Question for runners: Are some people just not capable of running?

[baskingshark]

At the beginning of the summer, I signed up to run in a charity 5K. Since I'm not a a "runner", I found a beginner's schedule (couch to 5k) to follow and read some running for beginners books and bought proper shoes. Before I started, one of the books advised that you should be able to walk for at least 30mins at 15mm pace before you start. I was able to do this with no difficulty.

Fast forward 18 weeks, having slavishly run 3x per week (mostly on a treadmill at the gym) following the program, I can now "run" for 30m (not even 5K) on a good day, but at about 14.5mm pace. If I try to go any faster, it just feels really hard and my HR goes through the roof (well over 85% max HR). So, after over 4 months of training, I am a just a fraction faster than I was on the first day of brisk walking.

Now, I know nobody is forcing me, and honestly, why bother, when you can get the same exercise benefits while having fun (i.e. riding my bike, or even just walking for that matter), but is it possible to just be REALLY BAD at running? Or am I doing something wrong?

[Grog]

I am a pretty fit person in general, I cycle a lot, lots of hills, etc.

When I started running two years ago now, my HR went really high and just stayed there. It went down progressively, but it took many, many months. However I became much more comfortable doing the exercise. Now it's still about 10 beats higher than it would get from cycling for the same level of exhaustion.

Running is one of the hardest workouts you can impose on your body. It takes a long time to adjust. One way to ease up into it is by alternating running and walking. Even today, I walk a little on my long runs (over one hour). During races longer than 10K, I walk through the aid stations.

You don't say anything about your physical condition in general or about your weight. Running is also a weight-bearing exercise, and the more you have, the harder it will be. In that case, your exercise program should definitely come with a new nutrition program...

On a final note, if you haven't exercised for a long time, you might want to consider visiting your doctor and share your plans with him/her, too, just to get the green light on everything.

Good luck!

p.s. I read your message again and noted that you said that "if you try to go faster, your HR goes through the roof." That's not necessarily a bad thing, and it's called intervals training. Don't bother looking at your HR. If you feel like puking, it's too much. But stretching your comfort level is what will make you fitter... (with of course your doctor's approval)

[VeloVT]

Now, I know nobody is forcing me, and honestly, why bother, when you can get the same exercise benefits while having fun (i.e. riding my bike, or even just walking for that matter), but is it possible to just be REALLY BAD at running? Or am I doing something wrong?


Hi Baskingshark,
I agree with everything Grog said. Running is much harder cardiovascularly than biking (or at least, it's easy to bike for a long time without ever pushing your hr as high as moderate running). It's also harder on your joints and, I think, on your ligaments and tendons. If I've not run at all for a long time it takes a little time for me to get my knees and my achilles tendons back in shape. They complain with all sorts of little twinges that just go away completely once I've been running steadily for a few weeks.

But to answer your question that I quoted above: do you enjoy what you're doing? if you are getting some pleasure, some satisfaction out of doing it, if there's something that makes you want to keep working at it, then don't worry about whether you're "good" at it or not. You WILL make progress if you stick with it. It might take you longer to reach some arbitrary goal than someone else (though for sure there will be others out there who will take longer than you). But this doesn't mean there's no point to it -- the only time I would say "why bother?" is if you decide you just really don't enjoy it at all. And that's a good enough reason.

Good luck!!!

[KSH]

Well, call me negative-nelly... but I think that some people are runners and others are not.

Now, does that mean that people who are not gifted runners, cannot run? Nope. It just means they have to work twice as hard at it, and will still probably be twice as slow.

From experience... and months of hard work and dedication... I have learned that my body rejects running. Yes, REJECTS RUNNING. It simply hates it.

No matter how long I run, how far I run, how fast or slow I run... I never get better. The more I run, the more my body rejects it.

Recently I have picked up a nice little GI issue. Not pretty, let me tell you... and it's all related to running.

When my body isn't spewing disgusting stuff after a long run... my body hurts. My feet, lower legs, etc. In fact, the pain in my lower legs popped up about 2 years ago and there doesn't seem to be a medical reason for it, or a fix.

OH... but wait... let's not forget the SIDE CRAMP I get from time to time. Lucky me, that typically pops up when I race (triathlons). That's always fun... running hunched over with my fingers jabbed into my side... breathing deep... again... my body REJECTS RUNNING.

With all of that said... I do put in an average of 80 miles a month running. It's slow, it's painful, it's never fun... but I do it. I kind of have to for my triathlons.

So, I may never be a great runner (trust me on this ladies- I won't be)... but I trudge along... getting it done... and I finish the miles. Even if ladies pushing strollers pass me... I finish.

