on being a mom

[badger]

obviously this is a personal question that I can only answer, but I wanted to find out if there were some words of wisdom that can be imparted to me by someone who's been there.

I'm 37. I'm not sure if I want to be a mother. All through my childhood and into my late 20's there wasn't a smidge of doubt that I wouldn't have kids. Then during my early 30's I started to question whether I wanted to have children.

I don't have a burning desire to be a mother like some women have. The truth of the matter is, I hate babies. I love kids, around ages 5 and up, but the squirming babies and crying/whining toddlers really does my head in. People insist it's different when it's yours, but I obviously can't comment on that as I don't have one.

Anyone out there who felt like me and was glad you had a child, or should I take my feelings as a red flag and remain childless as I'm too selfish and set in my ways?

And yes, I do have a partner, and he's pretty much in this frame of mind: if it happens, great, if not, oh well.

[lph]

I've never been a baby person either, and have never had a knack with small children. When my son was small I "got" other children his age, but nowthat he is almost a teenager I'm almost back to that point where I just don't "get" small children again.

My son was not planned and becoming a mother took a LOT of getting used to. I had to give up some dreams and plans I had, that wouldn't necessarily have happened anyway, mind you. Becoming a mother definitely changed my life, hugely, and it changed me more than any other single event. I am a better person for it. I love him more than anything and I can't imagine life without him. But I have no idea what I would have done with my life if I had remained childless, it might have been equally rewarding, I could have been the next Mother Teresa, I guess ;) (pun intended) but it seems a bit futile to dwell on it. I'm kind of grateful that this choice was in a sense taken away from me.

btw, whining and nagging and squirming drives me up the wall too, but my son adapted to that early on. He turned into an excellent communicator very early... :D

[sfa]

Having a baby was the hardest transition of my life. Hell, I've been at it ten years now and still feel like I spend my days as part of an improv group, just faking my way through it!

I don't think much of babies either. Sure, they're cute. For about five minutes. But they are boring and need an insane amount of attention and THAT'S what was hardest to deal with--not having a minute to myself. And it wasn't different because they were my own. If anything, it was harder because I couldn't walk away from the responsibility. OTOH, nothing prepared me for the love part either. Sure, I knew I'd love them but the hormonally driven overwhelming almost physical feel of the love was a surprise--really not like anything I had ever experienced before. And while the needy infant years have gone away, that love hasn't. And after infancy they got a lot more fun to be around. I don't know if it was luck or parenting style, but I have two kids who don't whine much at all. They aren't perfectly behaved, but whining isn't in their repertoire. Of course, I've got two kids on the autism spectrum so the one who can't talk couldn't whine if he tried! Sometimes autism is a real blessing.

Oh, and I always thought I *wouldn't* have children. Partly it was because I just didn't much like babies, but mostly it was because I imagined my life as an adult revolving more around my job and travel. Marriage and kids just weren't high on my list of priorities. That changed after I met my husband and after I realized that you can fit a lot more in your life than you may have though you could when you were 15.

Sarah

[crazycanuck]

Badger-don't worry if you never have kids! You can spend all that $$$ on bikes & travelling!!! What about a dog? They're probably better than a child & they don't talk back!!!

I too don't like kids. Ugh. AGHGHGHGHGHGH :mad:

[Crankin]

When I was young (teens) I really did think I would have kids. Then, when I got married we decided we wouldn't. I was 27 and in a PhD program. I was going to be a "professor" and my life would be filled with that. Then one day I was in the ASU bookstore and I got mesmerized by the books on pregnancy and babies. I had to have one. It was a bit of a long road, since I lost my first baby, but I did have 2 kids.
Truthfully, I was better with them as they grew. Don't mistake me, they were planned and very wanted, but I knew my limits. My husband stayed home with #1 for almost a year and I always joke those were the best days of my life! I always worked and didn't just center my life around the kids. We always had an active social life, too. As they grew, I spent more and more time doing things with my kids. They grew up to be very sociable and emotionally intelligent, wonderful adults. I always say that I must be sort of an OK person, because my kids turned out so well.
So, what I am trying to say is that while a lot of parts of parenting aren't super fun, it is what you make it. What I resented were the "super" parents who just did nothing but focus on their kids. I hated seeing them at sports things or other activities. There were even some of these parents, mostly dads, at the junior level cycling events that my younger son did.

[lph]

I guess what I wanted to say is that you don't have to love babies to love your own, and you don't have to love children in general to be a good mom. It helps, I'm sure, you don't have to learn "child handling" from scratch, and may have more confidence and patience, but it's not necessary. And without too many defined ideas of how to do things you can think outside the box and raise a child with an open mind too.

You'll be fine, no matter what you choose :) It's the thought that goes into the choice that counts.

[redrhodie]

I made the decision not to have kids, and I'm happy! I'd always rather see my friends alone than with their little monsters. No baby envy here!

[shootingstar]

I'm 37. I'm not sure if I want to be a mother. All through my childhood and into my late 20's there wasn't a smidge of doubt that I wouldn't have kids. Then during my early 30's I started to question whether I wanted to have children.

I don't have a burning desire to be a mother like some women have. The truth of the matter is, I hate babies. I love kids, around ages 5 and up, but the squirming babies and crying/whining toddlers really does my head in. People insist it's different when it's yours, but I obviously can't comment on that as I don't have one.

Anyone out there who felt like me and was glad you had a child, or should I take my feelings as a red flag and remain childless as I'm too selfish and set in my ways?

And yes, I do have a partner, and he's pretty much in this frame of mind: if it happens, great, if not, oh well.

I don't regret my decision not to have children. I don't have baby envy partially because I am the oldest of 6 with youngest sibling 10 yrs. younger than I. And since parents couldn't afford baby sitters, nearly every day I was expected to be on the look out for at least some of the much younger siblings. Seeing the stress of childrearing on my parents, particularily my mother, probably influenced me a great deal.

It is important to get long-term feelings clear particularily if a woman enters into an intimate relationship with a guy from a lst marriage who already has children.

He has 2 children (30 & 28) who are good responsible adults and fun to be with now. But for first decade or so of knowing him, I chose not to move into his place or vice versa and start being mommy..and you now, my partner is GLAD. It made it easier for him on the days when he had them during those teen years during divorce. Hence, I think the adjustment of the children to me, is better and healthier long-term. My parenting style probably would have been quite different from their mother's , since I have a different personality.

