Is it time for a new bike?

[Mr. Bloom]

While in the LBS the other day, Fred said "you know, it's clear you've been bitten by the bug...it's time to consider a step up"...Good sales technique Fred:)

He's suggesting that I trade in the Lemond Reno for something like a Trek 2.3 - which I will add is one sexy lookin' bike (http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/2008/road/2_series/23/):D

Silver is starting to ponder the issue, and I want more opinions.

I need a return on value...that is, "sexy lookin' " is not reason enough:p :rolleyes:

A Trek 2.3 is a lighter bike (maybe a couple pounds, but I weigh 170!), has upgraded components, a compact double (i'm on a triple now).

I've done about 2,500 to 3,000 miles in 7 months.

So the question is: What kind of performance improvement could I expect for the few hundred extra $?

[7rider]

It's always time for a new bike. At least in theory.
You've got to ask yourself a few questions.
Start out with "what is deficient with my current bike?"
If nothing, then consider it a few bills saved.
If the triple is an issue - your Reno can be fitted with a double pretty easily, for considerably less $ than a new bike.
Are you happy enough with the Reno - fit, performance - that it is more worth it to upgrade the components vs. upgrade the bike?
That said...105 is, I've heard, a great improvement over the Tiagra stuff on your Reno (assuming that's how your bike is spec'd per the Lemond website). Shifting will be more precise and smoother.
The aluminum vs. carbon frame is a personal preference. I'd suggest you go take the 2.3 out for a fairly substantial ride and see how you like it. The Madone series this year from Trek is very nice. I"m not a big fan of carbon bikes, but I have to say, that one was probably the nicest I've ridden.
You're right..."sexy" isn't really enough of an added value!
Have fun looking....that's often the best part!
p.s. 170 really isn't that much of a burden for a carbon bike. Talk to Fred about it, but I've seen guys bigger than 170 on carbon bikes.

[redrhodie]

Hey Mr,

I know how you're feeling. I had a perfectly decent bike, but decided to upgrade to a custom bike, and felt really weird about it. As the bike building process was underway, I found myself trying to justify to myself why I needed this fancy bike. I knew I still wouldn't be winning the Tour de France. It seemed like such an unnecessary luxury. Well, sometimes it's the luxuries that make life fabulous! You need things like that in life.

One thing that for sure is true--it's more fun to ride a better bike. So I say go for it. Your other bike will be for rainy days and going to the store. You need a backup! Plus, we can all tell what a great guy you are. You deserve it!

[makbike]

Mr. Silver-

I'm going through the same thing. I've sold my recumbent and am giving some serious thought to purchasing a new bike. However, I'm having a hard time convincing myself to part with the cash. My Univega (purchased in the mid 80's) is a great little bike even though it weighs 30+ pounds. I find myself thinking about a light weight bike, what will that do to my speed, my confidence, my desire to ride more? After the club ride this morning I'm planning on visiting a couple of shops and hopefully taking some bikes out for a spin or two. I've been looking at the LeMond Buenos Aires (WSD) but that is all at this time, just looking. At the moment I keep telling myself there is no harm in looking so that is just what I plan to do, look and dream. Who knows maybe by spring I'll be riding a new, fancy, light weight bike or I may just stick to riding my trusted friend. So Mr. Silver, go out and look and dream and have fun.

[SouthernBelle]

I would say if you think a new ride might improve your experience in some way enough to make it worthwhile, ride several bikes. Not just the one Trek. Don't get too wrapped up in the triple vs double thing, but do look at what a component upgrade would do, if anything from your point of view. I'm also guessing you are currently riding 3x9, most new bikes will have 10 in the back.

I personally like my triple, but you are stronger than me.

[rij73]

The nicer components will mean better shifting for sure. Also, when I got a new bike I went from a triple to a compact double. My easiest gear now is only a teensy bit harder than the easiest gear on the triple, but I find shifting is so much better with a double. It's simpler and more straightforward. I know some people love their triples, but I definitely wouldn't go back.

So, smoother, easier shifting... A bit more speed because of the lighter weight... Better comfort because of the carbon stays... All the little things together will make a bike that as long as it fits you properly will be more fun to ride. You definitely deserve it with your major accomplishments, so if you can afford it, go for it!