Sorry I couldn't be more positive... but I truly believe that some people are gifted runners, others are not. I couldn't tell you what your fitness level is, or where you fall... but just keep at it... and if you do... you too will be running 12 minute miles!

Seriously though, it did take me a good 2 or 3 months before I could run a mile without walking.

[JTri's]

I would agree that some people are gifted, or natural runners and some aren't. I happen to really have to work at running, but I find I get a huge amount of satisfaction from simply sticking with something that is so challenging. I went for an 8 mile run last Saturday, finished feeling strong, and I was smiling all day. Who knew I could do it? Not me!

My heartrate also tends to be higher than it should be, especially at the start of a run, but it comes down as I get into it and after a mile or two it's usually fine. I run/walk the first few miles and find that helps immensely.

I'm also fairly slow (12 min miles), and right now that doesn't bother me because I am focusing on be able to complete a half marathon and besides that, well I'm just so delighted to actually be jogging any amount of distance that I don't care how long it takes me :)

If I were to be working on my speed I would start doing some track workouts and some hills too. Have you tried either of those? For your body to go faster, it has to practice that faster speed, if only for a limited amount of time.

[rocknrollgirl]

I am not a natural runner either. I have had to work really hard to get better, but I have gotten better. I am never going to be smoking fast, it is not in the cards for me, BUT, I have taken several mins per mile off my pace in the last two years. I plan to keep working on it this winter.

Now that being said, I really like it. I only trail run, no roads, my knees can't take it. I now look forward to it as much as I do mt biking.

I recently stumbled across information by Jeff Galloway about his walk/run training. Go on his website and check it out. I tried it the other day and it works.

[teigyr]

I think there are some people who are built for it more than others.

I was a competitive runner from 5th grade through High School. I had the best coaches (pre-Olympic) and our team was fantastic. I broke school records but amongst my peers in running, I was not as good. I rarely ran for a school team, I was good for the school team. In my pre-Olympic team, I was adequate.

I remember running for years then we'd get a new person who just "took" to it.

Like anything, some people are more gifted than others. The rest of us can work on it and be ok but never great. We each have something we are better at than others so I figure it's ok.

I've started running again for a tri. Half the time it hurts (got orthotics) and there are times I seriously doubt my sanity and wonder where all my efforts are going. There are other days, however, when I feel good! I'll never be great but sometimes it is almost fun.

One last thing is maybe get a coach? Just someone who can look at your form and give you pointers. I did that with swimming and it made SUCH a huge difference. You just want to be comfortable and get through what you need to do and a coach can help you work on that.

[Zen]

It's not much fun doing something if you aren't reasonably good at it. If you're determined though, I second the interval training.

In running, your body takes a real beating - especially the feet and knees.
When I'm on my bike and encounter a runner I can't help but notice how pained they look. Cyclists are generally smiling and happy. Runners, not so much ;)

[runner2]

if you can't run, then jog.
if you can't jog, then walk.
if you can't walk, that will be a lie.
be yourself not somebody else.
find your own things to do and have fun with them.
practice makes perfect (or better)
there are many different kinds of running, many different kinds of jogging or walking, just do your own way and have fun.
see you on the road!

[Deborajen]

Runner's World has lots of good information on their site about training. The thing to keep in mind is that to increase distance and speed takes two different types of training. For distance, do a slow/easy run - or run/walk, and gradually increase your distance each week. This will build your endurance. For more speed, do interval training (easy run, run at a moderate tempo, easy run) over a shorter distance. As most any running site will tell you, if you train at 80-85% of your MHR all the time, you won't see much improvement - even though you are getting exercise.

Personally, I love running and conquering distance barriers. It's not all about speed. But if you prefer walking or cycling, that's good, too - they're both great exercise. Run the 5K or walk it - lots of people walk in 5K's. It always feels good to finish, especially if it's a charity event.

Deb

[trickytiger]

I guess I'm one of the wierdos that finds running EASIER than biking. :rolleyes:

However, I'm 28 and I've been a runner since I was 12 (competitive in high school and college), and a year-round soccer player from the ages of 5-15. So perhaps I just never knew what it was like NOT to run! I literally grew into my body while running.

I find the heartrate issue interesting as well. I can maintain a lactate-threshold HR pretty easily while running and for quite a while- but if I try to hit the same HR on my bike, my legs just can't take it. I probably have strength imbalances from being a runner that are exposed by biking.

So- I don't know about there being natural runners or not. Perhaps- you do get the occasional insanely gifted athlete- but for the most part, I think environment has a lot to do with it.

