SADD that time of the year

[TahoeDirtGirl]

I feel kind of silly even writing this, but I need help. It's that time of the year that I love which is autumn but right after that is when the sun goes on vacation. I am going to probably be moving to the east coast and right now, I need to find a way to deal with winter. I just couldn't cope last year. I thought that SADD was a joke but it isn't!

I have read and read about lights that you can use but I just don't want to buy something that isn't going to work. I don't get downright depressed, it's like, I need sun. Short of going to a tanning bed every day, what can I do? I would love to hear from someone else that has used the lights or found some other way to deal with it.

One way of dealing with it is I'm going to suck it up and bike all winter. No matter what. Last year I curled up and didn't ride outside for months. That just isn't going to happen this year!

Enjoy the days while they are still long enough!

[indysteel]

I've never tried the lights, but I do try to get outside in the winter as much as I can. Unfortunately, I don't live in a winter wonderland type of a place. Indianapolis gets wet and cold in the winter, but we don't get enough snow frequently enough to allow for skiing or snowshoeing, and I'm not a big fan of riding in temps lower than 35 degrees. So last year I took up running again after a long hiatus from it. I think it helped. I at least made it to February without totally losing it. I also exercised in general as much as I could and really stuck to my schedule in that regard. There was no "but wouldn't it be nice to just go home after work and snuggle with my cats."

Still, I think it would help me if I scheduled a long weekend or vacation in February/early March. That's usually about the time I start to really climb the walls. And I'd be willing to try to lights if my SADD continues to worsen as I get older.

[sundial]

One way of dealing with it is I'm going to suck it up and bike all winter. No matter what.

I think that's what saved me last year. I cycled through the winter except for 3 weeks in February. Tanning beds don't seem to do anything for me as well as being near windows. What helped me more than anything was getting outside--whether it was on the bike or walking the dogs. All I needed was about 30 minutes a day and I did much better. I have talked to my gyne about meds for SADD and I do have an Rx for the winter months, just in case I need it.

[Kalidurga]

There was no "but wouldn't it be nice to just go home after work and snuggle with my cats."

But how do you find the willpower to fight that urge? That's been my problem. I also don't get depressed as in dejected or sad, but I do feel physically and mentally pressed down, like there's something making me lethargic and unmotivated. Sometimes, no amount of internal pep talks or yelling at myself to "just do it!" works. How do you convince yourself to get the heck up and get moving?

[Crankin]

The trick is to just get outside. You don't have to ride, just get outside and walk, hike, snow shoe.
My friend uses the lights and they are successful, but she doesn't exercise.

[Kalidurga]

The trick is to just get outside.

I've considered trying the lights just to get me energized and motivated enough to even make it that far. For me, it's not just the shorter winter days, it's also any day that's grey and overcast. I look out the window and don't have any urge to even open the front door.

Thanks for starting this thread, TahoeDirtGirl. I've thought of asking this question, too, so I appreciate you taking the plunge.

[michelem]

TahoeDirtGirl,

I HEAR YOU!!! I have the same problem. Last year my doc recommended light therapy. I bogged myself down with researching and never bought anything (they are EXPENSIVE). However, this year I am going to do it. This is what she prescribed: "High intensity (10,000 lux), broad spectrum lights 30 min. exposure to your pupils at dawn and dusk (as a minimum) or visor most of the time."

A tanning bed is not going to do it, besides the fact that it raises your risk of skin cancer. Also, 30 minutes outdoors isn't going to do it either here in Northern California . . . especially during rainy/foggy season. The sun just isn't intense enough during winter months if you have diagnosable SAD (Seasonal Affective Disorder).

Good luck to you! I'm hoping that my flexible spending account will reimburse me since it is prescribed by my doc, but I've heard it is VERY difficult to get the lights covered by insurance or FSA's.

[SlowButSteady]

Tanning beds have always helped me. I only get in for a few minutes several times a week. I can tell a difference after I go about twice.

