Why cars misjudge a cyclist's speed

[susiej]

From the Pennsylvania manual for applying for a motorcycle learners permit:

"Smaller vehicles appear farther away, and seem to be traveling slower than
they actually are. It is common for drivers to pull out in front of
motorcyclists, thinking they have plenty of time. Too often, they are wrong."

So, not only is there the assumption that any car is faster than a bike, a bicycle or motorcycle seems slower!

(Apologies if this has been posted before.)

[parity]

When you only have a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

[mimitabby]

From the Pennsylvania manual for applying for a motorcycle learners permit:

"Smaller vehicles appear farther away, and seem to be traveling slower than
they actually are. It is common for drivers to pull out in front of
motorcyclists, thinking they have plenty of time. Too often, they are wrong."

So, not only is there the assumption that any car is faster than a bike, a bicycle or motorcycle seems slower!

(Apologies if this has been posted before.)

I've never seen it posted, it's kind of interesting.

[Eden]

I also think that many adults have never ridden a bike or rode one only as a child long ago and are under the impression that NO bike moves very quickly.

[Pedal Wench]

I also think that many adults have never ridden a bike or rode one only as a child long ago and are under the impression that NO bike moves very quickly.

I agree with this theory -- so many of the accidents - cars pulling out in front, or passing and then making a right, are because they have no clue that we're moving at 20 mph too.

[Bad JuJu]

This misjudgement of speed is also a problem on bike trails, where parents allow small children to wander across the pavement because, I assume, they figure since it's "only" a bike trail, nobody's moving very quickly. And of course, their prejudice is often confirmed because cyclists have to slow down to avoid their uncontrolled kids.

Oops, is my pet peeve showing? :cool:

[smilingcat]

The misjudgement about our speed is real. Been told, "you guys move really fast!! How fast can you go?"

And we've been told "You shouldn't be going so (*&^ fast. You need to ride slower!!!"

thus cars cutting in front of us to turn into a parking lot. Cars coming out of the side street right in front of us and its OUR FAULT for almost causing an accident.

Some people :mad:
Smilingcat

[OakLeaf]

This misjudgement of speed is also a problem on bike trails, where parents allow small children to wander across the pavement because, I assume, they figure since it's "only" a bike trail, nobody's moving very quickly. And of course, their prejudice is often confirmed because cyclists have to slow down to avoid their uncontrolled kids.

Oops, is my pet peeve showing? :cool:

Yup. Heh.

It's d*mned by the walkers if you do, d*mned by the cars if you don't, but I feel pretty strongly that the place for an adult on a road bicycle is on the road. IMO, the only safe arrangement is that multi-use trails are for children, dogs, walkers, runners, strollers and wheelchairs, with adults on bicycles welcome if they adjust their pace to the traffic around them. Children, dogs and unsteady elderly people can't safely walk in the road, and they need a place to walk.

[Grog]

but I feel pretty strongly that the place for an adult on a road bicycle is on the road. IMO, the only safe arrangement is that multi-use trails are for children, dogs, walkers, runners, strollers and wheelchairs, with adults on bicycles welcome if they adjust their pace to the traffic around them. Children, dogs and unsteady elderly people can't safely walk in the road, and they need a place to walk.

I feel the same...

Multi-use trails are just not safe for the cohabitation of bikes that go any faster than a pedestrian pace (unless it's really early in the morning and there's no one there)...

[Eden]

Unfortunately its also d*amned by the cars if you don't and d*amned by the cars if you do.....
How many times have you heard drivers complain about how slow cyclists tie up traffic (which if you ask me, the amount of time it takes to safely pass a cyclist is trivial - you just get to the the next red light an iota later....), then how many times have you heard an accident blamed on a cyclist, because they were going too fast.... (they should have been going slow enough to stop for that stupid driver who decided to pull out in front of them as they were going down that 11% grade.... or one of my other favorites the cyclist should not have been "passing on the right" - in other words car speeds around cyclist and makes right hand turn right into cyclist's path, hapless cyclist has no time to stop, but oh the cyclist should not have been "passing on the right")

I take an inbetween stand about bike paths - they are totally not the place for fast uncontrolled riding, especially on nice summer days when they are crowded. If you want to go race, do intervals, or ride with a fast group do it on the roads. Don't fall into the trap of complaining about walkers the way cars complain about cyclists... On the other hand - other people do need to have some common sense when using them....... stay to the right (I was hit head on by a bicycle coming around a corner on the left.... neither of us was going very fast, but I still don't like to fall off.... unfortunately this path crosses a bridge that only the freeway does so its not optional to use it) always leash pets and don't allow them to run wildly across the path - those stupid extendable leashes can be nearly invisible! If it is a no pet area that means you too - no matter how well behaved you think your poochie is. (there is a trail along my commute that for some reason people think is a great place to run their dogs off leash :mad: :mad: :mad: ) Teach your kids good trail ettiquite early, don't allow them to run wild either. If they are incapable of riding in a straight line, then maybe they need more practice before they are taken out onto crowded paths. Have enough adults to look after all the kids you take and ride behind them so that you can keep an eye on them. A kid who is getting panicked because they are being left behind can be dangerous - and its not making biking fun for the kid either. Look both ways before you cross or step out onto the trail! - amazing how many people don't use this bit of common sense.... if you are using a multiuse trail for any activity you have to expect and remember that others will be using it too, so don't act so suprised when there are bikes on the trail too. Oh and if you are going to stuff your ears with earbuds don't expect me to try to alert you to my presence, its not worth my time and energy to scream at you while you remain serenely oblivious.