However, I do want to point out one great benefit that running provides that biking and swimming don't- while high-impact exercise can be hard on your joints, it also acts to strengthen and build bone mass. As long as you don't overload your legs with pounding (ie GRADUALLY increase length/time by no more than 10% a week), your body will eventually adjust. I had a MRI in college of my knee- and when the doctor saw the slides all he had to say was "you've got VERY dense bones!". I took it as a compliment.

[Starfish]

Kind of a thread hijack, but maybe pertinent, too?

KSH...your post makes your running sound super miserable for you. This is just plain old curiosity...why do you do it? I know you do triathlons...but, I would just be curious to hear your thoughts about what makes all that pain worth it, rather than just focusing on bike riding/racing, and swimming for fun with a masters team (or competing with masters swimmers), etc.?

[KSH]

Kind of a thread hijack, but maybe pertinent, too?

KSH...your post makes your running sound super miserable for you. This is just plain old curiosity...why do you do it? I know you do triathlons...but, I would just be curious to hear your thoughts about what makes all that pain worth it, rather than just focusing on bike riding/racing, and swimming for fun with a masters team (or competing with masters swimmers), etc.?

Well, I love training for and competing in tri's. I want to accomplish some goals in that sport before moving on. Unfortunately, running is apart of that sport. :(

I use to not be this bad at running. Just as the years have gone on, it has gotten worse. I was never fabulous, but it wasn't as miserable as it is now. I keep thinking it will get better the more I do it. Nope, not so much. Just new stuff hurts.

And... finally... I'm really hard-headed and I REFUSE to let it get the best of me. Hey, last year I couldn't run at all and now I'm running 80 miles a month. It's not pretty or fast... but I get it done.

I just think at times I get frustrated with it, because my speed never improves, new stuff hurts... and IF I could run FAST... I would be competitor in my age group in my tri's. There are a few times I would have placed in the top 3.

[Zen]

However, I do want to point out one great benefit that running provides that biking and swimming don't- while high-impact exercise can be hard on your joints, it also acts to strengthen and build bone mass. As long as you don't overload your legs with pounding (ie GRADUALLY increase length/time by no more than 10% a week), your body will eventually adjust.

Exercise doesn't have to be high impact to build bone density, it has to be weight bearing. Walking, squats,lying leg raises with ankle weights or a resistance band will do. And it won't beat up your joints.

[luv'nAustin]

Ksh just describes how my body reacts to running. It is always painful...during and afterwards.

A cardiac surgeon once said that some people are built for running and others are not. He said it isn't just mechanics, but heart and lung function come into play as well. Of course, how your body is put together is important too.

[baskingshark]

Thanks to everyone for all your advice and suggestions - very much appreciated.

I'm glad to hear that there are others like me. I think I like the IDEA of running and that's what motivates me to keep going even though it's hard, but I think that I'm still hoping that some day, something will just "click" and I'll be able to run 3 or 4 miles at 10 or 11mm pace while being able to hold a conversation.

[KSH]

Ksh just describes how my body reacts to running. It is always painful...during and afterwards.

A cardiac surgeon once said that some people are built for running and others are not. He said it isn't just mechanics, but heart and lung function come into play as well. Of course, how your body is put together is important too.

Well, at least I'm not alone. :o

I had a test at my Dr.'s office to test my lung capacity. He was very shocked that I was very slightly above average. He figured I would be way above average because I'm a runner. I kept emphasizing to him was a horrible runner I am... and I guess I know why. :(

[Zen]

Why some women run faster as they grow older (http://www.sportsgeezer.com/sportsgeezer/2007/08/why-women-run-f.html
) from SportsGeezer
and
more from NY Times writer Gina Kolada (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/30/health/nutrition/30Fitness.html?ex)

[Starfish]

KSH, thanks for the reply. You have a lot of perseverance! :)

I used to love running. When I start back up later this year, I will be interested to see if 20 years has changed that.

[VeloVT]

I think everybody has an "achilles heel" sport. I'm a fairly natural runner; I'm not out there setting any speed records but I improve quickly with training and don't feel like I've yet trained so hard that I've reached the point of diminishing returns. BUT....

