Would the Devinci Silverstone Sl 3 be an okay touring bike (credit card touring)?

[bikecanada]

I am looking at this bike to use as a road bike/light touring perhaps. It has ultegra rear derailleurs, tiagra in the front, cassette is HG50 9s 13-25T, crankset= FSA vero Powerdrive 50/34T, tiagra front and back shifters, tektro r310 duaal pivot with adjustable angle brakes.
I would probably be carrying 20lbs if I was to go touring on it, and it has eyelets. Would it be okay though in the mountains with 20lbs attached (the cassette)?

Or should I spend a bit more and get the Silverstone Sl4?


Thanks!

[Grog]

It really depends on the size of the mountain and the size of the engine (your ability as a climber). And are you really going to be just carrying 20 lbs?

If you're going to have any kind of long climbs (more than a few kilometers), in my humble opinion, you should get a triple chainring (AND a cassette that goes to 27). I consider myself a decent climber and I really like to have my triple when I go climb hills in North Vancouver (the Cypress hill climb is 11 km long but I use the triple a lot more than just there). Your legs and especially your knees will thank you for being able to spin, especially on multi-day trips.

[bikecanada]

So would the silverstone 4 be adequate for longer hills? It has shimano 105 5600 10 speed 12-25t for a cassette and crankset is fsa gossamer mega exo 50/34t.

[Grog]

So would the silverstone 4 be adequate for longer hills? It has shimano 105 5600 10 speed 12-25t for a cassette and crankset is fsa gossamer mega exo 50/34t.

I hope it doesn't sound rude, but being "adequate for longer hills" doesn't have very much to do with the make and model of the bike or the luxuriousness of the componentry (105 in this case), and your question cannot be answered by a yes or no.

It has everything to do with:
1) The type of hill (what is a "long hill" for me might not be one for you and vice versa), i.e. how long and how steep;
2) The engine (YOU, your strength, relative to the load you're going to be carrying, how comfortable you are on hills, your experience)
3) The gearing (in this case the 12-25 cassette and the 50/34 chainring).

In my previous message, I suggested you get a triple chainring (so NOT a compact double 50/34) and a cassette that goes up to 27 (not a 12-25) in the back. That is based on what I would do if I was going to go touring on a road bike. I consider myself fairly fit and a pretty good hill climber, and I carry no extra weight on my body (and rarely any weight on my road bike). But I like to spin. And I know that over many days one can be hurt by having to pedal gears too big.

I know a few people that do with a compact double (such as the 50/34 you mention) for long climbs (crossing of the Alps, without any luggage) but they are all men and also pretty strong cyclists.

So, to try to answer your question: is it adequate for long hills?

IF:
- you are very fit, and can keep up with the strongest men on 5 km + hills (5% grade and more), and have knees of steel, and will not go on trips of more than 3-5 days, and will never ever carry more than 15-20 pounds (including the rack, the weight of the panniers, and the content of the panniers), then it is possible that the components on that bike will be adequate.

- you are reasonably fit but not necessarily capable of leaving the strong men in the dust, and there is a remote possibility that you will carry more than 20 lbs of weight and go for more than three days, then I would recommend that you get a bike with a triple chainring (50/40/30 sort of thing) and a cassette that goes to at least 27 in the back.

Of course this is also relative to the other uses you intend to make of that bike. If you want to do only one touring trip a year and want to race the rest of the time, the triple would be inadequate.