[Mr. Bloom]

Since moving from the Tennessee to Indiana, I have seriously bad SADD. The lights do help. You can also get Full Spectrum bulbs in your normal lights to help as well, but they can be harsh and not very 'warm'. You have to get the high intensity lights on your face for them to work well.

I also have a south facing window in my office that makes ALL the difference in the world. When my office window was north facing for four years, I was borderline suicidal around January/February.

The tanning beds do genuinely help, but you need a lot of it...and I'm not a big fan of winter-time false tans...(or burns)...so focus on safer alternatives.

A winter vacation to the Caribbean might help as well.

[NbyNW]

+1 to getting outside as much as possible.

I grew up on the east coast and now live in Seattle. Short days in winter are hard anywhere, but at least on the east coast you get an occasional sun break, even if the temperature is low. Take advantage of those days.

I got one of those little LCD lights from Costco last winter, and I feel like it's better than coffee for helping me get up in the morning. Trouble with it is, the feature that would have it turn on automatically only works when it is plugged in, and it makes a high-pitched electrical hissing noise when it's in sleep mode. And I can't listen to that when I'm trying to sleep. So I charge it in another room, and I still have to drag myself out of bed in order to get, say, 15 minutes of exposure to it. After that, I'm good to go.

[TahoeDirtGirl]

Yeah it's definately on it's way. I was starting to feel that "snuggle up with the dog" feeling on the couch yesterday evening driving home from work. And yes, right around Feb I'm ready to just scream and throw dishes at the calendar.

Last year I just didn't know where to ride or what to do, or was afraid of it being too cold. I just said the heck with it and started riding while it was still cooler and was kicking myself because it wasn't *that bad*.

In Tahoe, we get alot of sun. Plus with the snow, it's like being microwaved. It's always light in my house because of the snow. But here on the East Coast I'm like...where did it gooooo??? I actually like the change of seasons, in Tahoe it's Summer, then winter. I like the rain. But at some point I'm pulling out my hair.

I actually have to go to the Dominican Republic for my neice's wedding in January...so maybe that will help!

I went to a tanning bed once and for 3 minutes I was fantasizing of riding my bike in the Nevada desert...but I sizzled for 2 days straight. That wasn't so good.

I will check out the full spectrum lights- I talked to my doctor out here about this and my insane PMS which seems to be getting better with the reduction of sugar and increase in weight training- but I don't like pills unless I just can't survive without them. He wasn't real helpful on either case. I miss my California doc. His answer would be to move back! Haha...

So now I'm debating ...illuminite commuter jacket (retail 89 bucks) or full spectrum light (about the same)...what to do... :)

It is funny about the getting outside point...I don't get the urge to walk my dog in the morning until fall hits. This summer, I hardly walked her in the a.m. Now I am back on track to walking her in the a.m. I think subconsciously the brain is trying to get me outside...

As for how to get off the couch...I will continue with the 'groceries only enter the house on the back of a bike'. You will not believe how well that has cleaned up my eating!

[JaneE]

I have experienced SADD for years and years. Some years it seems to be worse than others, for whatever reason.

I do have a light. I confess I don't use it religiously.

What seems to help me more than anything else is forcing myself (yeah, sometimes I really have to kick myself in the butt) to get outside in the daylight and go for a walk. That can frequently be a challenge around here: semi-rural, no sidewalks, mostly no shoulders on the roads; when there's a lot of snow it's a big issue.

I also fantasize about spring a lot. ;)

[sundial]

So now I'm debating ...illuminite commuter jacket (retail 89 bucks) or full spectrum light (about the same)...what to do... :)

Illuminite--so you can do all that riding. ;) You're a tough chick and I know you'd rather be outside on the trail. I rode in temps of 20 F last winter and it really wasn't too bad as long as I had my feet, head, and hands warm enough. I dug out my silky underwear, a wool jersey and my fuzzy, warm tights and away I went.