I REALLY, REALLY want to tri triathlon. I took swimming lessons when I was a kid, I'm comfortable in the water, but haven't swum laps in years. This spring, I started trying to swim laps, hoping to do a sprint tri at the end of April. Well, it turns out that 50 yards in the pool leaves me gasping for breath and sends my hr through the roof. It took me about two months to be able to complete just 100 yards freestyle, and even then it wasn't certain. I'd say I was going to swim 5 hundreds, and out of that I'd probably be able to complete 3 without stopping (that's not because I swam three in a row and then got tired and couldn't do the last two -- it's that my ability to pace myself and maintain that pace and maintain steady breathing was just really shaky and uncertain each time). Most of the summer, I've wanted to start swimming again and simutaneously dreaded it. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how difficult it is for me to improve. With lots of things (running, biking, weight lifting), I start training and get better really fast and it's actually fun to see myself improve -- it's like, every week I can see I've gotten faster, stronger, whatever. With swimming, it's a constant struggle. I expect that I'll get better quickly, and I do gradually improve a little, but it's... well, a struggle. And the improvements are much smaller and take much longer than for other things. Drills help. But it's still a struggle. I AM going to start swimming again this fall (now that I"m back on campus and the pool is free!). But I know it will be frustrating.

[JTri's]

Here's an idea for "everything hurting" after a run that I recently started and really works for me: an ice bath.

I fill the tub with cool water so that it will cover me to past my hips, then throw in all the ice we have and stir. Ease myself in and sit for 5 min. The first 30 seconds is the worst. It sounds horrible, I know, but wow, what a difference 5 minutes can make.

I used to just ice my knees, but dunking my entire lower body into ice water really takes care of tiny little aches and pains. My feet, my ankles, my everything :) feels better even later in the day, which took me by surprise.

[Starfish]

Here's an idea for "everything hurting" after a run that I recently started and really works for me: an ice bath.

I couldn't agree more! I've never used it for running before, but it works great for post-long-rides. I even put on a couple sweatshirts and get the bathroom as hot as possible so I can stay in longer. REALLY helps.

[VeloVT]

Wow! You guys are brave :D ! I've never had the courage to actually try this.

[HappyAnika]

I'm really bad at running. I've hated it for most of my life. In jr. high and high school PE when they'd make us run, I'd try my best to get out of it (asthma was a great excuse usually). When I couldn't get out of it, I just despised it. Everything hurt, particularly my lungs, and it made me feel generally ill. This was because I was so incredibly out of shape, and looking back, I don't see why my PE teachers thought they had any business pushing someone so out of shape clearly past their physical limits . . . and then to be graded on it! The horror! :eek:

Fast forward many years, and all of a sudden all of my friends are running . . . after the knee surgeries, I had to keep exercising beyond PT otherwise the knee hurt, so I took up things like hiking and aerobics. I tried running, it hurt, so I gave up. But peer pressure and the desire to get into better shape kept making me try, but then it hurt and I sucked, so I quit. Then after I took up cycling (the best thing ever), I got the tri bug. So I pushed my way through a 5k, figuring if it didn't kill me I'd do a sprint tri. Well I'm obviously still here, so when it came time to train for the tri, I took it really easy, got myself a heart rate monitor, and eased myself into running. By increasing distance very slowly and keeping the heart rate down I found I actually enjoyed running. I still suck, I can only dream of an 11 minute mile, but I like going out to the parks and running, it's very peaceful and relaxing. There's something liberating about just tying up your shoes and going. No gear, no equipment, just you and the road (or path).

Ok, so my whole point is, if you don't like it, don't do it. My example is skiing. I've tried and tried, but I just don't like it. Again, peer pressure. Everyone I know skis or rides, and it's a major damper on the winter social life if you don't. I've come to terms with the fact that I am terrified of being on a steep (or not so steep for that matter) mountainside covered in snow with long slippery skis attached to my feet. So when the friends are organzing a mountain weekend, I come along and bring my snowshoes instead. (And when they ask why I'm scared of skiing, I ask them why they are scared of going more than 30 mph down a hill on their bike, and that shuts them up fast :p ).

So to sum up my long rambling post here, I agree with those here who've said that running is defnitely harder for some than others. And life is short: if you don't enjoy something, spend your precious time doing something else you do enjoy. :)

[Kimmyt]

Wow! You guys are brave :D ! I've never had the courage to actually try this.

I've never done the ice bath (never did a run long enough to really cause me to ache), but after my last century did take a prolonged dip in very cold ocean water, and noticed that my legs felt WAY better!

As for running, I am one of the unfortunate unnatural runners. In fact, a year ago, the thought of running anywhere would have made me giggle uncontrollably. Hah. Me. Run.

However, as others have noted about themselves, I am incredibly stubborn, and if I decide i'm going to do it, goddangit I'm gonna do it.