Most generously he has left the decision to me. And said he would suppport me if I really wanted our own child. I thought he was abit Nuts...since he is relieved his major childrearing years are over. The guy must be 100% on side also to have children too. At this time, he regrets abit his little grandson lives in another province. He really would love to pull along grandson in a biker trailer. When his children were young, at that time, cycling was not in his life, farming was his hobby/physical activity on weekends.

I love my honey since obviously he meant if I ever got accidentally pregnant.... Pretty remote since am in perimenopause.. :) I have been with honey since I was 32.

Truly, my life feels well-rounded with his children and with 6 nieces and nephews via 3 sisters. One thing, I have noticed though, that being childless, means I'm not totally clued in to the passage of time in the same way, a parent experiences due to growing children. So am approaching 50 next yr.:D

[maillotpois]

I am not a baby person. Before I had my child I didn't think I could care for anyone as much as my dog. I never baby sat when I saw growing up, and didn't ever feel particularly comfortable around kids. I'm with lph in that now that my daughter's almost a teenager, I am back to really not "getting" small kids anymore.

I can't say if having kids is right for you, but having one (operative word ONE) was definitely one of the best things I have done.

[Irulan]

Don't let what others want cloud your choice. I am a very firm believer in that every baby should be wanted and loved, and born into a stable home with two parents committed to each other.

[badger]

thanks, everyone!

One of the things that's really leaning me towards not having a child is the money factor. Let's face it, they're expensive, and will only get more expensive as they get older because I would want to expose the child to as much as possible in terms of culture and sports. Piano, ballet (every child should take ballet, boy or a girl, such a great launching pad for all other sports!), swimming, etc. aren't cheap!

Another thing I'm hesitant in giving up is my freedom and our "let's go snowboarding this week" mentality where we'll pick up and go in the middle of February. We won't be able to do that with a child in school.

I have a good friend who is a mother of a 16 month old. She is always telling me I need, yes, NEED to have one because she loves her son so much. That may be so, but I also see her staying up all night with his fever, worrying to death that his iron count is low, and getting hit by his wayward fists when he's having a whiny fit, and generally letting herself go for the sake of her son (she's lives/breathes for him, which I find a bit unhealthy).

But on the other hand, I'll see my 10 year old niece and realize just what a neat kid she is, how much fun I would have with my own discovering stuff I'm interested in (assuming he/she will share that interest!!).

It's not like I have a whole lot of time to ruminate over this, I'll be 38 in a couple of months and my boyfriend will be 42 in April. Maybe the decision will be made for us in not conceiving anyways!

[Becky]

Badger, I can understand your feelings, mostly because they are so much like my own on this subject. I'm not sure that I can share any wisdom, but I want to thank you for posting this and opening up this discussion.

[Irulan]

thanks, everyone!

One of the things that's really leaning me towards not having a child is the money factor. Let's face it, they're expensive, and will only get more expensive as they get older because I would want to expose the child to as much as possible in terms of culture and sports. Piano, ballet (every child should take ballet, boy or a girl, such a great launching pad for all other sports!), swimming, etc. aren't cheap!

Another thing I'm hesitant in giving up is my freedom and our "let's go snowboarding this week" mentality where we'll pick up and go in the middle of February. We won't be able to do that with a child in school.

I have a good friend who is a mother of a 16 month old. She is always telling me I need, yes, NEED to have one because she loves her son so much. That may be so, but I also see her staying up all night with his fever, worrying to death that his iron count is low, and getting hit by his wayward fists when he's having a whiny fit, and generally letting herself go for the sake of her son (she's lives/breathes for him, which I find a bit unhealthy).

But on the other hand, I'll see my 10 year old niece and realize just what a neat kid she is, how much fun I would have with my own discovering stuff I'm interested in (assuming he/she will share that interest!!).

It's not like I have a whole lot of time to ruminate over this, I'll be 38 in a couple of months and my boyfriend will be 42 in April. Maybe the decision will be made for us in not conceiving anyways!

Mom of two in college, I have to make a few comments.

The money thing is in some ways, total BS. The little princes and princesses do NOT have to have the best of everything. There are lots of ways to do really cool things with your kids that do not require a huge outlay.

My nursery was decorated in "garage sale". The designer clothes were handmedowns, as were many of their toys. We skipped the team sports thing. We didn't eat a lot of fast food. We made a lot of trips to the library, skipped the play station....you get the picture. My city has free kids concerts once a month. You just have to get creative.

What if your kid HATES ballet? The boy who is going to want to do it is rare, and I'll caution you right now that forcing what you think a kid should learn can sometimes backfire.

And as for the snowboarding thing....We are a very active outdoors family. When the youngest was 18 mos old, DH joined the ski patrol so we could get family passes. Youngest was on the ski hill on leashes, before he was out of diapers. We did LOTS of camping, family raft trips, ski trips, etc. Sure, it's a ton more work, but when people tell me that their active lifestyle ended with kids... another load of crap. They are just too lazy to figure out how to make it work. That's their choice of course.

And you can take them out of school for a week. We've done it for raft trips ( 10 days in Alaska) and ski trips. They can bring their homework along. The only times this didn't work was when each kid was a senior in HS.

I've got issues with your friend telling you that you NEED to have a kid etc. Granted its become an important part of her life, but that may not be what's right for you.

It's never black and white. So many ways to do it or not do it. Listen to what is right for your family ( which could just be the two of you)

[Tri Girl]

I'm in the same situatuion as you, Badger. I don't like babies (except for looking at them and thinking- how cute). I don't have a motherly bone in me. I teach (I guess I do have a teeny motherly bone for that) and I think that's the reason I don't want my own children. I see how difficult it can be. I'm not blinded and think that they are so wonderful and life will be greater with them, etc. I know it's darn hard work to be a good parent (and I also see everyday how easy it is to be a bad parent).

When I was little I always wanted kids. Now that I'm 35, I don't think so. I have 17 neices and nephews. I'm totally at peace and OK with my decision. DH is too. I don't think it's selfish, I think it's responsible and honest. We love our freedom, being able to travel at a moment's notice, and our carefree life. If we accidentally get pregnant, so be it- we'll love the little one with all our hearts. But if I get pregnant, it'll be because that child was SO supposed to be here (we use multiple methods of BC).

