Gear for little people

[TripleGem]

I'm in the process of designing a custom road frame and building it up and wow, a few things really frustrate me.

Handlebars: I measure 34cm from shoulder to shoulder (w/prof. bike fit). Handlebars are only available in 38cm and up, and many of the good ones don't even come in 38cm. Then, there is a huge drop and too much for my little hands- I can't use Campy parts because I can't actually reach the brakes. I found an aluminum Bontrager I like, but it doesn't have an ergo flat top which I would like. I just feel like there needs to be someone out there designing handlebars, perhaps even carbon ones (?!) for us smaller gals.

Shoes: The Sidi Genius 5.5 only comes in (eu)38 and up. I have small feet. Reduced choices again.

Zipp: Have you checked out their website? The gear they sell and the pictures that illustrate their offerings would leave you to believe that very few women use Zipp wheels.

Don't merchants realize what a huge part of the consumer market we are???

[VeloVT]

I totally sympathize, and I'm not even that small, at 5'6". The bars I really want just don't come in 38cm...

That said, you have a few options. Deda makes a few bars in 36 outside-outside (this is a 34 cm bar by more conventional center-center measurement):
http://www.dedaelementi.com/En/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Component&SearchComponent=Road+handlebar+26%2c0&ProductIDMaster=383

http://www.dedaelementi.com/En/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Component&SearchComponent=Road+handlebar+26%2c0&ProductIDMaster=377

as well as a sexy (I think) carbon bar in 38 o-o (36 c-c):
http://www.dedaelementi.com/En/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Component&SearchComponent=Road+handlebar+31%2c7&ProductIDMaster=357

Salsa makes several bars, including the Poco Carbon, in 36 cm (this is center-center, unfortunately).

The Ritchey Biomax bar, which is pretty popular, is available in 36 cm c-c.

I'll bet if you are willing to sacrifice on weight, you could find some Nitto or Cinelli bars in smaller widths as well.

However, I'm not apologizing for the lack of adequate choices for women. I'm totally with you there. Makes me mad. grrrr....


p.s. I actually have those Piega bars on my CX bike (they came stock). They are not bad. I'm not sure they'd be my first choice if I were going custom (sort of a hybrid traditional/anatomic shape), but it's definitely an option for you since they do come in 34...

p.p.s. It sucks to have to settle for lower end, but Sidi DOES make the Zeta shoe in 36 (size 6), and Specialized makes the Women's Carbon BG Pro in 36 also (annoyingly, they don't even MAKE a women's version of their top-end shoe... this kind of thing infuriates me...but there are a few TE women who wear and love the BG Pro, and I have the men's carbon Zeta because I found a killer deal on it, and it's fine, if not as light or swanky looking as the Genius...).

[Zen]

Check out the Bontrager Fit VR (http://bontrager.com/model/06244/en)
clamp size- 31.8mm
width 360mm (don't know if this is an inside or outside measurement, I'd have to check my bike)
drops-120mm

[elk]

Does anyone HAVE the Deda for girls?

I need to know if it's an ergo or a more traditional curve..or at least a gentle ergo!!! I want to dump my Ritchey Biomax 11 for a less ergo bar...

(don't mean to hijack)

I've been researching bars and I'd add to the list the Modolo Venus bar
http://estore.websitepros.com/1939518/-strse-158/Modolo-Women%27s-Venus-handlebars/Detail.bok

[Zen]

The Bontrager has a plain old curve, no ergo needed.

[elk]

but it's not in 26.0, the BOntrager....:(

[bike4ever]

I have the Bontrager Fit h'bar and love it. I've put many women on it in my shop. Yes you are right that it is only oversized. You can always switch out your stem to oversized.

[elk]

just found a TTTEva...so I'll try that. VERY hard to find!!! and i love my adjustable stem...

[tulip]

TripleGem, are you a Little Person (officially?) or just a small person?

Bike Friday makes bikes that fit all sizes of people, including Little People (with and without dwarfism).

They may be a good resource for gear and accessories, and I bet they have a group of folks (Little People and others) who ride Bike Fridays who would be good resources, too.