[silver]

a few thoughts here.....

the 2.3 does not have a compact double....it's a regular double. You use your small ring on the triple a lot! That said, I LOVE my double...love the shifting, but am scared to do some of the hills that you do.

Mr. is very hard on his bike. He's only 170# but somehow he cranks and mashes that thing up. It's his style and there's nothing wrong with it, but he does need a bike that is substantial enough to handle it. Honestly, I don't think that he should go to an all carbon bike but I've always liked this model of trek that has the carbon stays, carbon, seatpost and carbon fork, but aluminium body.

Trek doesn't have a 49cm in this model and Fred used that to sell you on the Lemond. You need to look at the geometry.

You should consider not trading in your bike, so that you would have a second bike for second home if need be or a second bike for the trainer. Or even a second bike that has the triple for rides that you feel you may need it.

I'm going to go inspect your bike to see if it is specked out as listed here.

[mimitabby]

I wonder why someone who loves 20% grades would want a double instead of a triple. (There are lots of other cool bikes out there!)

Don't be suckered in by the sales talk.

[KnottedYet]

If Mr has an assertive riding style like Silver says, maybe a custom steel bike would suit?

A nice Waterford?

[silver]

If Mr has an assertive riding style like Silver says, maybe a custom steel bike would suit?

A nice Waterford?

I did mention that he should at least consider a steel. ;)

[sundial]

I was thinking......since you accomplished so much this year in both your riding and fitness goals, why not reward yourself with a nice bike to tackle those upcoming rides? Not only will you have more zoom zoom, but you'll be a serious contender as well.

[silver]

Whoops! maybe I spoke too soon. What is the difference between a compact double and a regular double?

I thought I had a regular double, but maybe I don't......

Oh, dear....must go research....

[silver]

WELL...I was WRONG!!!! That 2.3 does have a compact crank. Learn somefin new ever day!

I didn't realize that Trek had started putting compact cranks on all but the pro line bike.

So I have a 53/39 double crank (which is a regular double crank) on The Lovely Madone. But the bike that Mr.'s looking at has a 50/34. So it sort of takes the inbetween of the triple cranks.

[Veronica]

My compact double is a 46 - 33, with an 11 - 34 in the rear. What's the rear cluster on the Trek? And I have no problems climbing 20% grades. Other than they are 20% grades! :D

V.

[Veronica]

Will it make you any faster? Maybe a little. You can put in your stats in this nifty calculator. Five pounds off my bike gets me up Mt Diablo 3 minutes faster. That's a 12 mile climb, average grade of 6%, with spots of 9% to 17%. A lighter bike only really matters on a climb.

V.

http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm

[silver]

The 2.3 trek is 50/34 with a 11-25 cassette.

I'm riding a 53/39 with either a 11-25 cassette (on my Bontrager race wheels) and a 12-27 cassette on the American Classic wheels. (I'll likely flip flop the cassettes for tri racing season). This takes me over all the hills that I do around here. Except the 25% (is that what it was) alley that Mr. likes to do. I'm too afraid to try.

[Veronica]

You can look up the gear ratios on Sheldon Brown's site to see how big of a jump it would be. Once you figure out what the easiest ratio on the new bike will be, make Mr. ride up that 25% using that gear ratio equivalent on his current bike. That way you can see if a compact double with that gearing will work for you, where you ride.

I did this when I bought my new bike and got a compact double on it. My compact double lowest gear is about 10% taller than the lowest gear I have on my triple. Once I ordered the new bike, I just stopped using that lowest gear. I missed it for awhile, still do sometimes. :D

V.

[silver]

Oh, that's good V. Good way to go about it. So using that, he would only have the equivalent of 3rd gear.

[Triskeliongirl]

I have a compact double (50/34) with an 11/34 in back. If that is what Mr. Silver wants, he should negotiate with the bike shop. Usually they will make swaps to get you the gearing you want. If he wants a mountain cog set in back though, he will want a 9 and not 10 speed druve chain (can get a 12/27 in 10 though). He will have to be sure they choose the apprpriate rear derailleur though. For the 12/27 he will need a medium cage and for the 11/34 he will need a long. Mine has a long so I can use an 11/34 but it also works fine with my 12/27. The bike may only come stock with a short if it comes with a tight rear casette. But, getting back to whether Mr. S. needs a new bike. Given that his current bike is aluminum, is the new bike really that much lighter? Aluminum is light, just harsh to some people. Rather than going from an entry level to mid level bike, why not go to a high end when the time is right (full carbon w ultegra/durace). The higher you go in component group, you gain both lightness and performance (smoother shifting, etc.). I think 170 lb is fine for full carbon. Titanium is something else to consider, light and strong, and lasts forever and doesn't rust. A custom is something to consider if stock geometries don't work well.