[Mr. Bloom]

I will check out the full spectrum lights

Look for 10,000 lux and remember that you need it at close proximity on your face (about 12-15 inches) for 15 minutes/day...use it like a reading light. I fear that the good ones may cost more than you expect...Silver's was > $300...

[blueskies]

I started taking vitamin D (D3) last winter & it made a big difference.

[hirakukibou]

I have a light meant to treat SADD. I think it helps. I used it in the morning when I have my coffee. It doesn't completely "cure" my depression which I struggle with even in the summer, but it does take the winter edge away.

[TahoeDirtGirl]

sundial- you would be so proud. I went out and rode in the rain for an hour. I swear I have never been in rain that intense. I rode for about an hour on trails with plenty o roots. I made it and the guy I rode with likes to ride in the winter. I can't believe how much better I felt, except I still had that sleepy feeling I get when it's cloudy...one day at a time...:)

[Mr. Bloom]

Outstanding!

[CyclaSutra]

You might check with your local mental health organization. Our community counseling center has an outreach office called Mountain House, and they have full-spectrum lights that anyone can walk in and use. Yes, we live in an uber-rich resort community, so my idea of normal is skewed, but it wouldn't hurt to check and see if you can "borrow" a light instead of having to buy! You also might advertise on Craigslist or somewhere that you need one, and someone might give it to you for cheap or free.

[Flur]

I've had SAD since I was in college. Before I knew what it was I referred to it as "the slide down into the dark." I had a really hard time with college winter break, which was 6 weeks long in December and January.

I've found that what helps best is getting outside as much as possible. I've also found the exercise helps, and outdoor exercise is the best of all. Having a project that you can work on when indoors helps too.

[TahoeDirtGirl]

Another thing I found that is helping as the days get shorter is I switched to using soy milk. I get PMS so bad it's ridiculous and I noticed that this is the first month I didn't get 'the week before' craziness I always feel. It's actually a fluke that I started drinking soy milk but I'm glad I did. When aunt flo arrived I thought...whoa...what happened to 'the week before'??? I think it was more my mood that kept me from riding than the weather. I'll just keep riding and riding and riding. I also bought a TriNewt light so I can ride in the dark. Maybe I should just shine that on me?!

[Red Rock]

Thankyou all for this thread. I do not know if I actually have this or not but since I have been back in school and working at the same time, my grads have been worse during the winter months. Summer semester, which is usually the most diffucult, has been "easy" so to speak.

When I was a kid growing up, I did not notice these things as much. I will take the advise given here and try to be outside for a half and hour at least a day, somehow.

Red Rock

[NbyNW]

Another thing I found that is helping as the days get shorter is I switched to using soy milk. I get PMS so bad it's ridiculous and I noticed that this is the first month I didn't get 'the week before' craziness I always feel. It's actually a fluke that I started drinking soy milk but I'm glad I did. When aunt flo arrived I thought...whoa...what happened to 'the week before'??? I think it was more my mood that kept me from riding than the weather. I'll just keep riding and riding and riding. I also bought a TriNewt light so I can ride in the dark. Maybe I should just shine that on me?!

I'm not too familiar with the science of it, but as I understand it soy has phyto-estrogens than some women respond well too. On the other hand, some people find soy proteins impossible to digest . . .

For PMS, especially in the winter months, I've had pretty good luck with Women's Phase I supplement by Vitanica:

http://www.vitanica.com/supplements_05.htm

My mom introduced me to tofu & soy milk at a pretty young age, so I really have no idea whether I am better off with or without it. All I know is some people have had very positive experiences with it and others have had negative experiences. I guess I'm just in the middle and it's something I like to eat from time to time.

The literature in the light that I bought says that there are specific frequencies of light that help us to wake up. I'm not sure if a TriNewt would have those frequencies.

[crazycanuck]

Well, it's almost here. We down under have spent the last 4 months in our winter & am so happy it's almost summer. WAHOOOOOEYY!!!

During the blech months (June-Sept) I don't change many routines. I bike/swim when it's still dark out. Our group swims at an outdoor pool that's naturally heated. I'm a wee bit crazy.