[Kathi]

I'm in the process of designing a custom road frame and building it up and wow, a few things really frustrate me.

Handlebars: I measure 34cm from shoulder to shoulder (w/prof. bike fit). Handlebars are only available in 38cm and up, and many of the good ones don't even come in 38cm. Then, there is a huge drop and too much for my little hands- I can't use Campy parts because I can't actually reach the brakes. I found an aluminum Bontrager I like, but it doesn't have an ergo flat top which I would like. I just feel like there needs to be someone out there designing handlebars, perhaps even carbon ones (?!) for us smaller gals.

Shoes: The Sidi Genius 5.5 only comes in (eu)38 and up. I have small feet. Reduced choices again.

Zipp: Have you checked out their website? The gear they sell and the pictures that illustrate their offerings would leave you to believe that very few women use Zipp wheels.

Don't merchants realize what a huge part of the consumer market we are???

I'm a small rider too and have the Modolo Venus bars in a 34cm width. I love my Campy Record shifters because they fit so nicely between my thumb and forefinger.

The bend on the Modolo Venus bars are designed to bring the hand closer to the brake levers.

I also suggest that you don't let the mechanics adjust your brakes to their strength. A loose cable brings the lever in a little more and is easier for my short fingers to reach the lever.

The Deda 4girls handlebars will be to wide for you, I had them before I discovered the Modolo Venus bars and there is a world of difference between the 2 bars. I had a very difficult time reaching the brake levers, not sure if that was because the bars were to wide,th e reach on the bend to long or both.

You don't say what your weight is but I bought handbuilt wheels from Jeremy at Alchemey bicycles in Santa Fe, NM. I used him because he was able to get Nimble Spider rims. They are designed for a lighter rider and Jeremy spec'ed the wheels to my weight rather than a 180 lb rider. The wheelset is not as fancy as my American Classic sprint 350's but I get a much smoother ride. They are very light wheels with tune hubs.

If you decide to go Campy and need a 165 crankarm I use the Specialities TA Carmina. I believe you can get it as a double, compact double or triple. You can chose the chainring sizes, I'm currently using a compact 48-34. The crankset works very well with a campy cassette.

Here's the link to pictures my custom Serotta. I don't know what happened to the last 2 pictures but you can see part of the crankset.

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=8515

[elk]

those Venus bars are NICE!!!,,if the Evas don't work out for me...I'll get those!!

[Crankin]

I wear a 5.5 or 6 US shoe size and the Sidi Genus size 38 fit me perfectly. They run super small; I even had to get the 38W. I have 37s in my mtb Sidis and they are too tight.

[Eden]

Sidi's do tend to run small. I wear between a 4.5 and a 5.5 in most shoes and my Sidi's are 37's. I have even seen 36's in Sidis - they are too small to squeeze my feet into....

the sizing info page says Genius 5's (yeah, the soles are not carbon, but they will still be good and stiff) come in 37's http://www.sidiusa.com/sizing.html

as far as Zipp goes - they must have heard you, as they have Kirsten Armstrong splashed all over their home page right now....

[Bron]

ITM also make narrow bars. Mine are the "elle" bars and are 36cm measured from the centre of one brake hood to the centre of the other.

[Kathi]

Adjusting the "play" in you brakes makes a difference also. It drives the mechanics nuts.

http://www.slb-coaching.com/trainingInformation.asp?Id=57

[Eden]

Adjusting the "play" in you brakes makes a difference also. It drives the mechanics nuts.

http://www.slb-coaching.com/trainingInformation.asp?Id=57

I do this too, though I'm mostly my own mechanic these days so it doesn't drive me nuts.... I keep them a little loose 1. so that if I startle in a race and unconsciously squeeze the brakes a little I'm not actually braking and 2. so that I can actually have the brake levers in a bit on a steep descent (thereby allowing me to have my hands fully around them and ready to brake) without actually braking.
They are not so loose as to be dangerous. I have plenty of braking power, its just that they are not in so close that the tiniest movement throws the brakes full on.