**

If this sounds jibberish jargon to you, perhaps you should visit the late and revered Sheldon Brown's web site for further information before you buy the bike (this section will get you started: http://sheldonbrown.com/gearing/index.html). The chainring and cassette are not parts that are inexpensively changed on bikes (especially the cranks and chainrings) so it's important to make an informed decision... I am giving you some advice here but you should really be making your own mind. Also note that men in bike shops sometimes tend to sell women bikes with too big gears (a regular double, such as a 52/39, and a 11-23 cassette), so informing yourself will be a good way to make a better decision and one that you will not regret. But of course every bike one buys is a learning experience... :)

[buddha_bellies]

I agree with Grog. I just got my road bike with a compact a few months back. The compact crank might be good if you're going up some shorter hills. But I am having problems going on longer hills. And that's me and my bike! No packs or racks. And I like to think I'm a pretty good at hills since I live in Vancouver and have been commuting on my mtn. bike for the last 12 odd years. But I do wish that I have a triple sometimes just so I can keep up with the boys on those long rides. I can't spin up the hill with the lowest gear (34 front and 28 back). So imagine if you have weight too.

One thing you might want is to try out a triple and a compact with some extra weight (backpack??). Try some hills (long and gentle and some short and steep). See which one you think you would like more.

Good Luck! Let us know what you end up getting.

[Grog]

Just to make sure things are clear:

Crank sets / Chaingings for road bikes
Compact double = 50/34 or similar (can be 50/35, for example)
Regular double = 52/39 or similar (can be 53/40 but I can't imagine the uses for that!)
Regular road triple = something like 50/40/30

For mountain bikes and hybrids all the numbers would be lower.

Touring bikes usually have a triple, and sometimes even a "mountain-style" triple if it's for loaded touring on long distance. (Not applicable to you probably.)


Further information:
Weight of a pair of pretty average panniers, empty: 1.6 kg or about 3 pounds
Weight of a fairly light rack, NOT heavy-duty: 500 g or about 1 pound



Yes, please keep us posted about what you end up doing!

[bikecanada]

Okay. Thanks for information. It should help a lot! I've been also looking at the 09 Giants (Defy), because that has a triple I believe on it. I was just looking at the Devinci too because it's the 08 and marked down...but I guess it might not work as well if I want to do some light touring with it later on.

[bikecanada]

But I don't see myself touring with it a lot. I actually would like to do a tour in Europe, in Tuscany Italy, in a couple of years, and that's the only one that I am planning to do.

[Grog]

But I don't see myself touring with it a lot. I actually would like to do a tour in Europe, in Tuscany Italy, in a couple of years, and that's the only one that I am planning to do.

My sweet partner and I are going to go ride in the Alps next summer, and we're taking our own bikes, but we're also going to have a car. Neither of us has a bike that's appropriate for touring, in my opinion. (He has a carbon fiber racing Trek and I have a small road bike on which I doubt I could fit a rack and panniers anyway.) All I will be carrying on the bike is a Carradice Nelson saddle bag (7 litres capacity) for a light lunch, downhill clothes, and tools. I have a triple and expect to need all the lower gears.

Think hard before rejecting the Silverstone, especially if it fits you well: if your touring plans are only very distant and foggy, you might be better off with a bike that will fit your needs right now.

[bikecanada]

Okay. Thanks for the advice. I guess I could also upgrade the bike to a triple later on. However, the Silverstone is only $150 or so less than the Giant Defy 1 or WSD Avail 1, which has pretty similar components. So I'm not sure which bike to go with yet... but your info definitely helps!
I heard the alps are definitely harder than Tuscany to ride. It sounds like a lot of fun though! My husband and I want to do a tour of Tuscany, but I think it'll be a couple of years because of school right now.

[ginny]

I just toured in Austria with my road bike (that has a triple). I consider myself very fit, and I walked her a few times. Those panniers make a huge difference. I would tour again on my bike if I had to, but the first thing I did when I got home was buy a real touring bike :) (also used for commuting and as a general 'townie').

Grog: for your trip, be sure to look into Lufthansa. When I flew, I was able to take my bike for free if I only checked one other piece of luggage. I was able to pick up a bike case on craig's list for less than half of what it cost new. Too bad you don't live closer, I would lend you mine...

[bikecanada]

Ginny, did you credit card tour? How long were you there for?
I am considering the triple right now, just because I might need it if I do load it up with a couple of panniers. However, it's not too hilly where I live. Do people go with compact cranks just because it looks better?

