. She's good, really good, what an ear, great range, she interprets the music well, phrasing is beautiful and judging from the judges expressions I think they got it just from the way she held the mike "this may be good!" and then that first note. "yes!"

The only musical gene left for me from my opera singing paternal grandparents (my brother got the genes and some were left for my sister, Duck on Wheels) was perfect pitch.

Her every note is spot on. But you can have an ear and still be bad and she is wow, just wow. :D

[beccaB]

I have played in the pit for a high school version of that musical/opera. It is some of the most challenging work I have ever done. That was performed very well.

[Trek420]

Very well indeed. :cool: Even her choice of music
"you're going to sing what?"

and yes she did!! I hope she wins.

[GLC1968]

Wow, amazing. I too, hope we hear more from her.

What struck me as odd was that I read all the comments here before I listened to it, so I knew it was going to be good. I was watching the audience's reaction to her intro and it pissed me off. The judges too...how could they all be so judgemental? Then it occurred to me that I'd probably have thought the same thing had I not already knew she was going to be good. Realizing that makes me feel a bit ashamed for a reaction that I didn't have but one that I probably would have in a different situation. I certainly hope that the people there live learned something. I know I did.

Thanks for sharing this.

[Smilie]

Wow, that was awesome. Thanks for sharing the link!

[five one]

Wow! What a wonderful voice she has! I really hope she is able to go far in the competition. I loved her attitude! She seems to know who she is and what she's capable of with her voice. Her reaction to the crowd's cheers was so sweet and genuine.

I was in the audience of a concert a few years ago where a similar situation occurred. Matt Andersen, a Canadian blues singer-songwriter, was the opening act for the band I went to see. He's 6'2" and about 400 lbs, with longish curly hair. There was audible snickering in the audience as he walked onstage with his guitar. As soon as he began singing, it was apparent to all that we were hearing something very special. By the end of the first song, he had blown the collective socks off the audience. It was amazing.

I hope Susan Boyle has the opportunity to continue wowing audiences with her beautiful voice.

[ShubieGA]

she is awesome. Thank you for sharing!

[gilly]

Thank you so much for posting this link :)

I live in the UK and go of of my way to avoid these programs. The people are so cruel to the participants. So to see that, to see her wipe the smirks off their faces was - priceless.

Thank you again.

I still won't be watching, but will no doubt read in the news who wins.. I hope it's Susan Boyle

[Eden]

The reaction of all the judges was pretty great to watch, but seeing the one guys jaw actually drop was priceless.... I have to admit, even beyond judging her from her outward appearance, you'd never guess such a pure, sweet singing voice was going to be behind her speaking voice. I did expect something out of the ordinary though, mainly because it was posted up.

It certainly does teach quite the lesson - the unabashed sniggering by the judges and the audience was incredibly rude, but she sure did soldier on. Sad to say, she's probably accustomed to getting that kind of reaction. Maybe next time all of those people there will think twice before writing someone off at first glance.

[andtckrtoo]

I'm just so happy for her! I was reading an article where she said she had never been kissed. At 47! I'm sure she'll be kissed after this. What an amazing woman to have gone through what she did and still come out with that cheeky attitude. And then the voice! Oh my! She's amazing!! I definitely teared up when I hear her - even for the third time.

[crazycanuck]

I saw a bit of this on SBS the other night & wanted to see the whole thing. I finally got to see it now after waiting & waiting for my slow dial up to upload(?)/download (?) it.

All i can say is i'm still wiping the tears away...Good on her for sticking her thumb out & going on the show. Stuff society's views on people who don't look "famous"or "wonderful".

I need to listen to the Les Mis soundtrack again.

[Pedal Wench]

I'm just so happy for her! I was reading an article where she said she had never been kissed. At 47! I'm sure she'll be kissed after this. What an amazing woman to have gone through what she did and still come out with that cheeky attitude. And then the voice! Oh my! She's amazing!! I definitely teared up when I hear her - even for the third time.

To me, that's what got me most - listening to the words of the song - about dreaming of a life different from the one she's living. Never been kissed, never been loved.

[andtckrtoo]

To me, that's what got me most - listening to the words of the song - about dreaming of a life different from the one she's living. Never been kissed, never been loved.

+1 - All I can say is that I hope every single one of her dreams comes true. In one song she has brought so much to so many people.

[MM_QFC!]

The reaction of all the judges was pretty great to watch, but seeing the one guys jaw actually drop was priceless.... I have to admit, even beyond judging her from her outward appearance, you'd never guess such a pure, sweet singing voice was going to be behind her speaking voice. I did expect something out of the ordinary though, mainly because it was posted up.

It certainly does teach quite the lesson - the unabashed sniggering by the judges and the audience was incredibly rude, but she sure did soldier on. Sad to say, she's probably accustomed to getting that kind of reaction. Maybe next time all of those people there will think twice before writing someone off at first glance.

+1
I'd add that I don't think that the judges held a candle to her in class or grace; yes, 2 of them admitted how rude their reaction was, but kind of enveloped their comments into a group scolding, "everyone was laughing at you at the start, etc" instead of taking personal responsibility and owning up to their own superficiality at the beginning; how about an apology too, or is that considered unnecessary or a ratings plunger?
She outclassed them all and very graciously stood there on stage listening to their drivel, combined with them acknowledging the obvious - this woman can sing her heart out and I hope she rocks 'em all the way to the top!