So I started running for this tri thing, well really I started running for a lark and then shortly thereafter signed up for a tri. It sucked. It was horrible, and I was horrible. But I did it. It was something to do in the winter when I wasn't skiing or climbing. It was something to pass the time and fuel my increasingly physical lifestyle. There's something about running in the winter that is just incredibly nice, too.

And that's when it hit me. All of a sudden, it was nice. Yeah, it still sucked. And it still hurt like hell, and I was only running 3 miles at a slow pace and old men with 1/4-keg beer-bellies were passing me on the trail, but when I was finished (note, when I was finished) I was smiling. And then I ran a 5K and my goal was just to finish, and okay maybe it was to finish under 30 m intues, and then I blew away my own expectations (although I wasn't anywhere NEAR competitive). I have friends who don't run, have 'bad knees' and can run off the couch an 8-minute mile. I don't think I ever will reach that speed, and I'm okay with it, because I still enjoy my 10-minute miles.

I think there's always hope, you know? Sometimes you really have to push through some crap to get anywhere near where you're aiming, and sometimes you just have to resign yourself to never being as good as you'd hope, but if you focus on YOUR OWN goals, whether they be to run a 12-minute mile, or even just run an entire mile without stopping, running can be fun. Because theres no rule that says you have to be the best out there at something in order to enjoy it.

So keep running, if you like the challenge, even if it hurts. If you don't like it, then stop. No one will blame you either way. Rock on!

[colby]

I think with most sports there's some "natural affinity" built in. Some people have those perfect muscle/bone structures. Some people have great cardiovascular systems. Some people are built like little teapots: short and stout.

It might not be a question of whether you can run, because you can probably teach your body to do it over a long period of time. The question is whether you can tolerate it while you're learning. ;)

I work with a guy who is going to run a marathon in October based solely on two and sometimes three 12-mile runs a week, nothing longer. He runs 7-8 minute miles, and some days I hate him. However, if we were to bike the same distance, I can ride 20mph and he's riding 13mph. Go teapots! :) Those thunder thighs are good for somethin'.

I find running victories satisfying, because I know they are harder for me than they are for other people. I can't help but feel slow, but the more I work at it, the better my body gets at "remembering" how to run.

[Crankin]

I stopped trying to be a runner a couple of years ago. I never found that "good place" and constantly wanted it to be over. Never saw much improvement, either. MY HR was always higher than cycling, but I believe that is normal.
Just too many parts hurting to continue.

[tygab]

but the strange thing is... I ran track in high school and at the time, enjoyed it. Fast forward some 20 years, most of which were sporadic in activity and two ACL surgeries during, and any former enjoyment of running seemed tossed out the window. To add insult, all three of my siblings have completed marathons, with two of them becoming serial 'thon people. I have a good distance running build but the thought of running more than 3 miles was mindboggling, and yes, I was envious of my sibs' tales. I'd start 5k programs, then fizzle out, do the race anyway (miserable), and not run again for months. There was no success to be had in this recipe.

I found cycling last year, and while it was very hard at first (I was out of shape, didn't know anything about it etc), I could at least see progress and no one else in my family cycled so it was a unique adventure I could be on, I guess at some level without having to "measure up" to the running progress. One day I realized I was getting a lot more fit, enjoying long rides, and feeling good. Not too long after started having thoughts of triathlon... I get bored easily especially in a gym setting, so I thought it'd be great to have the variety of a tri training approach for the winter. And triathletes (the more established ones anyway) have pretty good all around physiques too!

I started running last year and I still haven't been as consistent as I should be with it, still faced with naggling running issues that I am working through, still drop running fitness faster than biking or swimming (no bike for a week or two? pretty easy to recover - no run for two weeks, may as well be like starting over), and do not feel like a "runner." But, there are the subtlest of signs that I am improving. Like I do not have the burning itchy legs after 10-15 minutes of running (a frequent earlier plague). Like actually being able to talk (albeit in short phrases) as I jog on occasion with others. Like still having a little in the tank at the end for a last push to the car/start/finish. And even my pace has come down a little, and I thought it never would from my prior stops and starts. It has taken me a year to get these small gains. I am sure the cross training combo of biking, swimming, and running is a great help vs running alone for me, and if I were only running I think I'd still be where I was in my prior days.

But, the fact that I've seen a few gains does give me some hope. I think my running learning curve may just be very long.

I hold no illusions that I'll ever feel like a runner, a pace under 10 minutes sounds like miracle territory (as in, I'd need a), but I figure I can slog through enough to expand my distance to a 10k for the oly or 1/2 marathon for the HIM if necessary. I don't see myself becoming a marathoner but in a few years, maybe running will feel comfortable enough to consider it. It sure isn't now, but I want the longer bike distances for the tris...

