simple question.

[dolcerider]

Ok. Simple question. When is it best to use the large ring? Upside of use and downside? Thank you!

[KnottedYet]

Here's a great site that talks about shifting and gears.

(pretty much everthing Sheldon Brown writes is great, so be sure to browse around after you read this article!)

http://sheldonbrown.com/gears.html

[RolliePollie]

Do you have a double or a triple? I have a triple, and I know it's time to go up to the big ring when I'm getting chain rub on my middle ring. If I want to keep pedaling and go faster, I need a gear that's harder to pedal and I can't get one in the middle ring because it's rubbing. So my choice is to coast and not pedal, or switch to the big ring so I can keep pedaling. Does that make sense? So if I was on a flat and wanted to go faster, I might choose the big ring. Or if I was on a downhill and wanted to pedal instead of coasting, I would really have to go up to the big ring.

[dolcerider]

Thank you for the web site and to answer your question Sara, I have a triple but I'm not quite sure by what you mean by chain rub? If going to the large ring can increase speed on the flat then I can see the advantage, but you are pedaling harder- wear and tear on the joints, not to mention it must be exhausting to keep up for long periods of time. So for most of us non racers best used for short bursts only- like when the men are dropping you on a club ride? :(

[RolliePollie]

Thank you for the web site and to answer your question Sara, I have a triple but I'm not quite sure by what you mean by chain rub? If going to the large ring can increase speed on the flat then I can see the advantage, but you are pedaling harder- wear and tear on the joints, not to mention it must be exhausting to keep up for long periods of time. So for most of us non racers best used for short bursts only- like when the men are dropping you on a club ride? :(

I have chain rub pretty good in my small and middle rings with certain gear combinations. Basically it's when you're cross-chaining and the chain is at an angle where is starts rubbing. You can definitely hear it...you'll know it if it happens. This is not a desireable thing, so you want to find different gear combinations to avoid it. I can only use about 4-5 gears on my small ring and 6-7 on my middle before this starts happening. I like to just stay in my middle ring if I can, but I use my small ring a lot too! I really don't use my big ring very much at all. I've just experimented with different gear combinations and found that ocassionally, it's kind of fun to use the big ring if I'm feeling a need for speed.

Here's an example from my ride today...I was on a low-traffic road with a 45 mph speed limit and I knew I'd be going gently downhill for approximately 3 miles. I was wanting to go kind of fast and coasting was only bringing me up to about 16-17 mph. I wanted to pedal, but I "ran out of gears" so to speak with my middle ring. My chain was rubbing and my cadence was so high I was bouncing in the seat. So I switched to my big ring and I could pedal up to about 23-25 mph. It wasn't difficult to pedal because I was going fast. Not exhausting at all. Now, if I had been going a lot slower, then it would've been like you said...really hard to pedal, slow cadence, wear and tear on joints, etc. Even on flats, I generally do not use my big ring. I am more comfortable with a higher cadence and I don't really "mash" unless I'm in my granniest of granny gears and a hill is so steep that I have no other choice.

Isn't this whole gearing thing crazy? After 1,000 miles, I finally really feel like I'm comfortable with the gearing on my bike. I sort of intuitively "know" what gear I'm in. When I'm climbing a big hill, I know how many gears I've got left before I hit that super duper granny gear. And of course, when my chain starts rubbing, that's a great hint that I need to change rings! :)

[makbike]

For me the decision to use the big ring is based on gear inches. I made a small chart which I taped to my bike and I refer to as I ride. I can quickly glance down and see what is available for each chain ring. Base on terrain and my legs I will decide where I want to be front & back to give me a gear which will fit my particular needs.

[dolcerider]

Boy do I agree with you! I never in a million years thought I would be so involved and still learning after taking up cycling a year ago. Thank you Sara for your insight and now I can't to get out and try something new! :)

[Torrilin]

One of my goals is to get to the point where I could do most of my riding on the big chainring. I'm in Wisconsin, so it's *flat*. Not pancake flat, but most of the hills are so gentle I just don't notice them when walking. So if I can use most of the big chainring, I have plenty of gearing for handling the little rises I get on my daily rides. And the more I ride on the big chainring, the better I do on my nemesis hill (with a whopping 5% grade :( it feels so *flat* and it's still kicking my ***).

If you are not in such a flat place, the big chainring won't be a most of the time thing the way it is for me. And if you experiment carefully on a flat bit, you should find at least one lowish gear on your big chainring that feels similar to a gear on your middle chainring, and to a different gear on your little chainring. For me, 3/3, 2/5 and 1/8 are all very similar in feel. So on a *very* flat ride, I may only work on the big chainring and use 3/2 for stops. On a bumpier ride, I may stay mostly on the middle chainring, with 2/3 for most stops and climbs, and 2/6 or 2/7 if I want to go ZOOM.