In our society, something is seen as being wrong with you if you don't have children. It's expected that you'll grow up, get married, and reproduce. After 12.5 years of marriage, people have finally stopped asking us "when are you going to have a little one?" My mom still says "who will take care of you when you get old?" and I always respond "my 401K."
Every one of my friends (but one) has children. They all LOVE being moms and always talk all about their kids (and I share my dog stories), but I love not being a mom. To each his own.

I think whatever happens is supposed to happen. I'm kind of a believer in fate. Good or bad things happen for reasons, and if it's supposed to be, it'll be.

I guess there were no words of wisdom, but wanted you to know you're certainly not alone.

[lph]

Irulan, nice post, we've done a lot of the same activities. Tri Girl, wouldn'cha know, it's not enough to have one... I've had total strangers come up to me and comment on our single bike trailer and ask - "but aren't you going to have ANOTHER one?" Uh, like it's any of your business??

[sundial]

Fate decided for me. I have never regretted having children. For the money I could have been spending on my children, I am able to help others in need.

[rocknrollgirl]

I am 47, and chose not to have children years ago, when it "just was not done". When I turned 30, was married and had a home, all I heard EVERY day from my coworkers was "when are you going to have a baby?". I love kids, I teach school, I love my neices and nephews. I just did not want to have any.

I have been happily married for 20 + years, love my job, love my life.

So, my advice, if you have a single doubt, do not do it, and I know that they say that you are never "ready" to have a baby, but I think that if you have to ask the question you already know the answer. And it is ok.....

[greycoral]

Mom of two in college, I have to make a few comments.

The money thing is in some ways, total BS. The little princes and princesses do NOT have to have the best of everything. There are lots of ways to do really cool things with your kids that do not require a huge outlay.

My nursery was decorated in "garage sale". The designer clothes were handmedowns, as were many of their toys. We skipped the team sports thing. We didn't eat a lot of fast food. We made a lot of trips to the library, skipped the play station....you get the picture. My city has free kids concerts once a month. You just have to get creative.

What if your kid HATES ballet? The boy who is going to want to do it is rare, and I'll caution you right now that forcing what you think a kid should learn can sometimes backfire.

And as for the snowboarding thing....We are a very active outdoors family. When the youngest was 18 mos old, DH joined the ski patrol so we could get family passes. Youngest was on the ski hill on leashes, before he was out of diapers. We did LOTS of camping, family raft trips, ski trips, etc. Sure, it's a ton more work, but when people tell me that their active lifestyle ended with kids... another load of crap. They are just too lazy to figure out how to make it work. That's their choice of course.

And you can take them out of school for a week. We've done it for raft trips ( 10 days in Alaska) and ski trips. They can bring their homework along. The only times this didn't work was when each kid was a senior in HS.

I've got issues with your friend telling you that you NEED to have a kid etc. Granted its become an important part of her life, but that may not be what's right for you.

It's never black and white. So many ways to do it or not do it. Listen to what is right for your family ( which could just be the two of you)

Loved what you wrote. I am 30, will be 31 in a couple months. I never really had the desire to have children, like some ladies here have said, if it happened, cool. If not, whatever. But the last year, my hormones have been in OVERDRIVE. Many of my close girlfriends have had babies, and it's making me want one myself. I have always thought too, about the money issue. Right now, I don't have health insurance. I am unemployed. But I am also a full time student, and will be finishing up my degree in the next year and a half. My husband is also a student and working part time...we get by with student loans, some help from family, and he gets the GI bill, which covers our mortgage and a few other bills. So many of my friends have said nothing can prepare you for having a baby. And you can always make do. Our plan is to try to have one next year, to have it in the summertime so I have time to get used to the baby while not being in school. We definitely have enough $$ for food, diapers, clothes etc, and since we're low income, we will qualify for a lot of state programs to help out with doctor visits. It'll only be until we graduate, where I'm sure we'll be able to find jobs with our own health insurance. I just don't want to have my first child when I'm close to 40. Maybe that's fine for some, but not for me. My mom had my brother when she was almost 40, and it was extremely difficult on her physically and emotionally.

All that being said, I grew up being raised by a single mom and I'm A-OK with thrift stores, garage sales, etc. I actually do most of my shopping that way even as an adult. I'm also a fan of the library, and going on hikes, jogs, etc...my husband and I are very outdoorsy people, and that would definitely be carried over into our new lifestyle with baby. I'm so excited to start a family and bring our relationship to a new level. We both cannot wait, but it'll be another 9 months before we start trying for one. Ackk!

[fastdogs]

I was 46 when I had Andy. I never wanted children- didn't like them, couldn't relate to them. I never knew anything about them or paid any attention when women would gather to talk about them- no appeal at all to me.
After a 20 year army career, and a disastrous marraige, I met someone who actually made me think about it, way back in the recesses of my mind, just a little.
I agreed to go off birth control, and if it happened, it happened. I was sure I had no maternal instincts, and my dogs were my children. Everyone said when I had kids my whole life would change, and that the dogs would be out the door.
Well, my whole life did change, for the better I think. I live and breathe for him, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. However, the dogs were NOT out the door. I continued racing them, and my husband would either watch Andy or I'd bring him along. I continued traveling out to wyoming to chase jackrabbits with the dogs, and my husband would watch Andy while I was out in the field all day, or he'd stay home and I'd travel by myself.
I had already lived in other countries and traveled around for 46 years, I guess I don't mind being tied down a bit. I kmow others who didn't change their active lifestyle with a new baby, they just incdorporate them into it. I still have a career, same one I had before, and the daycare IS expensive. I won't be having another one, I'm too old, but the only regret I have is not having him earlier in my second marraige- I NEVER regret not having him when I was in my 20s and 30s.
And maternal instincts? I have a lot to learn still about kids and babies and school and stuff, after a lifetime of ignoring all that, but the same instincts that guide me in caring for helpless animals work for babies too.
My dogs are retired now, but I recently drove to wyoming to judge a jackrabbit coursing event, and Andy and DH traveled along, and I communicated with Andy by radio while I judged and his dad amused him back at the cars for the day. After, we all took my old dogs out for a walk and let them chase a jackrabbit or two. It's even more fun now with my two guys along.
vickie

[shootingstar]

I have 17 neices and nephews. I'm totally at peace and OK with my decision. DH is too. I think whatever happens is supposed to happen. I'm kind of a believer in fate. Good or bad things happen for reasons, and if it's supposed to be, it'll be. ........................