[northstar]

I h-a-t-e-d running in high school. Utter torture!

Then the bike came along, and then the idea of duathlon, and then I had to give running a try. I could barely make it a block down the street. I was totally demoralized! Fast forward six, seven months. I just finished my first 5K event and am now running 3-4 miles at a time, three or four times a week, relatively comfortably (not dying!) and things are going pretty well.

I think it's all about taking it slow at first! And realizing, heck yeah, it feels like crap when you're just starting out! If you can make it through the first few months and you're like I am, there will be a day when you go out for your run, and wow...it actually doesn't feel too bad, and hey, you feel like you could go farther. That's a good day!

So, anyway...I thought I wasn't capable of running. I was wrong! Yahoo!

It's really something a person needs to give a lot of time, if they're just starting out. Unfortunately, it frankly sucked for me the first few months! I'm glad I hung in there, though!

[mimitabby]

Exercise doesn't have to be high impact to build bone density, it has to be weight bearing. Walking, squats,lying leg raises with ankle weights or a resistance band will do. And it won't beat up your joints.

Zen,
walking doesn't do too much for your bones. You've got to have more impact.
Weight bearing stuff does help, but rather than walking do stairs or something if you can't run. I have investigated this thing thoroughly. If i could run i would.
It just hurts too darn much to run. I wish i'd started younger!

[yogabear]

I ran from 4th-12th grade. In high school, I won 8 varsity letters running, along with other awards. In college, I ran some, but just for fun. It helped me to clear my head, connect to my inner wisdom, and to get grounded.

I had some blocks related to things I believed that others told me, ie., limiting beliefs ("girls can't run as fast as guys," etc.). I also was super thin until my sophomore year of high school--I got my curves and so many people told me I'd never be fast again. What hogwash to put it politely. My physique is perfect for running actually :)

I took up bicycling in 1995 with mtn. biking and then, mtn. bike and road racing on and off since then. I have to say that it wasn't until I raced and trained that I learned what it truly was to push myself physically.

So, yes, I'm a natural runner...I'm making a slow return to it after a many year hiatus. I'm going to cross-train with my cycling disciplines and well, yoga too :)

I'd consider myself a Zen Jogger now though...I focus entirely on my breath when jogging. It's one of my many forms of meditation :)

[OakLeaf]

I talk up Chi Running so much, people must think I work for them, but really, I'm not even a real runner, and they would be embarrassed to have me working for them.

I'm with many of the rest of you. I run because * I want a different workout one or two days a week, * I like the challenge, and most of all, * because it's a cardio workout I can take with me wherever I go, and running ONLY once or twice a year on vacations just hurt too much. But I will never be a real runner. Probably just because I'm not committed enough to it to improve - in three years I've taken a whole three minutes off my 5-mile time. :rolleyes:

But because I'm interested in technique in whatever I do, even if I'm not serious about the activity, I signed up for a Chi Running workshop this spring, and it totally changed my life :cool: Problems I had with my body mechanics that affected me doing aerobics and cycling - and even standing and walking - are improving. I can see in the mirror the difference in the muscle balance in my quads.

And while my time hasn't noticeably improved, my heart rate for the same pace has dropped by 5-10 bpm.

(I've read many places, BTW, that your max running heart rate is *supposed* to be higher than cycling. And cycling is higher than swimming. It's just that way.)

So check out Chi Running, maybe it will change your life too :D

[northstar]

But I will never be a real runner.

If you run, you're a runner!

I think a lot of us hear this voice in our head that says we're not legitimate at something (running, cycling, writing, playing music, cooking, whatever!) unless we're up to some standard we assume others are imposing.

Enough! :) Give yourself some credit! ;)

[annie]

If I tried to be a "legitimate" runner, I'd never run. I'd always be comparing myself to someone better. It took me years to get away from that in cycling. I won't let it happen in running. That's why I mostly run alone. And so far, don't track my time. I just go out and run. Eventually, I hope to be comfortable enough to run with other people, and maybe even enter a few races - not to be competitive, but as a motivation to train. I want to feel good about running, not stressed out. So far, so good. And it surely helps to read these threads about how other women feel about running. I don't feel so alone. Thanks, all.

Annie

[indigoiis]

Really important to keep up with the shoes. Use your shoes only for running.

Shoes wear out fairly quickly and can cause running to be painful and uncomfortable.

