Numbness in toes

[GumbyGirl]

Hi Ladies,

I am brand new to this forum and am coming to you all the way from Sydney, Australia. ;)

I am a cross country mountain biker, and would probably classify myself at intermediate level and love my rides. :D I have one problem though, which is making my riding life a misery. I have an issue with numb toes when riding. Usually it's the big toes of both feet but can extend to the second toes as well. It sets in after about 5km or so and is incredibly uncomfortable - perhaps it would be better described as pins and needles.

I ride a hardtail and use clipless pedals with the following Specialized cycling shoes - women's MTB Taho http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCEqProduct.jsp?spid=26121

I have tried loosening the laces, tightening the laces. I have placed orthotics in, to help support my feet. The shoes appear to fit appropriately - there is room in the front so that my toes don't hit, and the heel is snug etc. It's also not the cold as although it is winter in Sydney, it's about 16 degrees celcius (very mild). As soon as I get home and get the shoes off the sensation comes back to normal in about 5 minutes

Has anyone got suggestions on what it might be? May it even be pedal position?

I am training for a 50km MTB endurance event as well as upcoming 24 hour races and this is really hindering me. I have to stop after about 30km!

Please help!!!:confused:

Thanks!

[crazycanuck]

Yo Yo from Perth!

I don't know the best answer but you may want to try www.bicycles.net.au/forums? More local folks?

What about seeing a friendly physio? I don't know the exact answer :(

Are you doing the Highland Fling or the Coffs harbour mtn marathon? Man you guys have all the cool events over east!

C

[GumbyGirl]

Hi crazycanuck! (Does that mean you're Canadian?? I lived in Calgary for a year)

Thanks for the reply. I'm registered for the Netti Angry Doctor/Irate Intern race in September. I chose the 50km, but the husband is doing 100km - crazy cat :p

We are also doing an adventure race the week after - the Teva series.

I am so sad as I have missed the entries for the Highland Fling (all full, the fling has flung...) :( as we were waiting for the release of dates for the Mont 24hr, which we just found out has been pushed back to April next year!!! So sad as it is my all time fave event and ran in October last year. We aren't doing the Scott 24 (now the CORC 24hr) this year... not a fan of the new Mt Stromlo in Canberra... so now need to look for some more events. Not much on the calendar for the rest of this year, might take up some adventure races and prepare for the summer/autumn season in 2009.

Thanks for the link to the other forum, will take a look. Physio can't work out what's going wrong... :confused:

G

[crazycanuck]

I'm originally from Edmonton :)

I've never ridden Mt Stromlo but would love to! What have they changed?
Have you thought about doing any of the cool rides in QLD or VIC? What about the Kona24hr in Vic on dec 1st/2nd? You can always come over to Perth & do the 12hr solo!

Have you tried different shoes by chance? Could it be the air vents in the shoe? I would sometimes get one cold toe on one side with my old shoes but still have no clue why. Perhaps it's the socks?

I hope someone can provide an answer! I'd like you to complete your events!

Take care

C

[tulip]

Sounds like your shoes are too small, even though you say they fit. Can you try a different size and see if that helps?

[KnottedYet]

Sounds like your shoes are too small, even though you say they fit. Can you try a different size and see if that helps?

+1
could they be too narrow? Maybe try the wider men's version, or try taking the laces out of the front-most eyelets? Ask your physio to check your metatarsal arch for a dropped met head, too. (though a dropped met head ususally leads to numbness in the middle toes more than the big toe)

(I have Tahos, too.)

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

I suspect your shoes are too narrow as well. Remember, your feet do swell a bit as you ride.
I get this numbness on toes and ball of foot too if I'm wearing too narrow roller skates or also if my biking PowerGrip foot strap is a bit too tightly set.
When I wear thinner socks and better fitting skates and/or if I loosen the PowerGrip strap a bit, the problem is gone.