I guess there were no words of wisdom, but wanted you to know you're certainly not alone.


Wow, so many nieces and nephews. :rolleyes: Kinda of rare these days..at least in North America. But Tri, it is an enormous blessing to be part of large extended family. I do believe for mentally sound people, it's helpful to have exposure to children in different ways, when one is childless. Just keeps one's perspective in balance.

I do tend to believe in fate if children becomes or does not become part of one's own family. I don't really at all understand nor support the whole idea of a woman having a child /baby just herself without any partner from the beginning of birth...where she deliberately gets pregnant just to have a child for herself. If life circumstances are such that a woman did want a child but did not meet the right guy, and later can no longer conceive, then she must reconcile those feelings over time. Just my opinion.

On the rare occasion I have mused aloud to him, well what would baby look like with my Asian black hair, etc. and his blue eyes, longer nose.

It's ok , my curiosity is satisfied :) I think I sorta know what the physiological end result of the union would look like ...2 of my brothers-in-law who are also fathers, have blue eyes.

[badger]

ha, my mother's Asian and my father's European. There are so many of us Eurasians here in Vancouver!

My brother married a Taiwanese girls, so although my nieces are technically 1/4 white, they don't look a bit caucasian. So when my dad's holding my nieces, they don't look like they're related at all!!

[shootingstar]

ha, my mother's Asian and my father's European. There are so many of us Eurasians here in Vancouver!

My brother married a Taiwanese girls, so although my nieces are technically 1/4 white, they don't look a bit caucasian. So when my dad's holding my nieces, they don't look like they're related at all!!

Unbelievable..badger! And I haven't even met you yet. Maybe we've already passed each other like ships at night on the street.

My oldest niece (24, and she has gasp, a career now) and her brother, both look more Caucasian. So I am amazed by the end result of your 1/4 chinese nieces.

The 3rd Eurasian kid is a niece from the youngest sister, only just under 1 yr. oldn now. Ella Mei (Mei means beautiful in Chinese) and I share the same birthday. It's very cool!

[kelownagirl]

I think it must be very difficult to have to make that decision. I always wanted babies, since I was in my late teens. Had two in early 20's and one more at 37. When I remarried at 46, I seriously considered one more for a brief moment. (!)

I have a good friend who just turned 50. She never wanted kids all her life, was single but dated a lot and had several long term relationships. She finally got married around 40 and decided she really did want to have a baby. After much trying, it didn't happen and she has mourned that missed opportunity since.

And I know several women who've never had children and very happy about it.

I think it can sometimes be the hardest decision a woman can make.

[fastdogs]

my husband's southeast asian (indonesian). My hair was light brown (before it turned grey) and I have blue eyes. My son has dark brown eyes and straight liver chestnut colored hair, that is getting darker as he gets older. And, unlike me, he never sunburns.
vickie

[shootingstar]

my husband's southeast asian (indonesian). My hair was light brown (before it turned grey) and I have blue eyes. My son has dark brown eyes and straight liver chestnut colored hair, that is getting darker as he gets older. And, unlike me, he never sunburns.
vickie

Both niece and nephew, tan well...like their mother. Their father has more florid pink skin to match his blue eyes.

[Irulan]

It helps, I'm sure, you don't have to learn "child handling" from scratch, and may have more confidence and patience, but it's not necessary.

Here's a thought.

I did. I was confident that I did not want to raise my kids with only what I knew from the home I grew up in: dysfunction, abuse etc. I took tons of free parenting classes from various sources, and basically did learn new things, from scratch. Nothing like breaking the chain.:)

[Flybye]

I am not a baby lover either and never really planned to have children. I wanted a career and always thought that I would work and be successful at that. It was supposed to be difficult for me to have children. When I did find out that I was pregnant, I was working full time with my fairly new degree and loving life. I accepted a position with the agency that I had been waiting for an opening in on a Friday and took the pregnancy test on Saturday. My husband and I had just purchased our first home and got two baby dachshunds. The timing was awful.
Now, eleven years later, I have three children. I truly think that there is nothing that I have done that is as rewarding as having children. I am rewarded on a daily basis in ways richer than I can't even begin to describe. I am a better person because of the ways in which my life has changed.
I can think of no way better to contribute to the world than raising three fantastic children.
I respect women who do not have children. I think that we all have to make our own choices - I respect that. I am just glad personally, that this choice was made for me. I would hate to think of my life without my children.

[Flybye]

Here's a thought.

I did. I was confident that I did not want to raise my kids with only what I knew from the home I grew up in: dysfunction, abuse etc. I took tons of free parenting classes from various sources, and basically did learn new things, from scratch. Nothing like breaking the chain.:)


A big huge hug to you for breaking the chain - that is so incredible. And admriable.

[emily_in_nc]

My DH and I tried to have kids for eight years. Lots and lots of temperature taking and timing, and finally even a surgery and IVF. It worked, I became pregnant, only to have a miscarriage. Was absolutely devastated.

I thought for a full decade during the infertility struggles that my life could never be complete without a child. I was as obsessed with having a baby as I used to be about cycling. :D With time, I worked through it, and now, at 47, my life is great, and I'm perfectly happy without children. My DH and I have been married for 23 years and are very happy. He is early retired and I'll be able to be too (no college funds).

Yes, I do think I missed out on something that would have been amazing had I been able to become a mother, but there is so much to enjoy in life even without children. Dogs, for one. :p

Life is good. :)

[Crankin]

Everyone is different. I think I would have been fine without kids, but maybe at teeny bit of regret at the age I am now.
My only comment is that I am glad I had mine when I was young, 29 for the first. Around here you are a young mother if you have your first at 35-40! I wouldn't want to have a teen now.
Sometimes, when people come into my husband's office and see their pictures, they say, "Oh, are those your brothers?" They don't believe it when he says they are his kids, despite the fact he has some grey hair.
I too, saw the result of bad parenting when teaching, but you can overcome it, because my husband did. He knew nothing, except verbal abuse and being bought "stuff" instead of time with his parents. I always babysat, have a brother 10 years younger and 3 cousins I also took care of. My husband just watched what I did and in many ways was a better parent than me when they were younger.