[Thorn]

Hey, Torrilin, take a weekend to the Dodgeville/Bluemound area....Wisconsin ain't flat all over :D

But, this is dolcerider's thread....everyone seems to have covered the basics, I'd iterate the usual "oh, but be careful of mashing". I'm a spinner on the flats so I find I rarely go into my large chain ring. I can ride almost the full cassette in the back without chain rub, so my large chain ring gets lonely from dis-use.

Mashing, pushing bigger gears with a low cadence, will place more stress on your knees, and, as I've discovered, your achilles tendon. Like Torrilin, I will often ride a bigger gear than I should on small inclines to give the illusion of a steeper hill, but whenever I do, I am constantly paying attention to form and ready to drop gears if the stress gets too much.

[Grog]

I have a triple, my big ring is a 52, and I use it:

down hills

when there's a tailwind

when I'm drafting off someone or in a pack and the speed is above 30kph

Also when in a pack I find that I feel more stable and in control when pedalling at a lower cadence (70 to 80), which still feels easy (no need to put weight on the pedals) so this often means going in the big ring because of the speeds we're going at.

When I'm riding on my own, I nearly never use the big ring, unless as I said I'm going down a hill or there's a serious tailwind.

If I need to accelerate (catch up with a pack or something) I'll most of the time actually downshift to an easier gear and increase my cadence a lot. Pushing big gears slow me down.

[dolcerider]

Well tried it today.... some success. Able to accelerate on the flat for short distance only. I think I need to spend a day just learning the gear ratios. When I think I have it down there is more to learn..... if only I could give up my day job. :D

[galaxygirl]

Oh man, the gear shifting is going to kill me. I forget to look up, I'm so locked into what gear I'm in! Today, I flipped the gear shift as I crested a hill and the chain fell off. Oh well. I put it back on and kept going. :p

[KnottedYet]

My shortcut: I sort of think of myself as having 3 gears; corresponding to the 3 chainrings up front. Uphill, flatish, downhill/fast. Then I use the cogs in the rear to fine-tune my "three" speeds.

It's not perfect, and not entirely accurate, but it gets the job done!

[Kalidurga]

My shortcut: I sort of think of myself as having 3 gears; corresponding to the 3 chainrings up front. Uphill, flatish, downhill/fast. Then I use the cogs in the rear to fine-tune my "three" speeds.

It's not perfect, and not entirely accurate, but it gets the job done!

I think that's actually a good way to conceptualize the chainrings, Knot. Beyond your classifications, I've come to think of the two rings on my compact as the small ring being my "easy" range of gears, and the big ring as "The gears that will make me stronger" (someday :rolleyes: ).

[Kano]

Oh man, the gear shifting is going to kill me. I forget to look up, I'm so locked into what gear I'm in! Today, I flipped the gear shift as I crested a hill and the chain fell off. Oh well. I put it back on and kept going. :p


Mine doesn't show me which gear I'm in -- I've thought about getting one of those flight deck things from Shimano, because my stuff is compatible and it would be nice to know, but then I thought, yeah, right, something more to keep me looking at the computer!

Now if I could just master the fine tuning of my big rings! (the back guys are easy)

Karen in Boise

[amelia05]

Mashing, pushing bigger gears with a low cadence, will place more stress on your knees, and, as I've discovered, your achilles tendon. Like Torrilin, I will often ride a bigger gear than I should on small inclines to give the illusion of a steeper hill, but whenever I do, I am constantly paying attention to form and ready to drop gears if the stress gets too much.

Thorn, I'm curious about this, because I've started to have problems with one of my achilles tendons. I thought it was brought on by running, since it only started to hurt about a week after I started running intervals again; however, reading your post makes me wonder if it could have been brought on by the bike as well. I've been using the big ring more on the bike in the past 3-4 months...I still wouldn't call myself a masher, but I've been going for 70-80 rpm in the big ring lately v. 80-90 in the middle. I generally drop to the middle ring on any kind of incline. Since I started running around the same time I started using the big ring (and maybe too high of a gear, in retrospect), now I'm wondering if that was just too much stress all at once. Especially since running has never aggravated my achilles before (though I was 20 lbs lighter the last time I tried running :o )

Anyway, what aspects of form do you pay attention to, to keep stress off your achilles?

[galaxygirl]

:D I meant that I keep looking down at the chainrings to see where I am. Maybe I will get a computer to show me the gears, because as it is I am going to run into something if I don't stop looking down. I think I need to ride more often so that I get the hang of it, but I hurt my shoulder (rotator cuff) so it hurts to ride too far.

[Kano]

:D I meant that I keep looking down at the chainrings to see where I am. Maybe I will get a computer to show me the gears, because as it is I am going to run into something if I don't stop looking down. I think I need to ride more often so that I get the hang of it, but I hurt my shoulder (rotator cuff) so it hurts to ride too far.