By the way, I was looking at the Giant bikes and there's a difference between the xs and small women's frames in top tube. Would a jump to 51cm from 52.5cm make a big difference? The shop I went to only has a small and would have to special order a xsmall (but then I have to put a payment down). I was thinking of the men's xsmall (ttube=51.5) but then I like the women's short reach shifters on the Avail1.
I am going to test the bikes again tomorrow and I will let you know if I like the Devinci that much more than the triple crank Giants

[Grog]

I am considering the triple right now, just because I might need it if I do load it up with a couple of panniers. However, it's not too hilly where I live. Do people go with compact cranks just because it looks better?

The advantage of a compact is that it has only two chainrings, so there's less shifting involved to reach the higher and lower gears. People who have no experience riding a triple sometimes find them finicky. (I always had a triple so I never noticed.) Compared to the regular double, it also replaces ridiculously high gear options (52X11) that most people don't use all that much, unless they go very very fast down hills, ride in 40kph + pelotons, or time trial, with somewhat easier gearing options (like a 34X25) that will help going up hills.



By the way, I was looking at the Giant bikes and there's a difference between the xs and small women's frames in top tube. Would a jump to 51cm from 52.5cm make a big difference? The shop I went to only has a small and would have to special order a xsmall (but then I have to put a payment down). I was thinking of the men's xsmall (ttube=51.5) but then I like the women's short reach shifters on the Avail1.

1.5 cm int he top tube is a BIG DIFFERENCE. Even as little as 1 cm can make the difference between tendonitis and no tendonitis.

[Grog]

Grog: for your trip, be sure to look into Lufthansa. When I flew, I was able to take my bike for free if I only checked one other piece of luggage. I was able to pick up a bike case on craig's list for less than half of what it cost new. Too bad you don't live closer, I would lend you mine...

Thanks ginny, that's a kind would-have-been offer :) We're going to France from Canada with Air Canada, on points. (Actually I don't think Lufthansa flies to Canada because it's a member of the same alliance as Air Canada, and going to Frankfurt would be a significant detour!) We already have soft bike bags - for this trip hard cases are not an option because there would be nowhere to put them for us. We're going to roll them and try to convince a Paris friend to keep them at his place while we're out of town!

[bikecanada]

Thanks Grog! I will have to try out the Devinci (52 ttube) and maybe think about the Giant Xs Defy1, because that at least is a 51.5 top tube. The Avail 1 in a small (52.5) is slightly too long. The other bike that I tested and liked was the Cannondale 6-13 3...and it had a 51.5cm top tube. The Cannondale is just too expensive for me right now though. That's why I was thinking of the Devinci or Giant Defy 1. However, the Devinci has the compact... do you know anyone that has changed their compact to a triple? Would it cost a lot?

So how long are you going to Europe for? Are you putting on front and back racks on your road bike? I would love to see pictures later, and I can't wait until I can go tour Italy :)

[bikecanada]

And I would only change the compact if I needed to later (if I moved or needed it for Itally or something). I definitely think the compact would be fine where I live (AB, Canada) because it's not too hilly and I dont ride in the mountains.

[buddha_bellies]

I would think real hard before you invest money to a bike. Changing a compact to a triple can be costly. My DH has a reg. crank set and was thinking of switching it to a compact. At least $350 before taxes and maybe more for other related parts he might need to change. It's a quite a bit of money.

[Grog]

Buddha_Bellies is right. It can be costly and not all switches are straightforward. Going from a double to a triple especially. (Changing between doubles can be easier, but certainly not cheap.)

We're going with no racks (save for my 7-litre saddlebag and perhaps one on my sweet partner's bike as well) and... a car. :( (Although driving in the mountains should be fun.) Pictures to follow... in many months!

[Cataboo]

Switching to a double will require - new cranks, new rear derailleur, and a new left shifter. And probably a new front derailleur. New cranks might require a new bottom bracket if it's not compatible with what's already on the bike.