[polly4711]

My parents had me at 39. They weren't sure that they wanted kids. One thing that they did to test out (and you have to have tough skin for this one) is that they became foster parents for younger children. After some time, they decided that they wanted a child, and well, Thanksgiving 1985 had me (gotta love it when your dad is on pain meds and volunteer all sorts of wonderful information).

Anyways... you still have a few years in you. Yes, money can be a factor, but you can also give your child a wonderful life at a much less cost with being creative.

Personally, my mom is glad that she had me. She has been able to give to the community while being a great mom by helping out in the class room, leading my Girl Scout troops, helping drive other kids to practices, etc.

It's a tough decision, I wish you the best. Please keep me updated.

JP

[channlluv]

I respect your feelings and your decision, but I want to share my experience, too, briefly. I'll spare you all the medical details, but I've lost five children to miscarriage. I have one - quite literally - miracle child, because a doctor listened to me and let me follow my intuition. God bless Vera Barile, wherever she is.

I never felt more goddess-like than when I was pregnant and then nursing my baby. I was never much of a baby person, either. I enjoyed kids okay, but I never went ga-ga over them. There's not a whole lot in my life I've done extremely well, but I have to say, I thoroughly enjoyed being pregnant. I really did. Feeling that little life growing inside me, it was amazing.

That opinion that it's different when it's your own...true for some, not so much for others, I guess, but man, it was true for me.

If you do get pregnant, you're in for the greatest love affair of your life.

Peace and good health to you, whatever your decision.

Roxy

[jesvetmed]

This is similar to what I've been going through for several years. I was the child of an "oops", and raised by my grandparents. They ended up adopting me. They were wonderful, but not without issues.

But overall, family hasn't been a strong suit in my life. I always loved the idea of a big family coming home on holidays, etc.. you know, the belief in the "typical American Family". But the realities that I see made that picture less believable.

At any rate, I married at 29 yrs, back to school at 28 for 4 years, new time-consuming and energy-consuming career by 32, and big student loan bills (I'm still paying them :()

We kept saying we weren't ready for kids, we could have them later. I kept thinking that the desire would hit me some day. DH teaches high school. He "has 120 kids of his own" every day. He has always said if I think I want a child, say the word, but he doesn't really have the desire enough to ask me to have them.

So I think we were both waiting for the other to feel the need. So far, it hasn't happened. We are 42 and 43 now. Sure, we still could have them, but my gosh -- we'd be old when they were teenagers! And neither of us have any desire, still.

So we've come to terms with that decision, and have full lives and good friends. We have his family (my parents have both passed away), and that is enough. Many of our friends with children are hitting their empty nests as their kids are heading off to college.

Will I be sorry when I'm 50 or 60... who knows. Maybe. But for now, I am happy with the decision (or in this case -- lack of making a decision for so long :rolleyes:)

Follow your heart in whatever you feel. It will be the right decision for YOU.

[MomOnBike]

OK, from my point of view, kids are expensive. And I went the thrift-store, make our own pleasures route - until the needed More.

More education tops the list, the younger daughter is going to one of the Big Eastern Universities That Everybody Has Heard Of But Nobody Can Afford. That one took up fencing and last year fenced her way into the NCAA finals. Fencing is an expensive sport that she happens to love and is good at.

The elder daughter is/was less expensive, but still was a financial drain.

In my opinion, you shouldn't have kids (dogs, horses, rats, etc.) unless you are willing to give them what helps make them the best they can be. And that is expensive - in time if nothing else.

I'd have a nicer house, more bikes, nicer clothes, and a bunch of other things without my children. But in the end, that is just Stuff.

That's the bad news. The good news is there is no feeling on earth as wonderful as being proud of your children. That's not Stuff, that's Real.

So, have a baby or not? It's your call, of course, but being a parent is the hardest job you will ever do. Don't let anyone tell you different. But there are rewards, however intangible they may be.

[Miranda]

Wow, this is quite a thread...

Well, I was one of those people that never wanted kids. Couldn't stand them. Couldn't stand people telling me I had to have them, etc. But, I did...

At pushing 30, I had my first, then a second at 32. I was also a surprise unwanted change of life baby myself. With teenagers ready to leave the house, along I came for my mom at 40. The first thing the doc asked her was if she wanted to abort me. But, here I am. Mom said she cried for two weeks straight because she didn't want everyone to think she was my gray headed grandma, vs mom. Now, turning 80 this year, she says that I kept her young. We are very close.

I became pregnant (by choice) as I was finishing my MBA, and had a career that I made more $ than my DH. All of our non-kid friends couldn't believe it. Then, they thought I had really lost it when I kissed corporate America good-bye to be with my baby at home. I telecommuted part time, and regret the time away doing even that.

I would have never ever thought even MYSELF that I would be a mom. I say phooey on those people who tell you do it "because". If it's right, it will come:).

[vinbek]

I was a career girl. Liked making money. No time for anything but myself. I married my husband at 37. I never was around kids. Never babysat. It wasn't that I didn't like them, they were just never on the radar screen for me. At 40 I got pregnant and delivered at the age of 41. I had a wonderful job, good money, all the stuff we all like and plenty of time to train on my bike. I ended up quitting my job when my daughter was 2.5 - I just couldn't do it all and wanted to be a better mother than my own - but that's another story. I got pregnant again and miscarried. Then did a GIFT procedure and it worked the first time. I was pregnant with twins and miscarried one. My son was born at age 44. I am glad with my choices. It was hard adjusting to not working- my identity was totally tied up with what I did and not who I was, but now the kids are old enough that we really enjoy biking and skiing together. We are very active. I have found some new work opportunities both at church and at school - using the creative side of my brain rather than the numbers crunching side. My older sister had one child and swore she would never have another. She hated the whole birth experience. My younger sister never had children - she has adopted mine for fun and games. She and her husband help disadvantaged children from time to time and enjoy their life together without children. I try to stay in the moment. Enjoy where I am and not project into the past or into the future too much.