[TripleGem]

Great ideas ladies! Thanks so much. I've asked my awesome bike maker (www.rideoctober.com) to look at your ideas so we can try a few things. I really appreciate your responses. I'll try to post when it all gets settled so you know what the results are.

BTW, I am a little person, not a Little Person. And I'm not that little at all, which is why it's so frustrating. I can't imagine how frustrating it is for Little People. Power to the people (little and Little)!

[NadiaMac]

In response to an earlier post: I have the deda for girls (in 36) and the bars are a more traditional shape. Definitely not ergo or "anatomical". I find them quite comfortable, except that I need 39 cm bars so have switched to a set of extremely short reach elf bars.

[Andrea]

Zipp sponsors my team! (Team Kenda Tire)

[SouthernBelle]

Zipp sponsors my team! (Team Kenda Tire)

Andrea, are you going to be at either the TBRA TT Championship or the Allanti Classic? Both short rides from my house.

[Andrea]

Andrea, are you going to be at either the TBRA TT Championship or the Allanti Classic? Both short rides from my house.

Both! Though I may only go to the Allanti RR (state championship). The crit for that one is uber-lame! Also, funds are a little thin this month because I just dropped some $$ on a new TT bike!

[SouthernBelle]

Let me know. The Tbra event is about 3 miles away. The Watertown portion of the Allanti stuff is about 14 miles. Both will cover roads I've ridden lots.

[TxDoc]

Does anyone HAVE the Deda for girls?
I need to know if it's an ergo or a more traditional curve..or at least a gentle ergo!!! I want to dump my Ritchey Biomax 11 for a less ergo bar...
(don't mean to hijack)
I've been researching bars and I'd add to the list the Modolo Venus bar
http://estore.websitepros.com/1939518/-strse-158/Modolo-Women%27s-Venus-handlebars/Detail.bok

it is sort of ergo. this is what it looks like:
http://www.dedaelementi.com/It/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Component&SearchComponent=Road+handlebar+26%2c0&ProductIDMaster=377
I've tried it, it's a very nice handlebar actually - although on the smaller side. I was trying to attach some 'live' pictures for you but I cannot figure out how to insert a photo that is on my hard drive and not on the web somewhere...:confused:

[elk]

it is sort of ergo. this is what it looks like:
http://www.dedaelementi.com/It/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Component&SearchComponent=Road+handlebar+26%2c0&ProductIDMaster=377
I've tried it, it's a very nice handlebar actually - although on the smaller side. I was trying to attach some 'live' pictures for you but I cannot figure out how to insert a photo that is on my hard drive and not on the web somewhere...:confused:

Have you tried moving it onto your desktop and then uploading it? Or mail it to yourself first...
;)
I'm trying out the Cinelli LW s...

[TxDoc]

Ahhhh, found out a way to attach files! :D
hope this works - these are a couple of bikes with the D4g handlebar in the photos. Sorry there's some clip aerobars on one of them, but you can still see the handlebars.
Anyway, yes it's very nice - I like size 40 better than 38 so the D4g it's a bit on the small side for me, but still useable.
My favorite from Deda is actually the synapsi bar, http://www.dedaelementi.com/It/Products/Products_Detail.aspx?SearchMode=Memorable&SearchComponentMemorable=Integrated+handlebar&ProductIDMaster=525 , and that one is integrated and has a flat top - BUT, if you race, remember that it is UCI illegal because of the aero extension...
Actually I was thinking of replacing one of these D4g bars with carbon - so it may end up on the TE yard sale or the free gear forum at some point...

[TxDoc]

forgot one of the photos... top's quite comfortable for a 38 bar I think - but I can't really say because I rarely use the top, I'm either on the hoods or in the drops...
Hope this helps.

[elk]

hmmm. the yellow wrapped bars...bird's eye view...looks similiar to my Cinellis ..its the turn from the flat that eats space.

[mayanorange]

TxDoc- do you know the reach and drop dimensions for the D4G bars? They didn't have it listed on their site. I might be interested in yours if they're close to my eastons. I'm picking up a new stem tonight so will see how that feels, but I might need a 38 bar.