[7rider]

+1
I'd add that I don't think that the judges held a candle to her in class or grace; yes, 2 of them admitted how rude their reaction was, but kind of enveloped their comments into a group scolding, "everyone was laughing at you at the start, etc" instead of taking personal responsibility and owning up to their own superficiality at the beginning; how about an apology too, or is that considered unnecessary or a ratings plunger?
She outclassed them all and very graciously stood there on stage listening to their drivel, combined with them acknowledging the obvious - this woman can sing her heart out and I hope she rocks 'em all the way to the top!

I thought that, too. "Wow. Not one of them said, "I'm sorry. I misjudged you.""

[AnnieBikes]

Two years ago when Paul Potts was on BGT, Simon had the very same answer for him as he had for Susan, last week: "I was not expecting THAT." Our expectations are low sometimes but what results is actually unreal. I had seen Susan through a link on Yahoo news on Sunday, but am so glad to see it here, too. It makes you want to have a very open mind when it comes to first impressions! Her choice of song was poignant and her delivery...well, just awesome.

BTW, Paul Potts is slated to introduce his second CD on 5-5. (my birthday...I know what I am giving myself! :D)

[roadie gal]

Part of the video was on CNN this morning. She's certainly getting worldwide attention now. I hope she gets a record/job offer.

[maillotpois]

That was amazing. I loved watching her backstage afterward. How wonderful.

[MM_QFC!]

I thought that, too. "Wow. Not one of them said, "I'm sorry. I misjudged you.""

It was such a jarring omission (as in the classic definition: the failure to do something one can and ought to do)...IMHO...

[Trek420]

I thought that, too. "Wow. Not one of them said, "I'm sorry. I misjudged you.""

Another +1. While their facial expression said it all. The woman judge drawing each note out by hand even her fingers saying "will she hit the note? YES, she got that hard transition", leading a standing ovation but still it went unsaid

"sorry, we missjudged you".

But she's the better person, not only took the high road instead of saying "well, I showed them" but her honest joy in the performance.

I wish her every success, and I believe she will have it! She also showed a lesson to everyone who sees the video not to pre-judge based on anything.

Go 40+ women, go!!! :) :p

[Pedal Wench]

Susan Boyles' story was just on CNN! Go, Susan, GO!

[Pax]

She's being featured on the CBS Evening News!!! Way to go Susan!!!!!

[uforgot]

I don't agree with the "I'm sorry I misjudged you". That implies that it was okay to be rude, laugh at her and roll your eyes if she didn't have the voice she did. I was appalled at the way she was treated, and even by them saying that everyone was laughing at her. I don't see how any apology would work.

I also read that she was having meetings with Sony BMG or something like that. Isn't that Simon's company? I read that along with her incredible voice he was also hearing "Kaching".

[NbyNW]

I don't agree with the "I'm sorry I misjudged you". That implies that it was okay to be rude, laugh at her and roll your eyes if she didn't have the voice she did. I was appalled at the way she was treated, and even by them saying that everyone was laughing at her. I don't see how any apology would work.

I think that's exactly why, as popular as these shows are, lots of people also find them off-putting. That impulse to mock and jeer speaks to the worst in all of us.

I prefer to think that, since Susan had seen previous seasons of the show, she knew she might be walking into a snake pit, and entered to see if she had what it took to charm the snakes.

I'm really looking forward to seeing how she does in the rest of the competition.

[shootingstar]

Wow, her delivery was a knockout. And she chose the right song for herself to infuse it strongly with passion.

[salsabike]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/15/AR2009041502577.html?hpid=topnews

[smilingcat]

here is another clip where someone has melded a video from Elaine Paige and Susan Boyle and you can see and hear the difference between the two singers.

It is just amazing. I'm very challenged musically but I thought she was good as Elaine Paige singing the same song.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbRy05DToiY

And it hasn't been even a week yet since her performance. Interview by BBC Scotland, interview by several other news channels. One person saying "her life will never be the same again" is sure right and I wish it will be for better.

I also loved the comment from the director (or was the producer of) Les Miserable production on West End giving his whole hearted approval of Ms. Boyle's performance.

I can't wait to hear her sing more. :D :D :D

[Cataboo]

I haven't watched the british version of these shows - but I did see one season of american idol (way back in the first year of grad school... when I'd just leave the tv on for noise)...

And given from what I remember of that season, I'd say in general... the judges did treat Susan relatively nicely at the beginning... They obviously thought that they were humoring her... But from an american idol point of view, Simon was actually being fairly nice.

I think anyone who has seen the shows pretty much expects to be ripped to shreds by Simon.

I'm not saying that excuses any of it, but that's the norm on these shows.

[Biciclista]

She looks a lot like my cousin!


http://inlinethumb17.webshots.com/34576/1030090266013838833S500x500Q85.jpg

[Becky]

She looks a lot like my cousin!


http://inlinethumb17.webshots.com/34576/1030090266013838833S500x500Q85.jpg

Are those fresh figs?!? Yummy!

[ZenSojourner]

I never watch any reality TV, so the fact that I've seen enough of AI to really hate Simon whatsis name speaks to just how mean and nasty that man is.

A friend sent me that clip yesterday without saying what it was about. As soon as I got a look at her and realized Simon was on the panel of judges, my heart went out to her. The man is just unspeakably cruel every chance he gets. Can't STAND him!

The look he gave her when she walked out on stage was barely veiled contempt. And there was a close up of a girl in the audience who was just making the most ridiculous faces - 12 million people have seen her on YouTube as well, and of the two, guess which one I think is the more unattractive.