[indysteel]

What a timely thread, as I'm pondering these issues myself. I'm 39 and getting increasingly serious with a man who is younger than me. We've started to discuss our future and, clearly, my ever-decreasing fertility is a major issue. I've long felt ambivalent about having kids, but now that I'm in a loving relationship, I've started to think about having one. That decision, which is complicated enough as is, is further complicated by the fact that my BF is not under the same biological exigency that I'm under. We have a lot to think about and a lot to discuss. It's not going to be easy.

[Tuckervill]

Mom of two in college, I have to make a few comments.

The money thing is in some ways, total BS. The little princes and princesses do NOT have to have the best of everything. There are lots of ways to do really cool things with your kids that do not require a huge outlay.

My nursery was decorated in "garage sale". The designer clothes were handmedowns, as were many of their toys. We skipped the team sports thing. We didn't eat a lot of fast food. We made a lot of trips to the library, skipped the play station....you get the picture. My city has free kids concerts once a month. You just have to get creative.

What if your kid HATES ballet? The boy who is going to want to do it is rare, and I'll caution you right now that forcing what you think a kid should learn can sometimes backfire.

And as for the snowboarding thing....We are a very active outdoors family. When the youngest was 18 mos old, DH joined the ski patrol so we could get family passes. Youngest was on the ski hill on leashes, before he was out of diapers. We did LOTS of camping, family raft trips, ski trips, etc. Sure, it's a ton more work, but when people tell me that their active lifestyle ended with kids... another load of crap. They are just too lazy to figure out how to make it work. That's their choice of course.

And you can take them out of school for a week. We've done it for raft trips ( 10 days in Alaska) and ski trips. They can bring their homework along. The only times this didn't work was when each kid was a senior in HS.

I've got issues with your friend telling you that you NEED to have a kid etc. Granted its become an important part of her life, but that may not be what's right for you.

It's never black and white. So many ways to do it or not do it. Listen to what is right for your family ( which could just be the two of you)

Yeah, thanks. I agree.

One thing people who have kids DO sacrifice is thinking in absolutes. Saying "should, will, must, always, never" goes right out the window when there's another free will involved. Those of you without children may need to remember that there, but for your choices, go you!

All of us are "blind" about children, what it will do to us, what it won't. What might have been if we had not had them. I resent the implication that people who choose to be childless are somehow superior at knowing themselves, and especially superior at guessing what childrearing is like, and how it will affect them and their lives. You don't know what you don't know. Sure, you may have an inkling of what you can't tolerate. Knowing your limits is a wonderful thing. But I often hear fear and ignorance in expression of those limits. If you want to be open to children, be open to the idea that you might change your mind about a lot of things.

I also resent when someone says that babies are gross and icky. I think it's an insult on a human dignity level, and one should take a look at their own naked selves, and maybe predict the future, too, when one may be icky and gross again and someone else has to clean up after them. It's how we all are. Gross and icky with obvious bodily functions, and by gosh our emotions are out there sometimes, too, for all the world to see! Don't hold it against the creatures that are new to this Earth, because it was you, and it will be you again some day.

I am also continually dismayed that the religious idea that humans are born sinful has so invaded our society and our collective psyche that most people do not see babies, children or others of any age as basically good, and afford them the human dignity of all that entails. Children are not born whining. They are born crying to get their needs met, a biological call-and-answer, and if their needs are met, they don't learn to whine.

Please do not have children if you do not want them.

Karen

[Biciclista]

I was never going to have kids, and i didn't like babies either. (I'm surprised to see so many people like us here on this board!)

I married a guy who didn't ever want to have kids either, so I thought that was going to be it. Trouble is, I was already PG 2 weeks into the marriage and Dear Raleighdon started talking to my belly :confused::eek::confused: so we decided to become parents. It's the hardest thing I ever did. After having one, I did decide two was a better number, and while I was pregnant with #2 Raleighdon decided enough was enough and had a vasectomy. (Good thinking, after #2, I was wondering what a third would be like!)
Raising two little high energy boys wore me out! Most of the time with them, I was not really enjoying them until my older son hit puberty, and my ugly duckling (he wasn't ugly) became a beautiful swan. As my sons sank into their sulky adolescence, they stopped bouncing off the walls and became pleasant company for me! Thanks to their dad, they also became very gallant and respectful, as gentlemen should be. My sons are wonderful, and having them was the best mistake I ever made!

There's another reason to have kids. WHo's going to take care of you when you're old?!

And please, don't call yourself selfish for not having kids. Having children is often a very selfish act. Call yourself wise, pat yourself on the back for not contributing to the population. If anyone gives you crap for not having kids, they need to put their head right back up their butt where it belongs. It's your right and your decision, and it's no more selfish than any other decision.

Good luck.

[Blueberry]

This topic seems to be quite timely for a bunch of us. I can't swear I won't change my mind, but right now I'm in the no-kid mentality.



There's another reason to have kids. WHo's going to take care of you when you're old?!

I have to respectfully disagree with this. I think it's the exact wrong reason to have a child. Regardless of whether I choose to have children or not, I'll be doing as much as I can to plan for my retirement. I've become increasingly frustrated watching my friends who are struggling to care for their adult parents. While I feel for those who have not had the means to save during their lives, many have simply lived it up - driving expensive cars, taking lavish vacations, etc. Now, they expect their kids to take care of them.

I'm really sorry if I sound harsh - I don't mean to. It's just hitting close to home (and threatening my DH's relationship with his brother).

CA

[Irulan]

In some cultures it's very traditional and typical for the adult children take care of aging parents. It used to be the norm in more cultures, but it seems like the concept of extended family is really going by the wayside.

[Biciclista]

Ca, that was not the reason I had kids, it's just I've heard a lot of people who looked back and realized that this is part of what having families is all about. You take care of them and they take care of you.
It's not about spending all your money so you have to move in with your kids, it's about the possibility that you might lose your mind, and who would you rather took care of you, some strangers, or someone who loves and cares about you.

I also agree with the gal who just said, don't have kids unless you are willing to give them your ALL, because that's what they need. Kids aren't like pets, you can't get rid of them once you don't like them any more. They are the most incredible commitment. When you're at your sickest, your weakest most miserable moment, your child is going to need you. Having kids taught me that I can do almost anything. And unless you are really lucky, you will find that your family support group tends to not be there when you need help caring for those kids. I think Raleighdon and I were child-free for 4 evenings in the first 7 years and 1 overnight.