I crave the days there's beautiful blue skies & spend as much time outside as possible. I did the exact same thing when I lived in Canada. Embrace the sun, a nice book, friends etc & you'll get through winter!

C

[michelem]

Well, with all the fog we've been having lately as well as it getting dark by 5pm, I decided to go ahead and follow my doc's recommendation to purchase a 10,000 lux broad spectrum lamp. It looks like a desk lamp so I can use it at work, but it is also portable enough that I can bring it home to use in the evenings and on weekends. I'm supposed to start by using it 30 min. AM and 30 min. PM. I'll let you know how it goes once I receive it and start using it. Thankfully it has a 30-day money back guarantee in case I don't notice a difference. These things are VERY expensive! But, it will be worth the cost if I don't end up feeling like crapola by February.

[Velobambina]

I suffer from SADD, too. This year, I bought a "happy light" that I use every morning at work. It seems to be helping. You can find them at www.verilux.com (I think that's the manufacturer). I bought mine from Giaim but later found out that verilux sells them directly.

I also started taking 1000 iu/day of vitamin D.

Only 12 more days until we start adding minutes of sunlight to the day. :)

[eclectic]

I don't suffer from SAD per se but I HATE getting up in the dark every morning so I purchased a "dawn simulator"

http://www.fullspectrumsolutions.com/dawn_simulator_17_ctg.htm

(scroll down to see it)

I LOVE it ! ! ! ! It is a much more gentle way to wake up and I wake up ready to go instead of groggy.

I also try to swim 3 or 4 days per week in the AM - for some reason the bright lights and water of the pool work as therapy for me (I hardly ever swim in the summer.) It makes going out in -20 F weather much more bearable.
I swim in the pool where I work so it isn't too much of a stretch.

[Tokie]

I tried the full spectrum light - it gave me freckling and my opthamologist was not happy that I was using it - he could not endorse that it was not harmful to my eyes -:eek:- something to consider!!!! I tried Wellbutrin for 2 winters, if it helped it seemed like the placebo effect (not much help) this summer my MD put me on Vitamin D (Ergoclaciferol 50,000 units one capsule per week). He put me on it after testing my blood vitamin D level which was low normal. I am on it for my osteoporosis, but doc says this type of vitamin D therapy is now linked to prevention of colon cancer and other chronic illnesses. All I can say is that my SAD has never been better! It is fabulous. My doctor was puzzled, but I am a believer! Tokie

[michelem]

Hi Tokie,

Thanks for that information. I checked with my opthamologist, as well as my dermatologist, and both agreed that the type of light I purchased will not harm my eyes or skin. Whew!

As for the vitamin d, I was tested with a severe deficiency myself. My last test showed I am nearing normal. I believe it is improving my mood as well. :D

[salsabike]

The vitamin D thing seems to be the new piece of knowledge of the day for me. I got an email from a close friend about it two days ago--same thing, severe deficiency, prescribed the once-a-week megadose. Saw my rheumatologist today and she raised it and we had blood drawn to test it. There's a great Johns Hopkins article about its role in arthritis and pain. I had no idea till I got that email two days ago.

http://www.hopkins-arthritis.org/arthritis-news/2007/affects-of-vitamin-d-on-rheumatoid-arthritis.html

And, PS, I got an alarm clock for my other close friend back east that does the dawn simulator thing and she says it's a huge help. She's an ICU nurse that does 12 hour shifts, and has to get up at 5:30 am--hard in those NY winters.

[sundial]

sundial- you would be so proud. I went out and rode in the rain for an hour. I swear I have never been in rain that intense. I rode for about an hour on trails with plenty o roots. I made it and the guy I rode with likes to ride in the winter. I can't believe how much better I felt, except I still had that sleepy feeling I get when it's cloudy...one day at a time...:)

You deserve a big hug! http://bestsmileys.com/hugging/4.gif

I started craving carbs by September and I'm trying to hit the woods at least 2 times a week. So far it's working great! I really think we underestimate how important sunlight is to our health and well being. Just tell yourself you only need 30 minutes outside and hopefully that will keep you motivated.