[Triskeliongirl]

Another idea is to get a bike that can do something your current bike can't, like travel. I have an s/s coupled bike that fits in an airline legal suitcase. Had a bike friday before that. I remember not being able to take bikes was an issue on your last vacation.

[Mr. Bloom]

I wonder why someone who loves 20% grades would want a double instead of a triple.

mimi...you guessed my first thought:eek:


Oh, that's good V. Good way to go about it. So using that, he would only have the equivalent of 3rd gear.

Well, last week at the Hilly, I didn't walk at all, but I required granny gear to get up the steepest grades. I'm not sure that if I could only get to the equivalent of 3rd, that I couldn't take the hill:(


A lighter bike only really matters on a climb.


So, does this offset the loss of granny & second?


Rather than going from an entry level to mid level bike, why not go to a high end when the time is right (full carbon w ultegra/durace).

I'm thinking that this approach might make me a stronger rider...Of course, that would have me seeking a serious bike at a time that the first year's college tuition comes due:eek:

[Veronica]

So, does this offset the loss of granny & second?


Only you can really answer that question. :) Seriously, I'd try riding without those gears and see how you feel. If you like the bike but want/need different gearing you can always get the shop to swap it out.

But really, what's wrong with your current bike? I can see wanting to have two bikes for lots of reasons. But if you're going to trade it in your old one, why spend the money on a new one? I just want you to think about what you're hoping to get out of a new bike. :)

V.

[Mr. Bloom]

Thanks V (and everyone else as well).

I'm not going to even consider acting on this until March...why buy as winter approaches????

I need to focus on building my core body strength this winter, losing more weight, and researching this potential purchase.

[onimity]

I climb a lot on a compact double and find that it is fine, but it took me a while to get strong enough to tackle steep hills without super-low gearing. I agree with the advice to ride your current bike accordingly. It may be heavier, but that will make you stronger, so you'll just be faster when you get the new bike...

If it were my decision, I'd wait. I know, not too exciting, but if you feel that you can afford it now (as opposed to when tuition is due), maybe set aside the money now and wait until you find a bike that is going to last you a long time. If you're going to upgrade you might as well do it right, rather than getting a bike with a frame/components that you are going to want to upgrade again in a year or two (I think you said something about wanting to race in a year or two, right?). Also keep in mind that you can get a great deal on previous years bikes, especially as they sit around longer. I saved $700 on my bike that way, and it brought full carbon/ultegra into my aluminum/105 budget.

The other benefit to waiting is that you can take a lot of time test riding so you know *exactly* what you want.

Either way, enjoy the bike shopping!

Anne

[Melalvai]

I'm not going to even consider acting on this until March...why buy as winter approaches????
Get snow chains at the same time? :D

[Triskeliongirl]

Don't underestimate the price break on end of the year sales as they make rom for the 2008s. BUT, try to first define what you expect this new bike to do that is different from the one you have. Do you know what your current bike weighs? Does it shift smoothly? Does it fit you well? I'm just not sure you are gonna get the performance boost you think from moving from an entry level to mid level bike, especially given that your entry level bike is aluminum and therefore likely to be plenty light (unless it is uncomfortably harsh, but if that is the case then consider a less harsh frame material).

[Mr. Bloom]

These are good points to ponder. Current bike:


Fit = Great!
Weight = about 21lbs
Price = they don't tend to carry my short size in stock...when I buy, I'm one to want the lastest...not last yr's model
Shifting = not great, but good...but I love my shifters that have gear indicators on them...don't like looking down to remember my gears!


I like the idea of getting better wheels and cutting my rolling resistance by about 10% and achieving half the weight reduction of going to a new bike...for a lot less $

[wannaduacentury]

Thanks V (and everyone else as well).

I'm not going to even consider acting on this until March...why buy as winter approaches????

I need to focus on building my core body strength this winter, losing more weight, and researching this potential purchase.