The face he made when she stated her age was inexcusable as well. I liked her style, pushing it right back in his face that way, LOL!

I was overjoyed when she started to sing. There's no better way to stick it to Simon than to do well despite his biases.

I wish her the best and hope good things come of this for her.

[OakLeaf]

I've never watched AI, only seen clips like this, but I've seen enough to know that Simon is playing a role. You're supposed to hate him, his behavior is supposed to be inexcusable, he's like the "bad guy" in pro wrestling.

The trouble is that Simon's role validates the behavior of spectators like the ones who were shown on the video. (Not that he's the only - or even the most important - influence in the mass media these days encouraging people to behave like that. But no politics, right? :rolleyes:)

Props to Susan Boyles. It is a cool story and I hope she goes far, not just for herself, but as an example to audiences.

We went to hear Julia Fischer perform with the NY Philharmonic last fall, and a friend of ours, who is much more familiar with the music scene than we are, remarked how you need to be "hot" to be a soloist nowadays. It's not just "popular" music. So less than spectacular looks are a real hurdle for an aspiring performer to overcome - probably more so for a woman than a man, but I'm sure it's true for both sexes.


PS Mimi- no fair showing those figs unless you're going to share! ;)

[GLC1968]

I saw her story on my local news tonight. It's become soooo widespread that I wonder if she really had any idea what she was getting herself into. Wanting to sing in front of a big audience was one thing...world wide internet sensation is something else entirely.

People are assuming that 'her life is going to be so much better now". I don't agree. I just hope that she's got the 'pluck' to say no when no is necessary and that she can still have some semblance of a life.

Luckily, I think she does have the strength of character to handle this all with grace and ultimately come out ahead.

[Geonz]

I think that's exactly why, as popular as these shows are, lots of people also find them off-putting. That impulse to mock and jeer speaks to the worst in all of us.

I prefer to think that, since Susan had seen previous seasons of the show, she knew she might be walking into a snake pit, and entered to see if she had what it took to charm the snakes.

I'm really looking forward to seeing how she does in the rest of the competition.

When I saw it (and I think it's interesting that the cycling community found it rather early in its life cycle - are bicyclists spending too much time online ;) :) ) I thought... she seems to really, actually know what she's doing. She seems to be the one in charge, here. Yes, she's nervous... perhaps she's simply unemployed because there's a recession.
Then I read a little press about her being lousy in school and bullied - though by then she was "getting her 15 minutes of fame" so full Spin Factor had been turned on, I'm sure - and that her mom has recently died, but had encouraged her to try this but she hadn't had the confidence.
I, too, just avoid the whole manipulation and exploitation of people's dreams. Still, it was gratifying to see at least two of 'em apparently knocked off course (that third guy never did seem to lose his analytical "what's the situation and how can I play it" stance).
I realized that being a bit out of the cultural loop (never seen Les Mis, tho' we sang a medley of tunes in chorus), I didn't have the same visceral reaction that people who'd seen & loved Les Mis would... the significance between the song's lyrics and her own self standing there would have taken me, too.
I just really, fervently hope that she's got a good support network so that she doesn't get devoured by the Forces of Celebrity.
What I think was the coolest was how professionally she sang. Once she got going, she didn't show nervousness at all. It's what the word pwned was made for :D :D However, I think that was perhaps partly being in her own world... since she seemed surprised when the show's host told her that she'd gotten the biggest yes he'd ever given... and she had been standing right there...

[uforgot]

Well, that's the thing about fine arts. I have a hard time with public speaking (except in the classroom). I hate it and it shows how nervous I am, and I screw up and leave things out, but dancing is my "thing". and I majored in percussion in college. I've loved and done both since I was very young and whenever I dance or play, the nervousness is not there. I'm comfortable presenting myself this way, and I absolutely loved performing. They say it's a way of expressing emotions when you can't in other ways. It's almost as if I'm saying, "this is how I feel and I'm not afraid to show it in this way", and yes a lot of it is the joy of doing it so you may be in another world. Singing is the real Susan Boyle coming to the surface. It's a really good example of beauty on the inside.

[jobob]

Wow, I hadn't gotten around to viewing the clip until just now. Awesome!

I don't think she looked as awful as the buildup led me to think ... but I suppose I was assuming someone really hideous looking. She looks, well, normal to me, a wee bit chunky perhaps but not bad. And I thought she was rather poised. :cool:

[maillotpois]

I thought she looked a bit like Julia Child.

[mtbdarby]

I realized that being a bit out of the cultural loop (never seen Les Mis, tho' we sang a medley of tunes in chorus), I didn't have the same visceral reaction that people who'd seen & loved Les Mis would... the significance between the song's lyrics and her own self standing there would have taken me, too.
I just really, fervently hope that she's got a good support network so that she doesn't get devoured by the Forces of Celebrity.
What I think was the coolest was how professionally she sang. Once she got going, she didn't show nervousness at all. It's what the word pwned was made for :D :D However, I think that was perhaps partly being in her own world... since she seemed surprised when the show's host told her that she'd gotten the biggest yes he'd ever given... and she had been standing right there...

I can't believe I'm gonna admit this, but her accent is so thick to me that I had a very hard time hearing her speak. I could have sworn she said she was going to sing "I dreamed a dream" from THE WIZARD OF OZ! I couldn't figure out where the Les Mis reference was coming from, lol.