[Miranda]

I get SADD too. I'm sitting here with all the window shades/blinds/curtains in my house completely cranked open. DH goes through and pulls the mini-blinds to the slatted position. I tromp back through and pull the things ALL THE WAY UP. Let as much light in anywhere as possible.

I know this has nothing to do with light, but I find feeding my outdoor birds helps. I have several kinds of feeders right on my patio where I can watch them. Plus a heated bird bath. They are so happy to eat and drink. Outside-- freezing to death. Still trying to make the best of it. Something about watching nature thrive in winter uplifts my lack of light depression:).

[Selkie]

Less than a week before the days start getting longer!!

[sundial]

I haven't been outside in 4 days and I'm getting buggy. I really want to play in the sleet but my bike won't appreciate it. :rolleyes:

[Red Rock]

I am excitied for the days to be getting longer too! Yea. I look forward to that as much as anything else this time of year. When we have had nice days around here, I have tried to make an effort to go for walks for about an hour or so. I think I have been a happier camper also.

[michelem]

Still waiting for my lamp . . . these rainy, dark days are really wearing on me. Plus, I'm thinking that some of it is post-marathon let-down as well . . . :(

[sundial]

Can you get outside for 30 minutes or so?

[michelem]

sundial,

I have no desire to go outside when it is dark and rainy! :Yesterday, the sun was out for a portion of the day so I went out to my car during lunch as a way to get some sunlight through the car windows, but protect myself from the cold wind. Pretty much every day for the past two weeks has been either foggy or rainy . . . not much sunlight whatsoever. My lamp is supposed to arrive tomorrow! :)

[salsabike]

Three more days... :)

[Kalidurga]

I have no desire to go outside when it is dark and rainy! :Yesterday, the sun was out for a portion of the day so I went out to my car during lunch as a way to get some sunlight through the car windows, but protect myself from the cold wind. Pretty much every day for the past two weeks has been either foggy or rainy . . . not much sunlight whatsoever.

That's it exactly. It's very easy to recommend that someone with SADD just go spend some time outside, but if the weather's crappy that ain't gonna do much good 'cause the crappy weather is a contributing factor. I can't tell you how many days off I've had when it's been grey, drizzly and/or cold, then the clouds break and the sun comes out on the day I go back to work. I could go out and ride or hike on those grey, drizzly days, but the weather conditions end up affecting my mood and leave me feeling as gloomy as the sky looks.

I'm very interested in hearing what results you get from your lamp, michelem.

[Selkie]

Kali - I got a Verilux happy light this year, and I use it every morning when I arrive at work. I also started taking Vitamin D. Both have helped. I've actually thought about getting a happy light for home, too.

The weather here has been so dreary and not at all conducive to being outside, which has not helped at all. Raining again today and predicted for Sunday, Christmas Eve, etc. Take it easy on yourself. Do something sinful, like bake cookies and eat a few of them. ;) T

[Kalidurga]

Raining again today and predicted for Sunday, Christmas Eve, etc.

Yeah, mickchick, I've been avoiding looking at the forecast since I saw those predictions, since those are, of course, my only days off in the coming week.

One thing I have been doing that I think might be helping is meditation. I recently began meditating in the mornings for other reasons than SADD. Since then, I've had several crappy weather days off. I've still had zero motivation to do any kind of exercise on those days (which makes sinful cookies a bad idea!), but I have noticed that I've been less morose. This doesn't surprise me as meditation is known to improve mood, so I'm going to keep track of how this progresses.

Still considering one of those "happy lamps" too, though, just in case.

[sundial]

sundial,

I have no desire to go outside when it is dark and rainy!

I assumed you lived in an area that didn't get much rain. ;)

[sundial]

It's very easy to recommend that someone with SADD just go spend some time outside....

I've got it too. I wasn't trying to be flippant about it.