[Jolt]

Interesting thread. My question is more like, "are some people just not capable of decent speed at anything?"--I have done swimming, running and cycling and been rather slow at all three (10-11 min/mile running, never got below about 32 seconds in the 50-yard freestyle, do well to average 12 mph on the bike). I also seem to get my heart rate really high more easily than most people in decent shape, especially with running. The only thing I seem to be faster than average at is walking, including hiking, but that is something that generally doesn't involve being anywhere near maximum effort. What are the factors (besides being out of shape, which isn't the case here) that affect general speed when it comes to sports?

[emily_in_nc]

Interesting thread. My question is more like, "are some people just not capable of decent speed at anything?"--I have done swimming, running and cycling and been rather slow at all three (10-11 min/mile running, never got below about 32 seconds in the 50-yard freestyle, do well to average 12 mph on the bike). I also seem to get my heart rate really high more easily than most people in decent shape, especially with running. The only thing I seem to be faster than average at is walking, including hiking, but that is something that generally doesn't involve being anywhere near maximum effort. What are the factors (besides being out of shape, which isn't the case here) that affect general speed when it comes to sports?

1. Exercise-induced asthma?
2. Muscularity (a bit difference than being "out of shape", which I would consider more of an endurance thing).
3. Power to weight ratio.
4. Heart problems (hopefully not!)

I'm similar to you -- I've been a semi-fast rider in the past when I was riding a LOT, but I have never been a fast runner at all. I am a fairly fast hiker, but nothing spectacular. I have EIA, am not all that muscular, and am very small (102 lbs). I get passed by larger, more muscular female riders on my mountain bike fairly often, which I think is can be an example of #3.

Emily

[Jolt]

1. Exercise-induced asthma?
2. Muscularity (a bit difference than being "out of shape", which I would consider more of an endurance thing).
3. Power to weight ratio.
4. Heart problems (hopefully not!)

I'm similar to you -- I've been a semi-fast rider in the past when I was riding a LOT, but I have never been a fast runner at all. I am a fairly fast hiker, but nothing spectacular. I have EIA, am not all that muscular, and am very small (102 lbs). I get passed by larger, more muscular female riders on my mountain bike fairly often, which I think is can be an example of #3.

Emily

Well, maybe my issue is just due to not being very muscular as well (5'2" and 105 lbs)--I don't have asthma, and definitely no heart problems (thank goodness!!). Actually, next week I am participating as a healthy control in a research study that involves a VO2max test and body composition analysis in the screening visit, so maybe that will shed some light on the situation. Should be interesting at least.

[KSH]

Well, I'm seriously thinking about giving up running all together. I am going to Race Walking 3-day Clinic in Austin in December... and I hope I can learn the technique so I can walk FAST!

I had to come to the realization that I suck at running... and nothing I do (getting a coach- running 80 miles a month- etc.) is going to fix how much I suck. My body just rejects running.

But I have always been a fast walker and I think with some training I can get really fast. I can walk a 13:30 minute mile now (flat terrian)... if I can get that down to a 12 or 11 minute mile... then that's how fast I was running.

[emily_in_nc]

But I have always been a fast walker and I think with some training I can get really fast. I can walk a 13:30 minute mile now (flat terrian)... if I can get that down to a 12 or 11 minute mile... then that's how fast I was running.

KSH - I know you are a triathlete so the running thing must be frustrating! Do some triathletes do race walking instead of running? I am ignorant since I've never witnessed a tri, other than the Ironman on TV.

It sounds like you have a good plan, though! :)

Emily

[KSH]

KSH - I know you are a triathlete so the running thing must be frustrating! Do some triathletes do race walking instead of running? I am ignorant since I've never witnessed a tri, other than the Ironman on TV.

It sounds like you have a good plan, though! :)

Emily

Well... they do when they get tired and can't run anymore... ;)

Seriously though, top triathletes run. They run FAST. I have come to the realization that I will never run fast. And since I'm so bad at running, why not take up race walking?

Now, I do know of one guy around these parts who walks all his run portions. Even at his Ironman's... and he beats a lot of people out there.

In the longer events, the Half Ironman and Ironman... people train to run the 1/2 or full marathon, but get out there and end up walking most of it. And they walk slow because they are so tired.

At my Half Ironman, I came in 36 out of 52... and that was walking a 1/2 marathon at a 14 minute per mile pace (it was HILLY!). I was trucking along walking and people would comment how fast I was walking. :)

So anyways... I tried Plan A... to become a runner. Plan A didn't work out.. time to move to Plan B.

[alpinerabbit]

At my Half Ironman, I came in 36 out of 52... and that was walking a 1/2 marathon at a 14 minute per mile pace (it was HILLY!). I was trucking along walking and people would comment how fast I was walking. :)

So anyways... I tried Plan A... to become a runner. Plan A didn't work out.. time to move to Plan B.