Now that I've listed to it about a dozen times, I still hear the Wizard of Oz folks:p

She is amazing. I listen to that in the morning to pump myself up for the day. May she truely get the dreams she's dreamed and a good man to kiss:D

[jobob]

I thought she looked a bit like Julia Child.
That's it!!

(She was reminding me of someone, but I couldn't place it.)

Thanks mp.

[GLC1968]

I can't believe I'm gonna admit this, but her accent is so thick to me that I had a very hard time hearing her speak. I could have sworn she said she was going to sing "I dreamed a dream" from THE WIZARD OF OZ! I couldn't figure out where the Les Mis reference was coming from, lol.

Now that I've listed to it about a dozen times, I still hear the Wizard of Oz folks:p

She is amazing. I listen to that in the morning to pump myself up for the day. May she truely get the dreams she's dreamed and a good man to kiss:D


I totally thought she said 'Wizard of Oz' too! It wasn't until she started singing that I recognized the song, but honestly, until I just read your post, I didn't even make the connection that she had said Le Miserables when I heard Wizard of Oz. Duh! :rolleyes:

[maillotpois]

That's it!!

(She was reminding me of someone, but I couldn't place it.)

Thanks mp.

Happy to help. Maybe it was seeing 2 of her that threw you....

[NbyNW]

Here's a link to a track that Susan recorded for a charity CD about 10 years ago. Enjoy!

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/2009/04/16/exclusive-susan-boyle-s-first-ever-song-release-revealed-listen-to-it-here-86908-21283564/

[Duck on Wheels]

WOW! It's not just the voice. It's also the timing, the interpretation, the variations in the ways she uses her voice through the phases of the song. She's a fantastic singer!

Meanwhile, reading the e-paper today, I noticed a presentation of an act that's in the semi-finals of the Norwegian version of this program -- a program I hadn't even heard of in any version until today. Anyhoo ... This is a dance group that got turned down by Mira Craig as music video backup because she didn't like how some of them looked and didn't like that they showed a bit of belly in their dancing. The story in the paper is about how some of them were embarrassed about their figures until they started to dance with this group. Now the teens in the group say that instead of wishing they had bodies like their skinnier classmates, they wish they had more "booty". Personally, I have to say I have enough booty; I just wish I could shake it like these gals do. The story's in Norwegian, but the dancing is universal. Enjoy. http://www.kjendis.no/2009/04/16/kjendis/norske_talenter/dans/tv_2/siw_carina_steiro/5772165/

[Selkie]

I don't think she looked as awful as the buildup led me to think ... but I suppose I was assuming someone really hideous looking. She looks, well, normal to me, a wee bit chunky perhaps but not bad. And I thought she was rather poised. :cool:

I agree with you, Jo. I hope they don't force her to change her appearance.

[lph]

Oh, she had poise, but basically she looked dowdy and unsexy, in a show that I'm thinking leans heavily on people selling youth, charm and sex appeal.

More power to her, she did fantastically. Sex appeal is not the be-all and end-all it's made out to be, and especially for a classical singer it's a bizarre "requirement". Pavarotti wasn't famous for being hot.

[jobob]

OK, I'll grant you that. I'm not familiar with these kinds of shows so I don't know what the norm would be.

More power to her, indeed. :cool:

Ed to add - Heh, she even has a facebook fan page. I found it because one of my (non-TE) friends just joined it.

[Trek420]

I thought she looked a bit like Julia Child.

but shorter :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ohiUbQyDhk

[Biciclista]

but shorter :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ohiUbQyDhk

shorter like my cousin. :D:D:D

[mtbdarby]

Thanks GLC - I'm glad I'm not the only one.

A news clip of one of the judges this morning says they have decided not to do a makeover for her. They want to keep her as she is and the one that stole the hearts of millions. Good call.

Of course, I also read Simon is trying to sign her to his record label. Whether she wins this contest or not, her life will never be the same!

I listened to the charity cd and it doesn't sound anything like her. I don't know that I believe it's really her...

[Trek420]

This morning on network news, think it was GMA they interviewed her in her home, asked her to sing a bit and she just casually broke into song.

I don't think she's the Scottish Milli Vanilli :cool:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReklDIQS-n8&feature=related

[Cataboo]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dennis-palumbo/what-if-susan-boyle-could_b_187804.html

[sundial]

What a beautiful diamond just waiting to be discovered. :) She is truly blessed with a voice of an angel and may she continue to stir the hearts of many with her beautiful arias.

When you least expect it you discover a hidden treasure--sometimes in the most unlikely places. Here is one who, for a brief moment in time, suspended all judgments.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k08yxu57NA&feature=related

[TsPoet]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dennis-palumbo/what-if-susan-boyle-could_b_187804.html

Yes!

[ZenSojourner]

LOL, I always thought that was

Be wary of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and wouldst go good with ketchup

[7rider]

I just caught an article about Susan Boyle, which reports that she appears on a little known community released charity CD back in 1999. On it, she sings "Cry Me a River" and is, in some ways, better than her performance on BGT (assuming this is, indeed her). Very emotional...very good...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8r9lRJ6yHY

[smilingcat]

Gawd!! What is wrong with all these interviewers. So condensending. "she can not only sing but she can take care of herself" W.T.F. ??? excuse my language. She isn't dumb. She has far more going her. Who is or are willing to stop their lives to take care of their mother. Yeah!! she doesn't own a nice dress but who would when you are unemployed for a long time to take care of your ailing mother!! I have a friend who gave up a six figure job to take care of her ailing mother until she died. My friend ended up bankrupt because of it. And she is a smart cookie!!