Good idea Mr. Silver. My 2 cents worth is to upgrade what you have(the Lemond) which fits you well, then really do your homework on what kind of newer bike you'd like. Then you won't feel rushed into a decision. Bike lust runs rampant at TE ,it's hard to escape for all of us. It's just too much fun :) ;) :rolleyes: Jenn

[Veronica]

T
Shifting = not great, but good...but I love my shifters that have gear indicators on them...don't like looking down to remember my gears!
[/LIST]



That's one reason I love bar end shifters. I can tell about what gear I'm in from it's placement. I don't need to know exactly where it is, just whether or not I can go up or down. :D

V.

[Mr. Bloom]

That's one reason I love bar end shifters. I can tell about what gear I'm in from it's placement. I don't need to know exactly where it is, just whether or not I can go up or down. :D

V.

Bar End Shifters? Is this one of those numbered dials?

[Veronica]

Bar End Shifters? Is this one of those numbered dials?

Ahhh... no....


http://tandemhearts.com/coppermine/albums/legolas/legolas_06.jpg

Bar end shifters are the silver levers at the end of the handlebar. the left one is pointed down, that tells me I'm in my small gear in the front. If it were pointed straight back, I'd be in the large ring. On my triple I also have a middle position.

The right one is about halfway through the cluster. The closer it is to being straight back, I know I have fewer easier gears. The closer it is to straight down, the harder the gears.

V.

[SR500]

SR500's DH here. You should go for more of an upgrade. While the 2.1 is nice, it's fairly close to what you have. The new Madones are running several hundred off list price (although delivery is slow). I would go carbon with a compact. A light stiff bike with an awesome ride, will improve all aspects on your riding, climbing, group rides, comfort, enjoyment, everything. I ride a Madone compact and love it! I've not been on a new one, but everyone I've talked with that has ridden them LOVE them. As far as durability, the carbon will last as long as a good steel or AL. Trek has the best warranty on the biz, so go carbon. Trek's entry level Madone is a fair be less and imported, but I would go with a 5.2 of get all the advantages the new bike.

PS. Keep you old bike. I have a Binachi I ride a couple hundred miles a year; vacation, rain, and if the Madone is out of commission for any reason. Have fun shopping, buying a new bike is a blast!

[Mr. Bloom]

Mr. SR500...how do you feel about carbon for someone who's prone to low speed falls (although it's been a few months, my experience doesn't make me think that it's beyond happening again:eek: )

[smilingcat]

Dear Mr. Silver,

It used to be that nick in the carbon frame meant the end, but these days things are so much better that a minor scratch or nick does not impare the frame whatso ever.

Now having said that, if you are prone to slow speed fall, you might consider steel or titanium. Steel can be reworked, titanium is like a spring so it flexes and pops back to its original shape. None for the wear.

Aluminum frame with its over sized tube, I'm not too terribly sure how it fares in slow speed crash.

Then there are Metal Matrix composite boron nitride matrixed into aluminum (you'll only find it in Griffen bike from Austin Tx was it). probably can't be reworked? or Calfee is developing a bike for the third world country. Its to be made from locally available material mostly bamboo for the frame. How neat is that!!

just my highly opinionated comment regarding frame material.

I'm partial to Ti 3Al/2.5V tubes. The more stiffer Ti tubing using 6AL/4V tends to suffer from stress fracture and cracking. So stay away from the super stiff Ti tube using the 6AL/4V composition.

smilingcat

[SR500]

Mr. SR500...how do you feel about carbon for someone who's prone to low speed falls (although it's been a few months, my experience doesn't make me think that it's beyond happening again:eek: )

I wouldn't worry about it. I've fallen over once on the bike, extreme slow speed, my body took the blow, I can't remember if I even unclipped. I've also had the bike fall over on several occasions, other then a couple scuffs, again no problem. Carbon will tend to bounce off, whereas aluminum and even steel will dent. Most of the time a dent isn't a problem other then appearance.

With carbon you need to be careful of deep scratches, but like the other materials, carbon is also repairable. Titanium is nice, and Waterford makes some beautiful steel bikes, but carbon is an excellent frame material.

I also run a carbon bar, stem, seat post, and crank, and don't worry at all. Trek does their homework, and tests bike and components as good if not better then anyone else. They also have a decent crash replacement program, if needed.

I would try and at least ride a '08 Madone (I think there are a few at a couple shops in Indy and Cincy). We have a new 5.1 WSD on order for SR, and got a great price, just have to wait on it for a couple months.