That's pretty good walking there!

I decided today, I am going to make "finish and not be last" my life motto...

[KSH]

That's pretty good walking there!

I decided today, I am going to make "finish and not be last" my life motto...

My motto is, "I won't die" or "It won't kill me". :)

[OakLeaf]

I'm working on a theory here. I actually haven't been running since I crashed my bike last month (pain at first, but a whole lot of other stuff in the last few weeks). I'm hoping to get out for a run later today. But anyway here's my idea:

Cyclists are used to nice LONG workouts. It's not even worth getting all suited up and going out the door unless we're going to ride at least an hour, and that's a really short ride. We prefer two hours on work nights and a whole lot more than that on weekends. Am I right so far?

So then the cyclist decides to go running. But our running muscles just aren't in the same kind of shape as our cycling muscles, besides the fact that even slow running is pretty intense cardiovascularly (whereas on a bike, if you want you can just take the pace down and pretty much cruise forever, long after you feel like your muscles are done).

So we're reaching our running lactate threshold at a HR that doesn't even begin to challenge a cardiovascular system that's in pretty good shape from cycling.

And SO... because we're going out to get some freakin' CARDIO, we keep our running at a pace that we can maintain for 45 minutes to an hour. It ain't even what we'd consider a minimum workout on the bike. But otherwise, we have this idea in our head that it wasn't worth the time to put on our shorts and two layers of high-impact bras and tape up all the blister-prone areas on our feet. We probably don't even think that we're limiting the pace. We just think that that's all the faster we can run, just because that's all we can maintain for five or six miles. Am I still right so far?

But then, as the saying goes,.... train slow, race slow.

I think just maybe, in order for a cyclist to learn to run, we have to be willing to go out for really short runs. Warm up, do some one-minute intervals at a seven-minute pace, then cool down and quit. (Or eight minute, or nine, or whatever's just SHORT of all-out.) Even if we've only been out for 20 minutes. Do it as the warmup to our strength day or Pilates day, or before a shorter bike ride, if keeping a workout so short would result in temper tantrums, insomnia, fighting with the spouse, inefficiency at work, or just general cranial detonation. Then incrementally increase the pace, length and number of the intervals, while leaving the rest periods the same.

That's my new training plan, anyway. I'll let you know if it works. :D

[VeloVT]

So then the cyclist decides to go running. But our running muscles just aren't in the same kind of shape as our cycling muscles, besides the fact that even slow running is pretty intense cardiovascularly (whereas on a bike, if you want you can just take the pace down and pretty much cruise forever, long after you feel like your muscles are done).

So we're reaching our running lactate threshold at a HR that doesn't even begin to challenge a cardiovascular system that's in pretty good shape from cycling.



Everyone's different, but I have the opposite problem when I'm in good biking shape, but then start running again after not doing it regularly for some time.

My legs will be capable of maintaining a faster pace than my heart and lungs will permit, because running at a moderate/high intensity is more cardiovascularly challenging than cycling at the same intensity. Typically I'll have a lot of muscular endurance from cycling and I'm used to keeping a high cadence on my bike, so my running turnover is quick, which increases speed. But at a certain point my hr just goes through the roof because I'm not in cardiovascular condition to maintain the pace I'm running, and I have to slow down, even though my legs are not feeling heavy at all.

It takes me a few weeks of regular running to get back into cardiovascular condition to maintain a challenging pace, evenly, over distance. Some of it, also, is that you have to develop a sense of pace for running, and unfortunately having a good sense of pace for cycling doesn't necessarily transfer to running, you sort of have to get the feel back.

But the other thing you mentioned, about thinking about running workouts differently than cycling workouts, that never occurred to me because I was a runner before I was a cyclist, but it's definitely true. Running burns more calories per distance or per time period than cycling, thus it is comparatively a more intense workout. Think about it: cycling 26 miles is no big deal, right? but how many of us could get up tomorrow and run 26 miles without training? not me!!! And up to a certain point, you can build cycling mileage pretty quickly -- you can go from riding 10 miles to riding 20 miles, or 20 miles to 40 miles, or 30 to 60, without too much trouble (up to a point). But that's much less the case with running I think. Once you get much past 3 miles you can't really reasonably double your distance all at once anymore. It takes a long time to build up the endurance to run for two or three (or more) hours -- much longer than it takes to build the endurance to ride for the same amount of time. Even though the same training principles apply to both, you really need to think about them differently when considering how fast to build.