These interviews just fumes me :mad::mad::mad: CBS should be ashamed of themselves. CNN should be ashamed of themselves!!!

UGGGGHHHH!!!!

And she is so polite she doesn't stoop to their condensending level. Good for her.

[crazycanuck]

What gets my goat is everyone saying she's a gift from god..uh..umm excuse me??? Nothing to do with religion!!!

Smilingcat..I do find that news agencies esp in North American seem to badger people no matter who they might be!!

I've officially lost interest in this story now. I'll go & listen to the Cats, Les Mis, Phatom of the Opera original soundtracks. Perhaps even find the one for Chess.

[lph]

CC, I'm not religious but I use phrases like that all the time. I'd say "a gift from god" just to mean that someone truly has an extraordinary and surprising talent. It's not literally correct of me and might even offend some people, but it's just part of my natural language.

[crazycanuck]

Lph, I understand but it's a bit too reglious of a saying for me.

[lph]

sure. I just meant that people don't necessarily mean it literally.

Actually, if you think about it it's worse that the phrase implies that this talent just "happened" to a person and that it has nothing to do with hard work and dedication..

[Trek420]

sure. I just meant that people don't necessarily mean it literally.

In media here sometimes they do. We had a freeway situation here in which at zero dark 30 in the morning a truck was cruising down the freeway when right in front of him the pavement cracked or opened up. Driver managed to stop yet because this was on a turn he was left with the cab dangling part way out in space over an overpass. :eek:

I clicked on the morning news and caught the coverage. It was very subtle but there was this moment when the anchor of the news was praising the drivers alertness to see and skill in reacting to the problem, the first responders training paid off in getting him out of the cab in a tricky delicate dangerous situation, the highway patrol reacted quickly rerouting to minimize traffic problems and prevent a pileup, it all came together ... and the traffic guy just staring daggers at him "It .. was ... a ... miracle :mad:"

Yes, people please can we all just agree that in that situation it was all the right people at the right time with the right training, skill set, practice, work and knowledge?

When it comes to Susan's voice yes, call her gift from g*d but that performance took work. Singers compare their art to an athletic event as the vocal cords are muscles. You may have the pipes but phrasing like hers does not just happen singing in the shower. :p You may know how to phrase but can your lungs sustain and hold the breath to just the right point?

How many of us have talent but won't do the hard work to bring it to the peak? I've got the genes with two grandparents trained opera singers. But I don't use it or work it. What a waste. Her performance, a wake up call. :cool:

Are any of us, all of us wasting the gift? :cool:

[ZenSojourner]

sure. I just meant that people don't necessarily mean it literally.

Actually, if you think about it it's worse that the phrase implies that this talent just "happened" to a person and that it has nothing to do with hard work and dedication..

Yeah. I wasn't going to say it, but since you did, I agree. I HATE it when people talk about a talent as being "a gift from god". I saw an episode of "Touched By an Angel" - a show, btw, which I absolutely abhorred - where a poet's gift was attributed to her being able to hear the words that god was giving her and then writing it down on paper. So basically she was a glorified steno machine. E.g., god was whispering words in this woman's ear, so it had nothing to do with intestinal fortitude, hard work, or clear insight. She was just copying down what god told her. Like we're all just puppets reading the lines given to us. BLEAH!

Grrrr! True, you have to have some inborn talent to be a truly great singer or painter or whatever. But it's only hard work that polishes and hones an inborn talent to genius. That's the difference between your friends telling you how good your voice is, and the world telling you how good your voice is.

[Trek420]

you have to have some inborn talent to be a truly great singer or painter or whatever. But it's only hard work that polishes and hones an inborn talent to genius.

But but but .... if we "preach" (disclosure here I am just using the word and not putting this on any religion or pulpit, ok?) that hard work, preparation, study, practice and dedication to honing ones craft is the path to success and mastery of a skill but but but that means taking responsibility for our own failures or lack of success. :rolleyes: We can't have that ;)

Well (Trek puts hands on hips and stamps her feet) "I could do the Deathride too .... but I didn't train And I draw like a house on fire, I could put together a book like Spazzdog did but I haven't been willing to work on my art every day like she does ... and and I have a pretty good ear and the music genes, I could play music like BSG but I don't practice at all ... :confused: :mad:

If we make it seem the "overnight sensation" did not train and practice for years to only the enjoyment of her village and her cat, that fame and fortune miraculously happened then we can feel "that could be me. I sing in the shower pretty good. I could just walk out on stage and knock one out of the park"

We as a culture adore hearing about the player cut from the college team, working at Home Depot who tries out for a walk on position and joins the pro team. What we don't want to hear about is the training night and day before and after work to stay in shape. That would spoil the dream of "that could be me, I play ball pretty good" :rolleyes:

Well, no, that could not be you. :rolleyes: unless you do the work, then luck perhaps a higher power of your choosing is involved.:rolleyes:

[lunacycles]

I'm a buddhist, so in my world view supposedly there is no "god." But I experience something akin to "god" (or freedom) when I remember this life is something I can wisely respond to, but generally not control. I think you are deluded if you believe you are in full control of the direction of your life or what happens to you. You can make wise decisions, brave choices, and hard work helps, but there are no guarantees. There certainly wasn't one for Susan Boyle, but she went out there anyway. We do not know the outcome: of this day, of this life. But we live it, and the more fully we live it the more miraculous it becomes. IMO.

The real miracle is the effect her performance is having on those milllions and millions who have witnessed it. To me that is a gift from god.