[TxDoc]

TxDoc- do you know the reach and drop dimensions for the D4G bars? They didn't have it listed on their site. I might be interested in yours if they're close to my eastons. I'm picking up a new stem tonight so will see how that feels, but I might need a 38 bar.

Not on top of my head, but will check when I go home and let you know! :)

[mayanorange]

That's be great, thanks!

[elk]

That's be great, thanks!

pretty BMD Mayanorange!

what eastons do you have?

[mayanorange]

pretty BMD Mayanorange!
what eastons do you have?

Cassie says thank you!

I have the EA30 Ergo 40cm that came with my Jamis. They don't feel too bad, but might be a bit wide. Needed to move them up so I could reach them before I can decide.

[elk]

i've been trying to find a pair of EC90 Equipes PRO not ergo in 40...i had a chance on ebay but lost it...!!!

[mayanorange]

You had the Ritchey ergos on the Aurora, right? Were those also 40cm? I was reading the thread about shimming the brifters and checked last night- my Soras are adjustable, so i'll be tinkering with that tonight too once my stem is installed. I'd be a bit more comfy braking in the drops if they were a smidge closer.

PS- You have some adorable furkids yourself. Do you do agility with any of them? Cass and I went to our 2nd class last night. She's normally a wuss about new things, but her inner mtn dog must've kicked in- she was having a grand time climbing the a-frame and dogwalk.

[elk]

You had the Ritchey ergos on the Aurora, right? Were those also 40cm? I was reading the thread about shimming the brifters and checked last night- my Soras are adjustable, so i'll be tinkering with that tonight too once my stem is installed. I'd be a bit more comfy braking in the drops if they were a smidge closer.

PS- You have some adorable furkids yourself. Do you do agility with any of them? Cass and I went to our 2nd class last night. She's normally a wuss about new things, but her inner mtn dog must've kicked in- she was having a grand time climbing the a-frame and dogwalk.

Ritchey Biomax. ergos yes. THey're 38cm adn were fine except in the drops and I have a way of over fussing with things...:rolleyes:

We have done, but mosty do obedience and therapy and rally...my sister is starting agility with her papillon in Wayland...or Waltham..can't remember!

[mayanorange]

Ritchey Biomax. ergos yes. THey're 38cm adn were fine except in the drops and I have a way of over fussing with things...:rolleyes:

We have done, but mosty do obedience and therapy and rally...my sister is starting agility with her papillon in Wayland...or Waltham..can't remember!

I think I looked at the biomax bars- are they the ones that the tops bend away from you as they go out from the stem (ie the top is not one straight line)? Maybe those were the easton ergo bars... I can't remember. I'd need a straight bar in the tops if not bent toward me slightly because of my wrist. You're not the only one fussing- DH has asked me if anything original is going to be left on her! So far only saddle (it was mens ouch), stem, and frog pedals which I don't thick is too bad!

Especially for Pets in wayland maybe? I know there's none in Waltham- that's where we do obedience/rally. I'm having to bring her out to worcester with me and do daycare while I'm at work. If it is EFP, I'd be interested to see what she thinks.

[elk]

she's working w/ Janice Ritter in EFP Wayland...hopefully she'll continue at Charles River DTC. ; they meet in Waltham.
Her name is Debbie and her papillon is Billy...he's a rescue from Florida.

it's a SMALL world (but I wouldn't want to have to clean it...'-)
e

I have ththe Ritcheys on in those photos of my hands...I'll have to go back and find which thread they're in. I think Lisa was right...shims might've solved the problem...but I got all into handlebars!

[mayanorange]

When I picked up the stem, they had the ritchey biomax- totally bent my wrist the wrong way just gently picking it up. The ledge on the drops didn't bother me too much (granted they were unmounted)- I thought they'd poke your hand more. Still tinkering but if I was going to do 38 the biomax wouldn't work for me.

I was going to say there was a lady in our CRDTC class who had rescue papillons. Such a small world. They take a hiatus from classes over the summer, so thought we'd give another place a go.