[Susan126]

I feel the same...

Multi-use trails are just not safe for the cohabitation of bikes that go any faster than a pedestrian pace (unless it's really early in the morning and there's no one there)...

I too agree. In fact one of my favorite multi-use trails even has a speed sign posted, 10 mph. I ride this trail when I just want to get out and leisurely stretch my legs or to get some fresh air. My serious cycling I save for the roads.

And getting back to speed and roads. My husband I have have this one hilly loop we love to ride. One particular hill has an 11% grade. One day as we were coming down this hill, my hubby left me in his dust. Yes, he is much braver than I on those twisting, winding, downhills. As we were flying down this hill I noticed a truck just behind my hubby. When I finally reached the intersection at the bottom of the hill I noticed my husband chatting with the driver of the truck. When I reached Joe the truck pulled away. I asked Joe what that was all about. He said the guy was really friendly and he was also curious about how fast Joe was traveling. Apparently he tried to pass hubby but could not. So at the stop sign at the bottom of the hill he had to ask how fast hubby was going. He was shocked when Joe said, "I was coming down at 57 mph." I was shocked too! I knew he was going fast but not that fast! I chickened out and stayed around 40-45 hitting the brakes whenever my speed neared the 45 mph mark. I usually go all out on straight aways but this was a winding hill and I have trouble with those curves. They scare me. But anyway the man in the truck also said to Joe that he never realized a bicycle could go that fast! He was impressed.

My fastest speed on my bike is 47 mph. It was on Blewett Pass when I rode in the Courage Classic in 2003. I think I may have broke my own record in 2004 but I will never know as my cyclometer's battery died 2 hours into that ride.

[RoadRaven]

In fact one of my favorite multi-use trails even has a speed sign posted, 10 mph. I ride this trail when I just want to get out and leisurely stretch my legs or to get some fresh air. My serious cycling I save for the roads.

We have new bike paths being constructed and lengthened round Napier... but we hardly use them - we travel at 30km+ often on the paths - mmmm soooo much smoother and fast without effort than our lumpy roads...

They don't have speed limits posted but we have often wondered if they have limits (but I have never asked council in case some wiseass decides to post restrictions) ... however, we rarely use them as even though they are designated for bikes, pedestrians have no idea and wander all over them...

No problem with sharing, but walking folk should consider the road ri\ules and stick to one side of the path for predicatbility...

[Grog]

No problem with sharing, but walking folk should consider the road ri\ules and stick to one side of the path for predicatbility...

They should, but they don't.

There was a cyclist who paid with his life for this last year. He went around a corner on a downhill and on the other side collided with a roller-blader that was in the wrong lane. I'm not sure about the details, but the cyclist died of head injuries. The skater had some broken bones I think, but survived.

Stupid accident, sure. The only circumstance in which I would ride on one of these trails is on a big heavy beach bike, going at 10 km/h max.

[lph]

Around here there are bike paths and there are bike paths. It depends what the users expect. One of the paths is the main bike path to get from my end of town in to the centre, 10-15 miles with almost no intersections (I love this one :) ) Some pedestrians use part of it, but mostly this is the cyclists domain and you can safely ride fast here. People are used to a lot of cyclists and do actually check before crossing.

Another one is more chopped up and uses partly sidewalks, crosses quite a few roads and passes a lot of bus stops. There are a lot of pedestrians here, especially getting on or off the bus, and you just have to ride slower. People do not expect cyclists because cyclists don't use it that much.

On a broad bike path I'll swing way over and give peds as much room as I possibly can, but I won't necessarily slow down that much. My point is to demonstrate that bikes need this path too, and there is room for both of us. But this is commuting, and people on their way to work or school, not out smelling the flowers.

[Bad JuJu]

bike paths - they are totally not the place for fast uncontrolled riding, especially on nice summer days when they are crowded.
On the other hand - other people do need to have some common sense when using them
That's all I was saying. While I agree that a multi-use trail isn't the place for fast riding, multi-use still means just that--multiple kinds of activity going on, so no matter who's using it, they need to be aware that they're not the only creatures out there.

Though a trail is no place for fast, focused riding, a cyclist ought to be able to use it safely if she wants to for more leisurely rides. It's really a simple matter of etiquette (as Eden also said)--just treating other trail users the way you'd want to be treated by them. Sadly, a lot of trail users can't seem to figure that out.