[Bruno28]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/celebrity/the-patronising-of-susan-boyle-goes-global-200904171707/

[bikerz]

I'm finding the whole Susan Boyle phenomena somewhat disturbing and provoking.

As a disclaimer I should say that I never watch reality shows - the combination of ego and cruelty totally depresses me, so I was leery of clicking on the link, especially when I saw the reactions of the audience and judges when she came on stage. Their treatment of her was one of the most shocking displays of rudeness I have ever seen, but I suppose that's part of what gives these shows their dramatic tension. "When you came out here, everyone was against you" says one judge. Really?! Wow. (And none of them apologized for their behavior afterward either.)

And then *shock* it turns out that she has a lovely voice, and sang a beautiful song very well, and aha! now everyone loves her. Tears in the judges' eyes, audience on their feet, millions of youtube viewings, etc.

But I find myself thinking - what if she weren't such a wonderful singer? What if she had a so-so voice, but she just really loved to sing? Would the cruelty and judgment have been warranted?

And what was so "surprising" to all of us about her performance? Was it that she was middle-aged, frumpy, with no "sex appeal," and people who look like that shouldn't be expected to have a "cheeky smile," to say nothing of talent? And is it only if they do have talent that they are then deserving of respect and dignity?

I had forwarded the video to a very wise friend who pointed out that Sarah Boyle has recorded and sung in front of audiences before, in fact she said she's sung pretty much all of her life. She walked out on stage in front of a huge audience with poise and confidence, and delivered a beautiful, professional-quality performance. The only thing that makes it surprising is our own preconceptions about her based on her appearance and background. Busted! :o

I keep thinking about myth-making and the "ugly duckling into swan" narrative, and how this can let us off the hook for our own judgment. The more I thought about it, the closer to home it all hit, because as a not-young, not-skinny cyclist and hiker, I've heard my share of jeers and criticism (from my own internal critic as well as from total strangers). And I find myself wishing I were stronger or faster than I am, so "then I could really show them all! And then wouldn't they feel surprised and embarrassed about their judgment of me?" But I'm not some amazing cycling super-star waiting for my chance to be discovered. So then what?

I'm currently studying some Buddhist mind-training teachings and one of them is "When Practicing Unconditional Acceptance, Start With Yourself." Believe it or not, it's harder than it seems! :rolleyes: This whole Sarah Boyle thing is an incredible lesson for me in my own difficulty with unconditional acceptance for others and myself.

I wonder if anything will really change as a result of all this. Will audiences and judges on these shows become kinder and more respectful? Or is Sarah Boyle just the exception that proves the rule of who is expected to succeed in the entertainment world?

(Phew! I haven't posted in a while, and it's a long one! :o Hopefully it won't turn out to be a thread-killer, as so many of my posts tend to be!)

[sundial]

...I never watch reality shows - the combination of ego and cruelty totally depresses me...I've heard my share of jeers and criticism (from my own internal critic as well as from total strangers). And I find myself wishing I were stronger or faster than I am, so "then I could really show them all! And then wouldn't they feel surprised and embarrassed about their judgment of me?" But I'm not some amazing cycling super-star waiting for my chance to be discovered. So then what?

BikerZ, your words struck a note with me and I can truly empathize with you. We can continue to dismiss any of their shallow notions of what we are perceived to be and what we're capable of doing by continuing to do what we love. Confidence in ourselves will trump their criticism any day.

[BikeDutchess]

Excellent post, bikerz, you've put into words a lot of things that have been bothering me about this Susan Boyle hoopla but that I haven't been able to put together in an coherent way.

[Mr. Bloom]

What gets my goat is everyone saying she's a gift from god..uh..umm excuse me??? Nothing to do with religion!!!


With all due respect CC, to some it might be.:)

You've been critical of me for quoting scripture to explain my position on issues, so with all due respect, I'd appreciate it if you would avoid issues that your anti-religious posture keeps you from understanding.;)

Sorry for the hijack...

[mtbdarby]

Well said Mr. Silver. And I don't think you hijacked the thread, it was already hijacked. The topic is about not judging people on their appearance. Maybe we should just stick to that....

[shootingstar]

[QUOTE=bikerz;420269]I wonder if anything will really change as a result of all this. Will audiences and judges on these shows become kinder and more respectful?[QUOTE]

Not whole crowds of people, the herd mentality instinct will continue to be there. And the judges..as becoming "kinder" or more reticent in negative remarks, I find that hard to believe much change will happen on T.V. for especially reality show producers who want to maintain audience ratings and remain on T.V. These shows do not demonstrate subtlety in human behaviour and human relationships.

Which is why I never watched any of the reality shows. Bombastic, often hurtful human relationships or competing over something that is not even a real long-term sport/or any sport at all. The only useful thing is show how selfish and narcissistic, human beings can become.

I am willing to believe there will be a few individual tv viewers sparked to rethink their own personal situation and move on things they have longed to do for a long time. Some people need external VISUAL stories like S. Boyle's singing, played out in front of them, to give them the extra motivation.

[salsabike]

Go BikerZ! And that helps me say what I've been thinking, which is: I wonder how the cycling community would respond if Susan Boyle showed up on a bike? In a jersey and lycra? On an expensive bike? I am sure there are many cyclists who would not make fun of her or roll their eyes. And I'm equally sure that plenty would.

And while I am not religious myself, I really cannot understand why some people think it's okay to be rude to those who are. They're entitled to their own beliefs.