[elk]

When I picked up the stem, they had the ritchey biomax- totally bent my wrist the wrong way just gently picking it up. The ledge on the drops didn't bother me too much (granted they were unmounted)- I thought they'd poke your hand more. Still tinkering but if I was going to do 38 the biomax wouldn't work for me.

I was going to say there was a lady in our CRDTC class who had rescue papillons. Such a small world. They take a hiatus from classes over the summer, so thought we'd give another place a go.

is her name Betty?

[TxDoc]

Hi Mayanorange,
approximately, I'd say the Deda 4 girls have reach 110 and drop 150. If they were 40 wide instead of 38 they'd be my favorite bars for the comfort. BUT, remember that they weigh about 250g, so although on the lighter end for alu bar - they are not as light as carbon...

[mayanorange]

is her name Betty?

I'm really horrible with names, especially the people! Billy sounds right, tho- red and white?


Hi Mayanorange,
approximately, I'd say the Deda 4 girls have reach 110 and drop 150. If they were 40 wide instead of 38 they'd be my favorite bars for the comfort. BUT, remember that they weigh about 250g, so although on the lighter end for alu bar - they are not as light as carbon...

I'll have to measure and take the new stem for a spin. It's torrential rain up here, so I spun for a minute on the trainer, but need to road-test. And aluminum is fine- I'm not too terribly concerned with weight- coming from a mtn bike this bike seems insanely light.

[mayanorange]

So turns out once I go my actual dressmakers tape out to measure things that my handlebars are 44cm!! I had measured them before with a not long enough ruler and I guess I missed when I got 40. Had DH measure my shoulders and I'm about 36- no wonder they seem a bit wide! I think I might finally suck it up and head to the LBS to get a handlebar fitting- maybe and actual 40 wouldn't be too bad. I need my bars a touch wide so the weight is on the medial side of my bad wrist, so I guess I'll try 38 and 40 if they have them.

I'm starting to realize the LBS I got the bike at doesn't really fit everyone going out the door- I didn't even think to ask for a womens saddle. Granted since it's my first real roadbike, there was some getting used to it to figure out what was and wasn't working, but maybe the other shop that throws everyone on a trainer would have been a better idea even though I got her at essentially 1/2 off. The frame seems to be close to the right size- I did one of those online measure yourself a bunch of ways fit things and it says I'm dead on with frame size and seat tube, and pretty close with reach- it said I could go farther, but the fit thing didn't have a check button for crap wrist and no core strength ;) My main conundrum is the original shop owes me a tune up, so it'd be easier to go to them, but they don't have the selection of the other place. Hmmmm.

[TxDoc]

:)
I'm starting to realize the LBS I got the bike at doesn't really fit everyone going out the door- I didn't even think to ask for a womens saddle. Granted since it's my first real roadbike, there was some getting used to it to figure out what was and wasn't working, but maybe the other shop that throws everyone on a trainer would have been a better idea even though I got her at essentially 1/2 off. The frame seems to be close to the right size- I did one of those online measure yourself a bunch of ways fit things and it says I'm dead on with frame size and seat tube, and pretty close with reach- it said I could go farther, but the fit thing didn't have a check button for crap wrist and no core strength ;) My main conundrum is the original shop owes me a tune up, so it'd be easier to go to them, but they don't have the selection of the other place. Hmmmm.

The way I see it - they DO owe you a fitting service, and if they want to keep you as a customer they should really do that for free and without complaints. As per product selection... if they are a serious bicycle business they should be able to order anything you need to have the bike fitted properly.
That said - given your measurements the D4g could be the bar for you, but it is 38, so if your wrist needs a wider correction maybe you may want to try an anatomical 40 as well, like the Deda or the ITM. I would not suggest bars with very short reach and shallow drops like Salsa poco, because that may end up putting excessive strain on your wrist and certainly you do not want that.
In any case, as soon as my synapsi comes in (next week I hope!!!) I'll be glad to give you a couple of bars in 38/40 if you want to give it a try.
If you want to test ride bars, I have a brand new 40 that is just sitting there, still wrapped up and never mounted on a bike - and plan to take out the Deda 4 girls as soon as the new carbon bar comes in. So if you want to try them let me know, I can just pack them both and put them in priority mail.

