Tyler

[SadieKate]

It was just announced that he received a 2 year ban but will be allowed to keep his Gold Medal. There is an appeal process.

I'm not sure what to think or feel at this point.

[spazzdog]

Well, one thing for sure, he's finished. Unfortunately he doesn't have the same spirit that Lance embodied and I will be surprised if any team will touch him after this.

It's a shame, this doping thing. The whole "have to because everybody does" has truly grown old. I keep remembering what my parents (and perhaps yours) would say to me after I did something stupid and responded "Well, everybody else was doin' it"

They're response: If everybody jumped off a cliff, would you? Well Noooooo, I'd say.

This cliff is drawing to many lemmings.

[SadieKate]

You know, I've been wondering what would happen if the teams were fined also. The riders are obviously are getting personal pressure from somewhere and someone is aiding and abetting. I also don't understand why only some riders have random mandatory testing (as in Lance). Why isn't everyone subjected to this?

[Veronica]

Maybe I'm crazy, but I just don't believe he did it. My understanding of the test is that it's based on probablity - which means bell shaped curve. There are going to be athletes who have a huge amount of oxygen in their blood. These guys are freaks :D when you think about how far they ride and how fast. They are not going to fit the norm.

Tyler has always struck me as a fairly levelheaded, practical person ('cause you know, I know him personally right - insert sarcastic face.) I just can't imagine him shooting up with someone else's blood - funny if it were Lance I would believe it. Think of the risks involved - the diseases you could get. It just seems insane.

If I were him - or any other world class athlete- I'd be getting these tests done every week, so I could have a baseline to prove my innocence when the doping lynch mob comes for me.

Let's see who is doing well this year... I predict Bobby Julich or Tom Boonen are going to get doping accusations next. Sorry MM - I really hope that doesn't happen. It's just ugly.

V.

[spazzdog]

Everyone is subject to it... random testing that is. Everyone who places (not sure how deep) in a race is tested.

The thing is certain concoctions will clear faster than others.

Then there's the handling of the samples. And it goes on.

I'm sorry, but my feeling is this: all sports from high school through and including pro sports should be governed by WADA. I have no sympathy for doping at any level.

And the "I didn't know I was taking it" defense doesn't fly with me either. These athletes know their bodies better than anybody. Think they might notice a sudden "burst" of speed, strength, developement after they started getting their "vitamins" from good ole Tony or Bob or Sam?

Tyler, and all the others are big grown up boys.

And if it turns out Lance ever doped, which I really hope he didn't... he looses the entire bag of respect as well.

[Bike Goddess]

Spazz- as usual you hit the nail (or should I say needle here) on the head! Ditto for me too!

I have no sympathy for anyone who messes around with this stuff period. :( :(

[Veronica]

Have you read this?

Tyler's Diary (http://www.roadcycling.com/news/article1029.shtml)

The tests are too inconclusive. Plus all that stuff with the extortionist? Too weird.

V.

[jobob]

I'm with V - I don't believe he did it either. I've read the scientific journal articles describing the test and I can see a bunch of ways it could have been royally f'd up. It's a difficult assay.

And spazz, I'd love to know what on earth you mean by "he doesn't have the same spirit that Lance embodied" ?

- Jo.

[doc]

How can an athlete be happy with his/her win if he/she knows it comes only because of illegal assistance? How can anyone be proud who is a cheater? I must be a simpleton, but I wouldn't feel like a winner if I cheated my way over the finish line.

It does remind me of a very funny story. Does anyone remember Rosie Ruiz? She "won" the boston marathon and didn't even look tired or sweaty. So the officials started reviewing the tapes from the check points and surprise surprise, she wasn't there. She took the subway and then jumped into the race 1/2 mile from the finish line. 1/2 mile!!! Geez. It gets even more ridiculous. They then went back to review her excellent time in the earlier New York marathon. Yup, you guessed it, she took the subway there too. Crazy! What is the point?

[spazzdog]

Sorry for earlier aggressiveness...