[michelem]

I assumed you lived in an area that didn't get much rain. ;)

I'm learning that this is a common misperception of people who aren't familiar with Northern California. They think it is all sunshine and beaches out here -- HAH!!! :rolleyes:

[Kalidurga]

I've got it too. I wasn't trying to be flippant about it.

No, no, I didn't think you were. It's totally natural for people to make suggestions of possible remedies, so I do think that every recommendation in this thread has been made with thoughtful and caring intentions. It's doubly natural for someone who's had similar experiences and found something that works for them to then pass that info on. But there are so many different degrees of severity and variations in symptom to these things. I was just making the point (less diplomatically than I should have, I guess) that, for some of us, the hardest thing is finding the will to force ourselves to do any sort of activity, whether the weather sucks or not.

[Kalidurga]

Yay for the solstice...

[Tokie]

Double yay for the solstice! Tokie

[Selkie]

Past the solstice. Outside, it's 19 degrees with a windchill of 3.

[MerryKate39]

That's it exactly. It's very easy to recommend that someone with SADD just go spend some time outside

I'm also a SADD sufferer, and I've read up a lot on the problem. It may seem like a simple answer, but being outside on a gloomy/rainy day actually nets you more lumens than being indoors by a lamp. An overcast day is about 1,000 lumens; the average lamp is about 100. Even 10 minutes of outdoor light can improve your mood. This does seem to be a particularly bad year, tho, because it's been so cold!

I personally use a Verilux light, especially on overcast days. I found a 10,000 lumen light on Amazon for only $130 (with a sale); they also have 5,000 lumen lights for less than $100. The difference is the amount of time it takes to get the benefit. With a 5,000 lumen light you might need to spend several hours using it; with a 10,000 lumen light 30 to 90 minutes will do the trick. Contrary to what you see on tv, you don't sit staring into it or (worse still) sit in front of it with your eyes closed. You can read, do your makeup, eat breakfast, etc. The only limit is that you don't want to use it too late at night because it will throw off your circadian rhythms and you'll wind up with insomnia. I like to use it in my bathroom while I get ready for work in the morning, because the light bouncing off the mirrors amplifies the effect.

I've found a combination of vitamins and calcium helps a lot, too, especially D3, B-50 and folic acid. (All of which you'll find in a good multivitamin.) Hope this helps.

[lph]

Hi folks - I've just been reading up on this thread and one thing really impresses me. Many of you know what this is, can see it coming, and DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. That is really inspiring. I don't feel as bad every winter, but I don't like Christmas or the holidays much for a multitude of reasons, the main ones being that all the things that keep me sane and happy are taken away for two weeks at a time - regular routine, regular exercise, healthy food, my friends, interacting with normal upbeat adults all day long. I know I "should" just enjoy my family and the time off, but I enjoy doing things outdoors and going places with my close family, not running around shopping frantically and then eating vast amounts of food and sweets with my extended family, and staying indoors for hours and hours and HOURS. Going outdoors doesn't help much, because Oslo in December is usually dark, very dark, wet or icy. We have maybe 4 or 5 hours of daylight.

Sorry for the rant :D, cause I'm back at work and much better, but anyway: the stress of the holidays can really get to me and did this year, plunging me into a pathetic, black, selfpitying, morose mood for several days. And I just can't see it coming in time to kick myself up and go get a lamp, or go away for Christmas or something. This time I've vowed not to be home on Christmas at all next year, and I really hope I can keep that.

[michelem]

Right now I am sitting in front of my new broad-spectrum lamp for 30 minutes befor leaving for work. I'll sit in front of it for at least another 30 minutes when I get home. I've been doing this for 10 days now and it is nothing short of a miracle. I really didn't think it would provide such instant relief. The lamp was very pricey (over $200). I can't say whether I would have gotten FSA reimbursement for it (with drs. prescription), as I'd already maxed out that money for 2008. I just couldn't hold off 'til 2009 to purchase it as my SAD symptoms were causing me to rapidly deteriorate. I feel like a new person! :D