[Triskeliongirl]

I don't know about these particular bikes, but these are the things I think you need to be looking at for a bike you want to use for touring:

1. Gearing. I tour with a 50/34 front, 11/34 rear, but can understand why some prefer a triple, especially for serious mountains and serious weight. Run the numbers through a gear calculator, and based on your abilities and the terrain make a choice.

2. Eyelets for racks and fenders if desired.

3. Accomodate wider tires for touring (28-32).

4. Comfort/fit.

[bikecanada]

Thanks for all the help! I decided to go for the Giant Avail 1 (green/white). It has eyelets on the back, a triple crankset and Shimano 105s. I went with an xs because the reach on the small felt a bit long. I haven't been able to take it out for a long ride though because it's snowing now!

[Grog]

Exciting stuff!

Can't wait to see pics of your touring trips! ;)

[buddha_bellies]

Congrats! We want photos!!! :D

[Tri Girl]

Can't wait to see it all decked out for touring. I'm sure there will be many, many adventures to tell us all about...:)

[bikecanada]

Thanks! It will probably be a while before it's going to be loaded, but I like that it has rear eyelets :) I will post a pic of it soon!
I'm thinking of switching the bar tape to something fun. It's white right now and the bike is white/green right now (like grass/primary green), so I wonder if celeste would work for a colour to go with it. I like pink, but it would be too 'Easter' I think :p

[ginny]

Sorry guys, I have been away for a while... I was moving... I HATE moving. Anyway, I did credit card tour in Austria, but I brought a very small one person tent (maybe would go with a small two person next time - one person is TOO small), blow up squshy pad and pillow and a sleeping bag. I'm glad I did too, because I didn't have reservations at all (you just kind of stop at whatever road house people recommend), and the first night I arrived around 9pm to find out that there was no room at the inn. Rather than sleeping in the barn... they let me camp (they didn't have a barn). :)

So, I have recently been experiencing the oddities associated with triple chain rings. I like having a triple, but due to the small size that most women ride and therefore the shorter wheel base, I guess the geometry is odd on the triples from time to time. What I mean is, in my middle chain ring (in front), I thought I could use all the cogs in the rear, but on my road bike, I cannot. When I get to the biggest cogs in the rear (i.e., the easiest gears), I start experiencing problems. Apparently with the geometry of the bike, this configuration acts sort of like being cross chained. Would I go with a double next time? good question... I like the various gearing ratios of the triple, but you have to be more careful. Having said that, my touring bike doesn't have the same problems, but the wheel base is significantly longer.

I also would love to see picts :)

[Grog]

I like having a triple, but due to the small size that most women ride and therefore the shorter wheel base, I guess the geometry is odd on the triples from time to time. What I mean is, in my middle chain ring (in front), I thought I could use all the cogs in the rear, but on my road bike, I cannot. When I get to the biggest cogs in the rear (i.e., the easiest gears), I start experiencing problems. Apparently with the geometry of the bike, this configuration acts sort of like being cross chained.

Being in the middle chainring + biggest or smallest cog in the back will definitely induce rubbing of the chain on the derailer cage, and should be avoided. I don't think that's especially specific to small bikes, but I can see how it could be made worse by a shorter chain.

[bikecanada]

Here is a picture of my new bike. I would like to change the bar tape sometime to make it 'unique' but not sure what colour yet. Maybe a light purple to make it girly, or maybe a celeste green?

[Grog]

Veeerrrrrrry pretty! Great purchase!

Have you ridden it on the road yet?

[Tri Girl]

I love the sleek lines and the green. Really stands out! Purple might look neat with the green (I guess it depends on the shade), but a brown leather tape might look really classy also. Hmmmm... decisions, decisions... :)

[bikecanada]

Yeaah, the leather would be classic, but I think I might do something fun. We'll see though...
I haven't taken it for a long ride yet. I have just taken it around the block. It's been kind of cold and now I'm sick.