[Tuckervill]

I think one advantage parents have over childless people is that we have all been childless at one point, but the currently childless have never been parents. Thus, I would give more credence to the parent's arguments for or against, than the childless.

Karen

[Biciclista]

I think one advantage parents have over childless people is that we have all been childless at one point, but the currently childless have never been parents. Thus, I would give more credence to the parent's arguments for or against, than the childless.

Karen
I can't agree with that either. I have some very wise friends who have never had children. Because they didn't have kids doesn't mean that their decisions aren't good.

The bottom line is what you want. You can get all our opinions all day long, but
pretend to decide. Ok, kids it is. How do you feel?
or Okay, no kids. how does THAT feel?
If you decide to have kids, know it's not going to be easy, but what in life really is? For most of us, the benefits outweigh the difficulties, although when you have a sick 2 year old and a hungry infant and your husband just got home wondering where dinner is, sometimes, it just doesn't seem like it!
it will make you stronger.

[Blueberry]

To clarify-

I didn't mean to imply that anyone on TE decided to have or not have kids based on elder care. I agree, many cultures have it ingrained in them to care for the elderly. And in a loving family, I think it's what happens, and what should happen. I certainly don't have a problem with it. I'm actually the person who generally takes care of my grandmother (taking her to the doctor, etc) because her own kids are too busy and "she can take transportation from her retirement home" (which frequently makes her wait 2+ hours on either side of an appointment).

In many states, there is actually a law on the books requiring that children financially support indigent parents. They aren't often enforced now, but they're there, and there's somewhat of a push to enforce them more.

However, I've had people suggest to me that I should have a child exclusively for that reason (as a retirement policy). That's what I really object to. I think when people choose to have children for that reason, the child generally figures it out. Not good for the child or the parent.

Elder care is really a tough issue, and perhaps a topic not appropriate here. Just wanted to clarify that I wasn't suggesting kids shouldn't take care of their parents:)

[Mistie]

I did not want to have one when I was in early-mid 20's. Then, I had an ooops that I miscarried after 14 weeks. I felt the early kicks. It was amazing! Then, I realized (after the miscarriage) that maybe I did want a kid. So, after two months, I was in the green. I got to 24 months and almost died. I lost her too because I have two (Jewish and not a Jew in my family) blood clotting diseases. After that, we tried again and I lost the third at 8 weeks. Docs told me I would do best to stop trying and start living. Ex-DH and I could not get over the losses and divorced. I married my childhood sweetheart two years later. I got pregnant in 2 months. With A LOT of assistance (blood thinners, drugs, etc.), I had a normal little boy who is both the air that I breathe and the frustration I can get. He was not costly, I breastfed for 8 months (free!). His clothes were all and still are from a second-hand store. My mother gets him new stuff. He is not a huge eater. What used to be leftovers are smaller because he gets a portion. Diapers are expensive, but I got a book about teaching them early on about potty (some native thing) and he learned and is doing very well. We go out often. Our activities have changed some, no riding together as much and the park has become our friend. We do get away, my mom takes him a week in the summer and a week over Christmas. When he gets older, we should be able to do more with him. I pulled him in a trailer outside, even when it is cold. When he was fussy, this would help him to sleep. The cold air was great at getting him to sleep. We have had an easy baby. He slept through the night at 3 months, starting solids at 5, potty trained at 20. I can't imagine my life without him. Something my mother told me (as a fan of Dr. Rosemond) is that the baby should not be the center of your life, but you are the center of his life. So, we have done this.

[Tuckervill]

I can't agree with that either. I have some very wise friends who have never had children. Because they didn't have kids doesn't mean that their decisions aren't good.

I was talking about their decisions about parenting, not any decision. Specifically, their choices to believe what they do about the nature of children and parenting them.

Karen

[Irulan]

I was talking about their decisions about parenting, not any decision. Specifically, their choices to believe what they do about the nature of children and parenting them.

Karen

oh, you mean, like "when I have kids,MY children will never act like that...!"
(as your child is laying face down in safeway screaming because you said "no")

bwahahaha... right.

[Blue_Wildflower]

I think one advantage parents have over childless people is that we have all been childless at one point, but the currently childless have never been parents. Thus, I would give more credence to the parent's arguments for or against, than the childless.

Karen

When I was 28, I told my mom I did not want children. Her heart sank. Prior to my 30th birthday, she told me if she had to do it all over again she would live her life exactly as I am living it right now. She loves her kids and all of us (even as adults) come first in her life, but if she had another chance she would not have gotten married at all (which for her also means not having kids). She would have went to college (she eventually went . . . in her 50's) and lived the past 30-40 years of her life single and full of adventures.

Neither party to this thread has an advantage over the other. Even if you are a parent, you still do not know what is ahead of you. You know what you experience and maybe, what will happen the next day. You do not know what raising your teenager will be like until it happens. Sure, you've heard stories. You were a teenager yourself. But, that is all you can go on.

I do not want children not because they are icky. I do not feel superior. Just made a decision based on what I know about myself, what I know of the experience (being the child and through others), and what I want in life.

I've been told that my mind will change when I meet a man I truly love and want to share my life with. We'll see. I am dating a man that does not want kids either (he's snipped), so I do not see that happening. Should my mind (or his) change and it is no longer naturally possible, well, there are lots of kids in this country that need homes. Until that event happens, I accept my decision

[Irulan]

I think one advantage parents have over childless people is that we have all been childless at one point, but the currently childless have never been parents. Thus, I would give more credence to the parent's arguments for or against, than the childless.

Karen


I disagree. I have quite a few friends who are childless by choice. Who am I to argue with what they believe in their heart of hearts is the right choice for them?

[Aggie_Ama]

I am 27 (nearly 28), married 5 years. DH is 28. Neither of us want children now and are beginning to wonder if we ever will. When we got married it was a deal breaker for both of us, I wouldn't marry a man who didn't want kids. Couldn't have would be different but didn't want no way. DH and I have both realized we are quite selfishly content kidless. His little brother has kids and thinks they were a blessing (first one was a oopsie). I see them as a burden if they were in MY life.