I'm getting better at just riding by feel -- if my legs are happy, I must be in a good place, y'know?

I understand your shoulder pain -- I did something to mine a few years ago, and for the first while, it bothered me. Eventually, the rest of me got stronger, and the shoulder doesn't bother me anymore!

Karen in Boise

[Thorn]

I've been going for 70-80 rpm in the big ring lately v. 80-90 in the middle.

Anyway, what aspects of form do you pay attention to, to keep stress off your achilles?

I'm no expert, but after I stressed out the achilles (I couldn't walk without stabbing pain), I started doing some research. One of the causes of achilles problems on the bike was listed as increasing mileage or tension (hills or big gears) too quickly. Another cause was listed as exaggerated ankling if it isn't your natural style.

Those two got me to paying attention to the pedal stroke--the bulk of the work that you do should be from the big muscles--the quads and hamstrings. I know that when I'm going up hill I tend to scoot back on the saddle. When I pedal that hard, I often exaggerate the ankling. I now know that that can be dangerous for me (it might work well for others)--it places too much stress on the achilles.

As I was recovering from the achilles problem, I did a lot of easy spins. When the road got an incline, I worked hard to keep the pedal stroke even, natural, and to not stress the achilles. Now that the achilles has recovered, when I push a hill I try to keep that same even, balanced stroke. Very hard to explain, though.

But, it does sound like you might have just done too much at once (but I'd prefer the 80-90 over the 70-80 range). Oh, and look at your arch support--if you have high arches and don't have enough support (in both your running *and* cycling shoes), you'll also stress that achilles.

[dolcerider]

An added note to this thread is that I really appreciate the information about stress to the achilles, especially since I ruptured my right achilles tendon about four years ago. Nine weeks in a full leg cast almost put me in a funny farm. :D I had noticed some tenderness in my ankle after some strenuous rides but wasn't putting the info about gears and stress together. All the more reason to learn what will work for me and learn the right way so as not to cause further injury. Thank You!

[KSH]

Thank you for the web site and to answer your question Sara, I have a triple but I'm not quite sure by what you mean by chain rub? If going to the large ring can increase speed on the flat then I can see the advantage, but you are pedaling harder- wear and tear on the joints, not to mention it must be exhausting to keep up for long periods of time. So for most of us non racers best used for short bursts only- like when the men are dropping you on a club ride? :(

Well, you go into the bigger ring when you have played out all the gears on the middle ring... AND your cadence is above 95.

Monitoring your cadence via computer will tell you WHEN you need to shift. If you are running a 90-100 cadence in the gear you are in... you are good.

If your cadence slows down... you shift down so it's easier. I your cadence gets too high, you shift up to make it harder.

Until I got a bike computer with cadence on it, I had no clue when to shift or why. Monitoring my cadence tells me exactly when I need to shift.

[KSH]

Thorn, I'm curious about this, because I've started to have problems with one of my achilles tendons. I thought it was brought on by running, since it only started to hurt about a week after I started running intervals again; however, reading your post makes me wonder if it could have been brought on by the bike as well. I've been using the big ring more on the bike in the past 3-4 months...I still wouldn't call myself a masher, but I've been going for 70-80 rpm in the big ring lately v. 80-90 in the middle. I generally drop to the middle ring on any kind of incline. Since I started running around the same time I started using the big ring (and maybe too high of a gear, in retrospect), now I'm wondering if that was just too much stress all at once. Especially since running has never aggravated my achilles before (though I was 20 lbs lighter the last time I tried running :o )

Anyway, what aspects of form do you pay attention to, to keep stress off your achilles?

Running too low of a cadence can cause pain in your knees... etc. 70-80 is low cadence in my book.

I had some horrible accute knee pain from riding my bike, until I got my cadence up to 90-100.

Even running didn't hurt my knees like cycling did. I was honestly shocked that something so low impact could cause me such horrible knee pain.

Spinning 90-100 cadence fixed the pain.

[amelia05]

thanks, ladies!

On cadence, the reason I'm at 70-80/80-90 is because that's where my body seems to settle naturally. I've tried pedaling 90-100, but it just doesn't feel right for me. Maybe I just need more practice, or increased conditioning...? Anyway, it sounds like it would probably be better for my knees/ankle to stay with my fastest cadence all the time, though, rather than aiming for different ranges in different situations.

[LoriO]

My shortcut: I sort of think of myself as having 3 gears; corresponding to the 3 chainrings up front. Uphill, flatish, downhill/fast. Then I use the cogs in the rear to fine-tune my "three" speeds.

It's not perfect, and not entirely accurate, but it gets the job done!

That is the same way I keep my gears straight in my head!