This subject just burns me up. I sat here a couple of weeks ago and watched the Senate hearing on drugs and baseball. Now theres an impotent system (and that pun WAS intended).

But I fear it will go the way of many other issues... it made great sound bites on the news, this "working for the safety of our kids" angle, but when it comes down to it, pro sports is about money. And money becomes about politics.

Unless a "level" playing field is forced with the standard being set by WADA, and then those regulations are enforced, then this is not going away.

Now, back to regular programming...

[slinkedog]

Yeah, I don't believe he did it either. I get the update email from his foundation's site and all the crud that's been going on is just too weird. If you read from the link that Veronica posted, it just all seems odd. I feel really bad for this guy. One of Blaine's closest friends (our best man) used to race against Tyler in Jr's and has the highest regard for him. (Except that he used to crash a lot and bring down the whole field!) Says he was always a real stand-up guy and totally without arrogance. I know that doesn't mean he doesn't dope, but character matters in my book.

[CorsairMac]

BJ just posted a link to www.tylerhamilton.com where Tyler made some very interesting points. I don't think Tyler is guilty. As he states on his homepage - why would he risk his own personal health and that of his wife for something that stupid? - and I agree why?

[spazzdog]

Here's one -

one of the cycling mags (can't remember, sorry) spoke of an unpublicized meeting btwn Lance and an Italian judge, then comes Lance's retirement and Tyler's sentence.


no connection... you be the judge (insert theme from X-files here)


I would like to think our U.S. cyclists are innocent... but in looking at sports in general, it's ludicrous to think our guys are above the behavior. Look at Olympic Track & Field... Swimming... name a sport. We have U.S. athletes across the spectrum using any edge they can get. It's disappointing yes, but surprising... not at all.

[Jo-n-NY]

First I want to thank all that sent links. You just gave me some good reading material for me during my lunch hour.

Hear this about Tyler just left me with my mouth open and feel completely saddened by it. But, I am a person that truely believes there are two sides to every story and I choose not to come to any conclusions just yet. I guess I am also optimistic.

And just for my opinion on Lance, when he decided to ride this tour I figured he would retire after it just to start enjoying a different type of life style. I recently read both his books learned much about him. Although I learned that he was on the cocky side in his younger years, I also believe that with all the testing this guy goes through "randomly all year" (not just during racing) that if he was using, they would have found it. If what he says he goes through as far as testing goes is not true, I am sure some one that does the testing especially the french would have spoken up. When they stopped him from taking his wife to the hospital when she went into labor to draw blood I just through up my hands and said "give it up already, the guy just works hard to be the rider that he is."

Well, this is all just my view. Others might disagree and that is ok. Just thought I would add my two cents. ~ Jo

[Adrien]

And if it turns out Lance ever doped, which I really hope he didn't... he looses the entire bag of respect as well.


Oh, I think he has. I absolutely think he has. Maybe not in the past few years, but certainly in his past. Think about how he answers the question "Have you ever doped?" He doesn't say "No, never.", he says "I've never failed a drug test."

Honestly, I think most of them do, or have in the past. I also think Lance, though certainly an amazing cyclist, has had some sort of help along the way. I don't necessarily think he dopes in the conventional sense, but I think they have other methods to help him that can't be tested. Think about it: one of his major endorsements deals is with a pharmaceutical company. I think they have all kinds of stuff for the big money guys that's way ahead of conventional testing.

This is all speculation, of course.

As for Tyler, I don't know, man. I want so badly to believe he's innocent, but I really think it's an industry-wide problem, so there's no reason to completely rule out the possibility.

Sorry if my opinion is an unpopular one, I just don't think Lance is the superhero everyone makes him out to be. He's certainly an extremely talented cyclist and has done a lot for cancer research, but he's still just a guy who clearly wants very badly to win and to be on top. It means everything to him so I wouldn't be surprised if he had advanced methods to better his chances.

[Biking Chick]

I would like to think our U.S. cyclists are innocent... but in looking at sports in general, it's ludicrous to think our guys are above the behavior. Look at Olympic Track & Field... Swimming... name a sport. We have U.S. athletes across the spectrum using any edge they can get. It's disappointing yes, but surprising... not at all.