[silver]

Looks like it's time for Mr. SR500

[Jo-n-NY]

If you need a 49, Specialized offers their Tarmac & Roubaix in a 49 both are carbon. Or the Allez which is aluminum, however, has carbon seat stays, fork, etc as does the Trek. The Allez also comes in a 49.

Specialized also does indepth testing on their carbon bikes and lists such info in their catalog.

Just thought I would offer another option.

~ JoAnn

[Mr. SR500]

Looks like it's time for Mr. SR500

What ya know, I'm already online. Makes sense since I'm online like 99% more then Kim. I've been trying to get her new Madone squared away. Our LBS was purchased, so her order has been a little up in the air. Still looking at a '07 delivery we hope. When we placed the order we were number 152 for a 52 cm Madone 5.1, however production wasn't scheduled until December. I guess Trek underestimated demand a bit when they rolled them out in August. Anyway, I think Mr. S should still consider a Madone or other carbon frame bike.

Do you guys do any time trails? I'm trying to get Kim to go with me on the tandem. On singles my age group is so competitive, it makes it tough to get in the medals, but now mixed tandem :D

[Mr. Bloom]

Mr. SR500...welcome out of the world of "lurking" into the sunlight:D

I will consider a Madone...but my guess is I'll shoot for that in '09 due to the cost and my relative low skill level (when we have the first year of college tuition:eek: )

I've not done anything competitive yet, but I do have a goal of doing something competitive in '09. Do you have any time trial event suggestions for a mid-40's greenhorn rider?

[Mr. SR500]

You'll be fine, TT's are fun because it doesn't take the whole day and there is plenty of down time to hang out with your buddies and have fun. I don't even have aero bars, but enjoy seeing if I can improve against myself. The course is 20k (12+ miles), and fairly flat out and back. It sort of reminds me of a 5K in the running world. We go over to Ohio the last Sat of the month (Feb - Sept). Last month they had ran a team TT, so the Zipp Team boys came over from Indy and went home with the money. They were impressive, 4 identical Cervelos all with DEEP Zipp rims, on top of a black Mercedes wagon. In general the hardware the people bring is amazing, full TT bikes, disk wheels, lots of deep carbon wheels, etc... But there are also kids, recumbents, and everything in between. At the end they give medals in each age/gender cat, and occasionally door prizes.

Back to bikes, lots of great bikes to try, but I would consider a bigger jump and if you needed to wait a year you'll be happier in the long run. I try to focus all my hobby attention and money on biking, and with the health benefits make it easy to justify.

P.S. SR500 gave me my Madone for my 40th b-day, great wife!

[Jo-n-NY]

What a great gift. My dh surprised me with my Ruby Pro in March.

How nice to see another Mr. on the board. :)

~ JoAnn

[RoadRaven]

Without even reading the whole thread, i have the answer...

Its ALWAYS time for a new bike!

:p

And of the whole thread, the bit that caught my eye next after the title was in these last few posts...

Welcome MrSR500 :)
And yes, there are a few of here who time trial... do a search on the word/s and you should get linked to quite a few threads.
There is also one in the tips/tricks forum on tips for time trialling I started last year (I think) and quite a few TE-ers have added to it.

Its the ultimate race - the race of truth, the great equaliser, because all you have is you and your bike... I love TTs (can you tell?)

Ans like MrSilver says, they don't take all day and you can really measure yourself and challenge yourself
:)

[RoadRaven]

Ahhh... no....
Bar end shifters are the silver levers at the end of the handlebar. the left one is pointed down, that tells me I'm in my small gear in the front. If it were pointed straight back, I'd be in the large ring. On my triple I also have a middle position.
V.

I looked and looked for a looooong time... where? where? where?
But I was looking for aero bars - thank you - I am enlightened! I have bull horns and aero bars so my bar-end shifters are at the end of aero bars, and the brake levers on the bull horns.

I had no idea bar-end shifters could/did go also on drops!

Seek TE for Ultimate Enlightenment!

[Starfish]

My compact double is a 46 - 33, with an 11 - 34 in the rear. What's the rear cluster on the Trek? And I have no problems climbing 20% grades. Other than they are 20% grades! :D
V.

V, what pros and cons are there to the 46 being your largest CR?