[mayanorange]

TxDoc- thanks for the input, I'll give them a call and see if they even have anything I can try (combo bike/ski shop, so have really low stock levels). It'd be great to try out yours (of course I'll let you know if I miraculously find something this weekend). Which 40 do you have? and are they both 26 clamps? I'll have to go get the stem I just returned last week if so- mine's 25.4 and the good shop accidentally got me a 26 that I would have kept, but it didn't quite go as high, tho might work with different bars. I must be driving these guys crazy between swapping out about 6 saddles and now the stem craziness. :D

Just called- they have a 40, so I'll head over there tonight and try that out and see what they say.

[TxDoc]

Which 40 do you have? and are they both 26 clamps?

40: Ritchey pro road, brand new, 31.8 clamp size.
38: Deda 4 girls, used, 26 clamp size.
Good luck!

[TxDoc]

Sorry, I meant to write the measurements too, the Ritchey is 110 reach and 145 drop I think.

[mayanorange]

They're both definite possibilities. I'll report back after the bike shop.

[mayanorange]

Well that was a waste of my time. Well, not totally- he adjusted my derailleurs and showed me how to wrap my bars and gave me tips on pedaling. But when it came to fit, it was a waste. They had a ritchey wing topped 40 that bent back (bad for wrist) and something ancient from the basement that may have been a nitto that was 40 and felt okayish, but they didn't have another stem to put in to try the ritchey or any other bars to try. Oh, and I knew more about clamp sizes and bar shapes than he did! Sigh.

So do I go to Landrys and get a proper fit? Or should I just try TxDoc's bars? I am a biomechanist, so I understand a lot of the fitting issues and have read a lot, but I can't step back and look at myself, so am doing some by tape measure then by feel from there or just by feel. I have a cycleops trainer which helps- as long as I can reach my tools I can adjust while sitting there Maybe there's something more I'm missing?

[TxDoc]

I am a biomechanist, so I understand a lot of the fitting issues and have read a lot, but I can't step back and look at myself, so am doing some by tape measure then by feel from there or just by feel. I have a cycleops trainer which helps- as long as I can reach my tools I can adjust while sitting there Maybe there's something more I'm missing?

Ok, I am missing the whole picture here... what is the geometry of your bike and what's your current setup (saddle height, stem, bars angle...)?
And well yes, a professional fit would always be best!
Now, with your profession you may get by and do it yourself - with mirrors and some help (like someone taking your measurements and angles while you are on the bike on the trainer). It will take much longer than doing it in a pro bike shop. Of course it's cheaper, but again, a good fit is very important...
Anyway, I just placed the bars with some other stuff on the TE yard sale, if you decide to try them let me know and I can scratch them from that post :)
But seriously what is the geometry of the bike? I think I'm quite confused now at what the reach problem is :confused:
As a side note: when you find out that you know more about bikes than the shop owner (and your name is not Lance Armstrong or Jeannie Longo), then you need to change bike shop!!!
Good luck!

[elk]

sidenote:

can I re-use my Brooks leather tape if I change back to my other bar? It's on the new bar thats on the bike until I decide.....?

:rolleyes:

[mayanorange]

Ok, I am missing the whole picture here... what is the geometry of your bike and what's your current setup (saddle height, stem, bars angle...)?


Pic of my current setup at the bottom. It's a 54 and here's the specs from bikepedia: http://bikepedia.com/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?ItemID=94301&Type=bike I don't have official geometries but I took a few measurements. My measurements: height 5' 7.5", inseam 91cm, around the torso (looped around crotch and shoulder) 155cm, arm length 60cm. Current saddle height 92cm from pedal at the bottom of the stroke (I like to point my toes a bit). Current reach for center of bar clamp to center of seat clamp 63cm.