[beccaB]

At the risk of becoming completely obsessed, as per all of my recent posts, I have exactly the same shoes , but the only difference is that I use mine on the road, 70-100 miles a week on about 3-4 days a week. I am having the same problem, and have been advised that the taho's are very flexible compared to other shoes and that I should consider switching to a firmer shoe. I haven't yet because of finances, but will be soon.
One of my choices is the firmer mountain bike shoe that my husband has, he says he gets numbness occasionally but it's minimal, and goes away when he remembers to use the clipless pedal more efficiently. Specialized has 2 of those kind for women, one is around $125 and the other is around $225, but has carbon in the sole. In my limited knowledge, I believe that makes the shoe stiffer..??
In my particular case, I will probably be switching to road shoes because I might try a pedal with a broader contact area.

[Juiceflight]

+1
could they be too narrow? Maybe try the wider men's version, or try taking the laces out of the front-most eyelets? Ask your physio to check your metatarsal arch for a dropped met head, too. (though a dropped met head ususally leads to numbness in the middle toes more than the big toe)

(I have Tahos, too.)

Interesting....my numbness begins in the middle toe (only on the right foot). My shoes are not too tight and I have orthotics. I've been thinking it's the saddle or a crooked pelvis, but could Morton's foot have something to do with it?

[Aquila]

I get numb feet sometimes, too, but after a bit longer. One thing that helps is to focus on pulling up in my pedal stroke. My pedalling isn't really smooth, and focusing on pulling up makes it smoother AND helps me not get numb feet (or helps the numbness go away fast).

The other folks have probably addressed the root problem, but maybe a short term fix could also help?

[hermitclub]

I was getting numbness too. Started in the toe next to the big toe, then spread to the littler toes. I found that if I loosened the velcro, and concentrated on a smooth, even stroke both up and down, the numbness lessened. Now I seem to only have numbness if I get too lax in my pedaling.
Hope this helps.

[tulip]

I would suggest that feet swell in the summer, thus making it necessary to upsize for summer shoes (which is true), but since you're in Australia and it's winter there now, that theory doesn't work for you.

I like becca's flexible sole idea.

[Kano]

Becca mentioned getting a firmer shoe. I also wore the Specialized Taho for a couple of seasons, and had some trouble with numbness as well. After losing weight, they were way too big for me, and I decided to replace them with the next step up (Becca's $125 version). This season, I'm wearing the firmer, smaller shoe -- and they're significantly more snug than the Taho ever fit me, and I have NO numbness this season!

I use my mountain shoes on my road bike. It took a little getting used to the "knobbier" sole that this new pair has compared to the sole on the Taho, but I do like them -- once in a while, I need to be "unclipped" for a while, and those knobs do a good job of holding onto that little SPD pedal while I'm crossing an intersection, or riding in areas where the extra quick release of not being attached to my bike is handy (crowded areas on the MUT for example)

Karen in Boise

[KnottedYet]

Interesting....my numbness begins in the middle toe (only on the right foot). My shoes are not too tight and I have orthotics. I've been thinking it's the saddle or a crooked pelvis, but could Morton's foot have something to do with it?

Yup. With Morton's Foot, you will tend to roll your weight onto the big toe side of the foot with toe-off (which is a very similar situation to pedalling)

That unequal distribution of weight 1st ray to 5th ray will tend to collapse the metatarsal arch. If you've got a Morton's neuroma already, you will feel blinding agony (j/k, but it won't feel nice) and even if you don't you will be mighty likely to get some neural compression and unhappiness.

Mind you, Morton's Foot is *NOT* a problem, it's just a particular type of foot structure. Every foot structure has its issues. Knowing you have Morton's Foot just gives you a heads up on things to watch for.