[wildeny]

I never watch any reality TV, so the fact that I've seen enough of AI to really hate Simon whatsis name speaks to just how mean and nasty that man is.

A friend sent me that clip yesterday without saying what it was about. As soon as I got a look at her and realized Simon was on the panel of judges, my heart went out to her. The man is just unspeakably cruel every chance he gets. Can't STAND him!

The look he gave her when she walked out on stage was barely veiled contempt. And there was a close up of a girl in the audience who was just making the most ridiculous faces - 12 million people have seen her on YouTube as well, and of the two, guess which one I think is the more unattractive.

The face he made when she stated her age was inexcusable as well. I liked her style, pushing it right back in his face that way, LOL!

I don't have a TV :p but I noticed this news on BBC. However, since I never like to watch this kind of shows, I didn't go to check the youtube clip. Until I heard it from my friend, saying "just google her".

When I watched the clip, I didn't know what I would expect. :eek: Yes, that guy who interviewed Susan -- Simon? -- was very rude to her. :mad:

Susan must have gone through this kind of judgmental looks all through her years. It's great that she has that spirit to show them who she is and what she is capable of.

I don't think I'd have her courage to face similar situations. Well done, Susan.

More. The recent comment on the youtube clip said that you guys just have to watch more operas and then you won't be too surprised, something like that. No. Not really, even in opera.

In the old days, we can tolerate singers to be fat, but, still, the singers had to be "presentable" on the stage. Nowadays, we even hardly see these overweighted sopranos or tenors in opera. Even now most of the classical music performers have good looks, especially the younger generations.

[Trek420]

In the old days, we can tolerate singers to be fat, but, still, the singers had to be "presentable" on the stage. Nowadays, we even hardly see these overweighted sopranos or tenors in opera. Even now most of the classical music performers have good looks, especially the younger generations.

Woah there. Trek sighs, now here this thread goes on another tangent.

Since when did good looks equal thin?

Since when does not being "presentable" mean fat?

Sure, if you're going to sing Carmen, for the role it's best to be young and slimmer soprano (or is it an alto part? :confused:). But the voice itself could be any skilled singer.

I can't find the quote but I once read and interview with Aretha Franklin saying she has a "singing weight". She struggled with weight but found if the gets too thin to be "presentable" the voice, which is her gift suffers.

Lastly I'll say this about that :rolleyes: I find many of us (us meaning cyclists as a group, this group as a whole) do not deal well with issues of race and class which for some can include weight. My LBS has a loyal growing client list of cyclists of color :p. This is great for him and great for them as their money is just as green and he's a great wrench.

But I sadly hear reports of poor treatment at other shops and even on rides, being ignored or worse. :mad: All this in the bluest of blue areas of a blue state.

How many of us are Bikesnob______ (your city here) if someone doesn't look good, or has a cheaper bike? Have you made a choice who to hang back with, help or ride with based on how they look?

In talking to friends and coworkers about my sport I've been told

"cycling? I won't ever ride again, that's a rich white skinny person's sport". :mad:
"well you play golf, and tennis, and I'm not skinny or rich so?" :rolleyes:
"yes, but they welcome me at the club and the links. I went to a shop, tried to join a ride and .... :("

Lucy, we as a cycling culture "got some 'splaining to do" if we want this sport to grow especially in the US. :cool: I think Susan's appearance on the scene is a teachable moment to think and talk about who and how do we prejudge and how does it effect them and ultimately us :cool:

[PamNY]

Has anyone besides me wondered if the Susan Boyle phenomenon was planned? I don't watch this type of show, but it seems reasonable to assume that the people who produce the show have some idea of what's going to happen. It's also reasonable to assume that they know what will appeal to the public.

I'm not certain but I believe the uplifting, follow-your-dreams sort of theme is prevalent in at least some other televisions shows (Oprah) so the popularity of an event like this would not be a surprise.

Pam

[Miranda]

Late to this thread, but just watched the vid, wow... love it! (sure there is a lot more going on in all these post, but just on the OP...) That is the best kind of beautiful that any amount of $, make-up, clothes, etc. can't buy... from the inside out:cool:. It made my day:). Thx for sharing that.

[Ana]

I just stumbled upon this :)

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/26/fashion/26looks.html

[lph]

Wow, this is just what I was waiting for! I've been thinking about this but was unsure about to word it. The TV show and the rude judges and audience are one thing, but that is sort of the name of the game, what I kept thinking about is WHY does her voice surprise me so much. And it still does - I heard a recording of her singing "Cry me a river", one of my favourites, and it literally gave me goosebumps. But even though I knew in advance what she looks like, my brain still kept telling me that I was hearing this beautifully dressed and made-up woman, not necessarily young, but sophisticated and elegant. And I was wondering why I had such trouble making those two images meet, and if there is any reason one expects a voice to mirror an appearance.

Norway has another story a bit like this one, the winner of "World Idol" a couple of years ago is Norwegian, he sounds like Bono in U2 and looks, well, Simon Cowell (same judge) "you sing like an angel and look like a hobbit". He's been a lead singer for years. Red bushy hair, broad face, enormous gap between his front teeth.