I agree spazzdog that it is disappointing to learn of yet another athlete who has tried to 'beat the system' so to speak. The announcement of Tyler's suspension was very sad ... watching Tyler take the TdF stage win with a broken collar bone was so very inspiring. Whether or not you believe the test results and if Tyler did or didn't artificially enhance his peformance, his reputation is certainly tarnished.

I don't buy the 'I didn't know I was taking it' (so-called) defense ... As disappointing as the whole athlete doping subject is what really gets me up on my soapbox are the athletes like Barry Bonds who sit in front of reporters and point the finger at the media and claim - you wanted to bring me and my family down and you finally did it.

After an announcement of a positive result from a drug test I would expect a period of denial - it would be a normal reaction to not wanting the public to *know*. But after the denial - if you have in fact used performance enhancing drugs - then I expect owning up to it, admitting it and moving on.

Does anyone know if any of the sports offers 'offenders' any type of counceling ... in WI if you are charged with OWI/DWI you are required to take manadatory alcholol counceling. From what I understand, performance enhancing drugs are not addictive (in the way alcohol or other drugs are) but wouldn't it make sense to help address the issue?

Spazz you're correct ... disappointing, yes - surprising, no.

Cindy in WI
Getting Off Her Soap Box

[slinkedog]

Adrien: I noticed that about Lance, too... that he always says that he's never failed a drug test. Makes me wonder. However, the pharmecutical company he endorses is the one that created the cancer meds that saved his life.

[aka_kim]

Velonews has a link to the full text of the decision: www.USAntidoping.org (http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/arbitration_rulings/AAA_CAS Decision - Hamilton.pdf). It's long, but it's really very interesting reading.

[Adrien]

However, the pharmecutical company he endorses is the one that created the cancer meds that saved his life.

No, I know this, I'm just pointing out that he has contacts. I'm sounding all conspiracy theory right now and I don't mean to, I just really don't think Lance has always been the drug-free angel he's made out to be.

[MightyMitre]

I'm with you Adrien. Tyler is great and I also really wanted to believe him but the longer I'm a cycling fan the more and more cynical I become. I'm Tyler fan but I can believe that he would dope - despite (as V pointed out) the fact that he seems so level headed and grounded.

It's sad to think that I'm pretty much prepared to hear Boonen allegations ( when they come, because they will, in one form or another.) I think the problem is that sporting values and the ethics of the true athlete that all of us amatures hold, are forced to lie next to what is essentially an industry. How can the honour of winning a one day classic (for example) lie next to the pressure from sponsors to win AT ALL COSTS?

Cyclists are caught in the middle - the audience wants to see an old fashioned hero, who battles though thick and thin, who beats his rivals fairly and squarely on a level playing field. Sponsors on the other hand have no other interests other that how much money they can make from the guy who crosses the line first, while the cyclist is caught in the middle.

Tylers career is all but over now, but I still feel uncomfortable that someones whole career can be based on the accuracy of a blood test. After all, who tests the work of the testers?
:(

[Veronica]

And that the results from different machines can be so different!

I have students who cheat - caught one yesterday. It's not something I understand.

V.

[robyn_jl]

Wow, thanks for the link to the actual report, aka-kim! I had pretty much assumed with great sadness that Tyler must be guilty, but I have to say the dissenting opinion at the back of the report really made some persuasive arguments about the tests he failed not being very scientific. It managed to put some doubt back in my mind.

Which isn't to say that Tyler didn't dope. But I think he has very good grounds for appeal. If no studies have been done to determine just how many false positives for mixed red blood cells might occur in an average population, the test is really not valid. Further studies should be done -- and it certainly should not be used to determine the future of an athlete's career and life.

Most likely Tyler was taking something experimental that caused the strange results . . . but if it turns out that it's just something weird with his blood that is natural . . . wow, that would really be a bummer to have the whole world turn against you with no reason . . .

I wish him strength either way!