I don't know that I won't go back to wanting them but I do know I will not have children without wanting them. My father was put in foster care at 3 years old because his mother died and his father could not handle the burden of 3 children. He was not outright adopted until he was 8 years old after bouncing to a relatives for a bit then back in the system. If I have a kid they will be wanted and I take every precaution to make sure we have that choice. Maybe my own father's feelings about his birth family and what he went through shaped me, I don't know. My brother was "wanted but earlier than my parents planned" and they always thought of us both a the biggest gift in the world. I just don't see children as that for me, yet?

[shootingstar]

Biciclista- I can imagine raleighdon chatting up to your pregnant belly at that time. :)

As for who will look after/look out for the childless in old age... We do need to take a hard look and be aware that quite a number of the elderly are left to their own devices. And some where their adult children don't visit /communicate at all to isolated/frail parent(s). To me, that is very heartbreaking after all those early years of loving and caring a baby/child.

And there are some awfully selfish adult children who expect their aging parents to still cover certain expenses/assist in mortgages, when parents may not have much in the way of assets, themselves to enjoy their retirement years.

Tuckerville:
It is very heartstopping to think there are some people in this world who shouldn't have been a parent in the first place due to their prolonged physically abusive behaviour to their own children.

So self-knowledge of one's own limits could have saved some lives/trauma of others.

I know for myself that whenever a friend/acquaintance chatted excitedly about wanting a child or having their imminent child about to be born, I would feel...nothing. No excitement, no longing, no regret. Nothing. And that feeling kept on persisting over and over.

And it got tested again when I met and fell for my guy who already had 2 children. The opportunity presented itself..again...did I want to assume a mother role? No.

I only mention my scenario, since compared to 50 years ago, there are now more 2nd (and 3rd) marriages / relationship involving children from previous marriages where a childless partner needs to have their eyes wide open and consider all factors if they want to assume a parent role.

[Tuckervill]

I disagree. I have quite a few friends who are childless by choice. Who am I to argue with what they believe in their heart of hearts is the right choice for them?

We're talking about someone trying to make a decision, here. There's no doubt there are happy people who are childless and happy that way. If it were me, I'd give more credence to someone who has been on both sides. That's the advantage they have in this argument. (I use the term argument in the academic sense.)

Karen

[indigoiis]

I wasn't crazy about babies when I got pregnant. And at the time, I was fairly young (25), and in a tenuous relationship, had no money, and was about to go to school on scholarship for a semester in a different country. I wasn't really happy about being pregnant. But, I am glad I had my daughter.

I stopped at the one, though, and I'm glad I did.

My DH does not want children. He accepts and loves my daughter, but I don't think more children are an option at all.

There is nothing wrong with not wanting kids.

[badger]

thank you everyone for your input! This is going to be a long post...

I have just come back from a 4 day trip to Las Vegas with my mother.

Just this morning at the airport we were having a conversation about the "you'll regret not having kids later when you're alone and nobody's there to care for you". I also reminded her that I wasn't going to pop a kid just so I can have someone to care for me when I'm old.

She said that's not what she meant; now that she's lost both her parents and then last month her older brother, she now only has her younger brother and she said that's a lonely feeling. Lonelier made still if she didn't have me or my brother (and his kids).

Just because you have a child doesn't guarantee that child will be in your life later on. S/he could move away to another country, you may not end up being close, etc.

I also suspect that my mother should not have had children. She was exceptionally hard on us, and had very high expectations that were extremely difficult to live up to. She often made me feel bad when I didn't get the grades she wanted me to, and she often compared me to my brother or my peers "why can't you be more like your brother/friend"?

I also know that if I do have children, then I know what NOT to do to them. I certainly won't play the "why can't you be more like..." game, and I will hug them every single day. I can't remember the last time I touched my mother, let alone hugged her (it goes both ways, we're just not a touchy-feely family).

[Tuckervill]

It's not too late to hug your mother!

We weren't demonstrative when I was a kid, either. But my parents got divorced at about the same time I became a mom, and I just decided I would hug and kiss my mother and father more and tell them I loved them, and I wanted my child to have that kind of life. It started a cascade of affection that is still tumbling to this day.

Karen

[shootingstar]

Just because you have a child doesn't guarantee that child will be in your life later on. S/he could move away to another country, you may not end up being close, etc.

I also suspect that my mother should not have had children. She was exceptionally hard on us, and had very high expectations that were extremely difficult to live up to. She often made me feel bad when I didn't get the grades she wanted me to, and she often compared me to my brother or my peers "why can't you be more like your brother/friend"?

I also know that if I do have children, then I know what NOT to do to them. I certainly won't play the "why can't you be more like..." game, and I will hug them every single day. I can't remember the last time I touched my mother, let alone hugged her (it goes both ways, we're just not a touchy-feely family).

Doubtful that my mother ever dreamt that she and her children ...can barely speak the same language anymore now. If there is something complex she expresses in Chinese from her heart...we can't understand her. And vice versa. Linguistic barriers is a common problem across cross-cultural generations..and it's no joke when things get tough between parent and child. It can be a serious barrier to harmonious family communication.

Somehow becoming a parent...is probably best..not to know in advance, the risk, of the worst that lies ahead to climb over that mtn. to get to greater rewards.

I have to credit my sisters who have children, that they each consciously adopted a different style of child discipline and showing non-verbally love for their children compared to our parents.

Badger did you ever read book/see movie, "The Joy Luck Club"? Parts abit sappy, but so true for some mother-daughter relationships.

[badger]

god, the Joy Luck Club was one of the most difficult films I ever watched (or read). It was so painfully familiar to me.

The cultural differences definitely played a huge part in the difficulties we had and still have. My mother's Japanese; I was born there and moved to Canada when I was 10 (my dad, incidentally is from Europe so Canada was foreign to all of us). So when I adopted the Canadian lifestyle and mentality, the years through my teens were exceptionally difficult. Good girls in Japan don't do half the things I did, so it was really hard trying to grow up in my household.

I left home at 20, which wasn't soon enough. My parents left for Japan again at that point, and we essentially became strangers. They moved back to Canada 3 years ago, and we have a tentative relationship that can easily get unbalanced if I spend too much time with my mother. I went to Las Vegas with her just this week and it was at times very trying.

We're not close at all, and that's tough but we manage the best we can. So yeah, the Joy Luck Club hits way too close to home.