[Duck on Wheels]

And yet another example of looks, or our stereotypes based in looks, belying the voice within... I heard the voice first, coming from the tv while I was in the kitchen getting a cup of tea. A bass (bass-baritone, as it turned out) so deep and smooth and immense I was expecting, well, not this. Here's a series of samples to let you too hear the voice first, starting deep, then showing his range, some discreet photos, and then the whole person in action and context. I could have included some classic opera too, but you can look up more if you're enchanted. Enjoy :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbcBr-ZdnnI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E83BWsmT0II&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkwKK-NjryU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RESX8YroSCQ&feature=related

[ZenSojourner]

Woah there. Trek sighs, now here this thread goes on another tangent.

Since when did good looks equal thin?

Since when does not being "presentable" mean fat?

Since my entire life, anyway. Not saying it SHOULD be that way or that it's in anyway OK, it just IS.

I've been thin, or at least a lot thinner than I am now, and I've definitely been younger.

And I can promise you, I was treated with more respect and KINDNESS when I was young and thin than I am now that I'm old and fat.

As for bike culture being exclusive, I've always been on the outside of that. Every bike club I've ever joined but one made me feel like an outsider. For instance, routinely getting dropped on "no-drop" rides, and having bike club SAG members repeatedly trying to pick me up and drive me to the ride end because they're assuming I can't make the ride. After all, I'm fat. So I MUST be ready to drop dead at any instant. I'm not talking at the tail end of the ride either, there was only one time I was that far back in the pack and that was because the woman I was riding with was so slow. Well, the semi-custom bike some local (male) mechanic had made for her was too big for her, she could hardly help it.

Going to a bike shop is a real crap shoot too. Since 1996 I've found exactly TWO bike shops that didn't immediately dismiss me because I was a woman. Neither of these were in Portland OR, a supposedly highly bike-friendly city (but apparently not bike-RIDER-friendly, LOL!)

I walked into one bike shop a while back, there were no customers, the guy in the shop glanced up and immediately dismissed me and went back to reading whatever it was he was reading. He continued to ignore me even after I walked up to the counter right in front of him. Middle aged fat women held no interest for him. When I finally managed to get his attention, he sent me home with the wrong part - all I wanted was a set of plugs for my bar ends because I'd lost one. The ones he gave me were too small, besides being crappy.

The other bike shop in town treated me with respect, so guess which one I give my business to now?

I've seen people snub other people because their bikes weren't good enough, because they weren't wearing an expensive jersey or were otherwise "dressed funny"; because they were too old, too weird looking, too female, too fat.

The one bike club I've ever belonged to where they didn't behave this way (in the main, you're always going to find the odd snob) was very instrumental in the fact that I rode more often - more group rides, more incentive to ride. I prefer to ride "alone" but it's nice to ride "alone" in a sponsored ride, it's something somebody else planned and I'm just more likely to actually ride then. And for REALLY long rides, SAG is pretty much required since I don't have anybody to call in an emergency, LOL! I've only ever had to do that once but I was glad I had the option because I was 30 miles out of town when I had a mechanical problem I couldn't handle on my own.

Same sort of things went on in the one Ski club I belonged to, and I wasn't even old and fat then, LOL!

There are 2 bike clubs near where I live now, and one of them doesn't even HAVE any "no-drop" rides (guess which bike shop they're associated with?) Their "slow" ride averages 14-16 mph over a 20 to 25 mile course. I'm serious, they consider that the entry level, slow ride.

I can see where someone new to the sport could feel very intimidated and unwelcome. I'm not sure what I can do about it personally other than refrain from participating.

[cylegoddess]

That made me cry!( Im feeling sentimental)
I had two experiences with looks.

I was riding, in all my hip black gear and saw two older folk, whom I caught up with. I said( and they were normal, windcheater ,slightly large white haired ) as they looked nice, can I ride with you>They said, well you may not want to, as youll most likely go faster than we will. So I said, I only LOOK fast! I just need to pace someone as I am getting killed in this wind. The lady, who was a good deal larger than I, beat me like gong - she FLEW! Her hubby chatted with me.

ON my commute last week, I passed a lady , a large lady riding at a good clip , on the hill. She caught up to me and I said, oh good, someone to ride with, oh maybe not as she shot past me, saying, its only hills Im bad at!
She was GORGEOUS!!
I am passed everyday by well, big people FLY BY me on bikes and wow! Its beautiful. I love to see people so fit and graceful on their cycles. I can think of nothing Id like more than being able to be strong and beautiful, in motion. Like they are.

[Fredwina]

This op-ed appeared in my local paper:
http://www.calthomas.com/index.php?news=2569

[andtckrtoo]

This op-ed appeared in my local paper:
http://www.calthomas.com/index.php?news=2569

I like that article. Thanks for sharing.

Even after hearing all of the stories and such, Susan's voice still makes me cry. And her lack of "perfection" appearance-wise makes me smile. While I agree that we should not judge a book by it's cover, I love seeing a plain cover come out with an incredible story.

[BikeDutchess]

Ana, I thought that NY Times Article "Yes, Looks Do Matter" (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/26/fashion/26looks.html?_r=1&scp=3&sq=Susan%20Boyle&st=cse) that you posted was interesting too.


many social scientists and others who study the science of stereotyping say there are reasons we quickly size people up based on how they look. Snap judgments about people are crucial to the way we function, they say — even when those judgments are very wrong.


MODERN society, with its awareness of the prejudices of history and its unprecedented ability to introduce so many different types of people to one another, may dilute or even neutralize some preconceived notions. But others will persist and new ones will form, experts say.

I think the key is that we develop the awareness to recognize that (and when) our snap judgments may be wrong.

[OakLeaf]

I think this is one of the really positive things about online communities. We get to know each other, sometimes very well, without having a clue what each other looks like.