As for the reach problem, basically I just wanted my bars a bit higher since I have my seat rather high for toe pointing. I went for a ride yesterday and I felt a bit cramped in my body but my arms were so splayed to reach the hoods at 44, that I can't go further out yet. I think once I get a smaller bar, I'll want to increase my reach to closer to the original (90mm) but still bring it up a bit (so maybe 100-105 but 20-30 degree), which helps my wrist and flabby tummy deal better.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3101/2706786696_5a44ef490e.jpg

[TxDoc]

I see your higher seat as an advantage actually. If you keep the bars leveled or use a low-rise stem (5 degrees or 8), because that would allow you to flatten your back and be 1-more comfortable (!!!) and 2-more aerodynamic. By raising the bars to the same level of the stem, you are basically neglecting yourself that advantage.
Also, if I understand your wrist problem (not sure I got it right...), I think that the more upright position is putting extra strain on your wrist and cousing more pain. A correct flat-back position, especially with your hands in the drops or on top of the hoods, should allow your elbows to bend more and your wrists to be in a natural position, relieving the pain.
Yes different bars will help, but I would definitely consider changing the riding position a bit. You could try a 5 degree stem (80 or 90mm), so that your seat is higher than the handlebars, and you can rotate the pelvis more and achieve a flat back - or almost flat ;)

In my opinion (and hey I am NO expert, just ride a bike sometimes) this change may solve many of your problems, including reach AND wrist pain.
Since you have a stationary trainer, you could just give it a try - although efficiently rotating the pelvis takes time, so it will be a gradual change from your current upright position to a flat-back more aero position.

As per toe-pointing... despite most coaches preaching against it (with good reasons) - we occasionally see toe-pointers among pro cyclists and champions. I guess you have to find your own balance, and figure out the position that allows you to pedal comfortably while getting the most out of your power output. The problem with toe-pointing is that some of the energy that you use to pedal is not efficiently transferred to the pedal/crank because of that position - so virtually you could go faster by using a more efficient position on the pedal. But again, finding the right angles take time, so if you are comfortable with some toe-pointing right now that can be ok as well - just make sure that it does not put unnecessary strains on the ankle or other parts of the body.
Hope this helps! :)

[mayanorange]

TxDoc- I think you're right that I should be lower and maybe even further out. I'm trying to get a bent elbow to reduce strain on wrist, but with the wide bars I end up having my elbows in a weird rotation which is tiring and then they get straightened, hurting my wrist and making me feel like I should sit up to put the weight on my tush instead.

I rode over to landrys and eventually managed to catch the fitter- he measured me at 37 and suggested a 38 because of my wrist. They couldn't find the ones they were supposed to have, so have an appointment with him tuesday night. It's worth it to figure it out quickly and know I'm actually where I belong, not just where I think I do! He's suggested the FSA compact bars in a 40 (which is 38 in the hoods) which looks like it could be very comfy- I was wondering why bars usually don't taper into the top. I asked if he knew the Deda 4 girls and he was hesitant since it's 38 outside to outside (thus a 36 really) and he might not want so much reach for me. We'll see what comes of tuesday- it's much nicer to talk to someone who really knows their stuff.

[TxDoc]

The FSA is very nice - and I think it has a shorter reach so it could help as well. I am glad you got a good fit, that is really priceless - working with real professionals changes everything, doesn't it?
It looked like the first bike shop did not really treat you appropriately. It seemed also strange to me that given your reach/wrist issues they decided to fit you on the Aurora that has sort of a touring/upright geometry. I would have thought that they'd suggest something like the Xenith instead - equipped with a short stem and a short-reach handlebar... but hey, they are the bike expert so I guess they must have had a good reason :confused:

So give the FSA a try and see how your hands feel. But still, once you have bars of the right size, consider leveling your stem and trying out how you do with a more flat position. That may help the wrist and also save some fatigue. We never think how important aerodymanics is until we try it... :)
Good luck!

[mayanorange]

The answer is they didn't fit me much at all. I tried a few different bikes, but then we walked into some clearance Venturas that also felt rather good- my Sport is shorter reach than DH's Comp model which I had tried in a 54 also and definitely noticed the length. We were lucky enough to get the one sales guy who owned a road bike, but the fact I got close to what I need was mostly me... going by feel.... having never had a real roadbike before (80s tenspeeds don't count). I'm lucky I got as close as I did. This is why I'm wondering why I didn't just go to Landrys and pay more and have the right bike. Too late now tho- live and learn.