There are foot exercises (making fists with your toes, splaying your toes out) that help strengthen the intrinsic muscles of the foot, which can be helpful for any cyclist, regardless of their particular foot structure. (just the nature of weightbearing on the balls of the feet makes us need to have spry and juicy muscles in our toes and feet)

[GumbyGirl]

Thank you, thank you, thank you everyone - what great feedback!:D

After having a think and reviewing everyone's replies I think it's definitely shoe related. They were okay to begin, but I've had them for 2 years and they've taken some bashings - enduro events and the like. The sole would have definitely softened from their initial levels. I got carbon soled road shoes for my road bike a while back and this solved numbness probs I had with some plastic (yuck) soled road shoes.

I am going to look into some more race/competition based MTB shoes and look to upgrade - I've been trying to avoid this given finance restrictions :mad: but it is time

You guys also hit the nail with technique - I tend to do a lot of pushing with very strong quads and not necessary pull up when I should. This would definitely be a factor.

Thankfully hasn't progressed to a Morton's Foot related neuroma or nerve pain as there is no discomfort under the ball of the foot.

One other thing How do I work out correct fit for bike shoes - I'm an ex-runner and have running shoes down to a fine art, but cycling shoes elude me. I have some great LBS's but they also seem to struggle with the details ("do they feel comfortable?" etc).

Thanks again

[Yen]

Oh my gosh!!! I'm having the same problem with the toes on my right foot, and I'm wearing Specialized Taho MTBs. The first pair was a womens' WSD so I returned them for the men's version in a size larger -- same problem. I can't believe this thread describes my problem to a T !!!

For me, the numbness and pain begin around mile 15. It gets worse and worse until my foot feels like I have a tight wire band wound around all the toes on my right foot and getting tighter. We finally stop so I can remove the shoe and massage my toes.

I thought the problem might be that my 2nd toe is longer than the big toe, or maybe I'm curling my toes inside the shoe. I've even considered having surgery on the 2nd toe to shorten it -- how desperate is that!!!!

I'm replacing the Tahos with a pair of Sidi Dominators. Meanwhile, I am wearing my old running shoes which feel as comfortable as slippers on my feet. The Sidis feel the same. Even in the running shoes, I can feel my toes scrunched while I'm pedaling, so I must be doing something I'm unaware of. I need to work on keeping my toes flat and spread out, not scrunching them up inside the shoe. However, I can ride for many miles in the running shoes without the pain I had in the Tahos. Otherwise, I liked those shoes... nice looking and durable.

I also wear orthotics, but the pain is there whether I wear them or not.

[KnottedYet]

Do your orthotics have a metatarsal button?

I loooooove my metatarsal buttons in my bike shoes. Happy feet!

[Illa]

I had the same problem with numbness when I purchased my first pair of cycling shoes. I read somewhere that the cleats might need to be adjusted. I suspected that the cleats might be a bit too close to the toes, so I moved them back by about 2 mm. After that, the numbness went away and didn't return.

[Trek420]

thanks, and with that tip a hearty welcome to TE :D Surf on over to the Getting to Know You thread when you get a minute.

[BethG]

Dang. I went looking for a bike forum for advice about numbness/pain in my feet. Wearing Tahos. Hmmm.

(Knotted, supposedly the Taho's themselves have "tarsal buttons" - and I'm half wondering if that's part of the problem)

OTOH, I also had foot pain when riding in sneakers. That's why I bought the bike shoes (and clips to go with them) in the first place. I don't think it was as bad, but then I never rode as far.

I did 25 miles/40k yesterday, and started getting mild numbness almost from the start. By the halfway point it was getting uncomfortable, and by the end I felt like I had a horse standing on each foot. I finally pulled my feet out of the clips, and rode with the pedal under my arch, which felt a lot better.

Is it possible I just need the pedals to clip in further back on my foot?

[KnottedYet]

I tossed the sockliners my Tahos came with right from the start. I've got Superfeet in them. After having trouble with hotfoot I got met buttons added to the Superfeet.

Mind you, I've got *men's* Tahos, cuz the women's were way too narrow and set my hotfoot off right there in the store.