My new best friend (did I mention he's quite easy on the eyes too? Don't tell DH;)) at Landrys is going to address the stem once he locates the right size FSA. I'm sure he'll find a better saddle position too. :rolleyes:

[Surlygirl]

I went to one of the BIG bike stores in Boston and well, they basically ignored me and told me they didn't have much in my size and walked away. I had one of those Julia Roberts moments, big mistake pal. (I left with my wallet).
My favorite bike store is Gear Works in Leominster. I know this is a haul for you but its right off rt 2. I bought my Orbea Dama from them. Young crowd and they all ride. Might be worth the trip. Darren is great!!!!
Landrys I've found to be hit or miss. I've been in the one in Westboro and Natick. Summer help sometimes isn't very knowledgeable. Just my two cents worth.

[mayanorange]

Surlygirl- I agree Landrys can bit hit or miss, but I enjoyed my fitting last night with Andy in Natick. I grilled him about angles he chose and why and he was very open to telling me anything I wanted to know. I then of course threw DH on the trainer once home and fit him to his bike better.

So I now have the FSA wing pro compact bar in a 40 and I think it's pretty great so far. He actually moved my saddle up a lot (guess I wasn't toe pointing) and forward some to get the right leg placement. He didn't have the right stem- we're going to try 100 and 110 at 20 degrees, but for now I have stubby 30 degree stem on. He also wrapped me up with some bar phat and white tape (she looks so snazzy now!). I'll post an 'after' pic once the new stem comes in.

I also hopped on a bike that had the Selle SMP stratos on it- it was much tinier than I thought they'd be. It was interesting, but I'd need the plus or trk to get wide enough for my tush. Maybe I'll try a TRK at some point, but I can't really afford the plus.

All in all I think it was a great fit, tho it'll take a bit of getting used to where I'm really supposed to be!

[TxDoc]

So I now have the FSA wing pro compact bar in a 40 and I think it's pretty great so far. He actually moved my saddle up a lot (guess I wasn't toe pointing) and forward some to get the right leg placement. He didn't have the right stem- we're going to try 100 and 110 at 20 degrees, but for now I have stubby 30 degree stem on. He also wrapped me up with some bar phat and white tape (she looks so snazzy now!). I'll post an 'after' pic once the new stem comes in.

Sounds great - now we definitely want to see pictures! :D
So how does it feel with a higher saddle and a lower stem, does that relieve some pressure off your wrist?

[TripleGem]

Great ideas ladies! Thanks so much. I've asked my awesome bike maker (www.rideoctober.com) to look at your ideas so we can try a few things. I really appreciate your responses. I'll try to post when it all gets settled so you know what the results are.

BTW, I am a little person, not a Little Person. And I'm not that little at all, which is why it's so frustrating. I can't imagine how frustrating it is for Little People. Power to the people (little and Little)!

So, we went with a 38 cm Ritchey WCS Carbon Evolution SL with 132mm drop and 75mm reach. I'm excited to see how it feels. The bummer, my bike got selected to be shown in the Edge Composites booth at Interbike next week. I won't get to ride her until October! (she's got a temporary Edge handlebar now)

You can see her here though...http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php#/photo.php?pid=954638&op=1&aid=40335&auser=39653847712&id=39653847712&ref=mf

[fidlfreek]

WOWOWOW

If anybody hasn't checked out how her custom bike turned out you really should. It is ridiculously hot!

If my Look turns out 1/2 as great I'll be happy...

[HGuthertz]

I had the same problem with a Terry Isis Sport - Came with Salsa Short and Shallow -38 cm.

After a professional bike fit, the handlebars were swapped out with 36 cm version- aluminum. Works great, and a very big improvment from the 38 cm model.

Salsa also carries a Poco version for shorter drop and reach. Available in aluminum and carbon. I am using the bike for sport/touring and prefer the aluminum version.

Also had the same issue as you with Campy. No issue with the Shimano brifters which are shimmed.

Hope this helps.