Help! husband dislikes riding buddy [Archive] - Women's Cycling Discussion Forums

jobob

06-22-2007, 08:06 PM

I guess I'm very lucky in that my husband of 18 years really encourages my riding and is very supportive of me. Up until fairly recently, he was a much stronger rider than I, but I've started training for longer distances and I've become the stronger one.

To be honest, I was was a bit worried about how he'd feel, and I felt a bit guilty, when I started doing a lot of rides on my own and with groups that he wouldn't be able to keep up with.

I still ride with my husband a lot, but not as much as I used to. I generally do one long, strenous ride one weekend day (usually Saturday) without him, and then do a more relaxed ride with him the other weekend day. So I haven't really "abandoned" him. He also likes to ride on his own, so sometimes he'll head out with me as I start my long ride, and then head off on his own along a different route.

So, I guess what you need to find out is, what is it that your husband wants of you?

It seems kind of unfair to me that he would want you to dump the riding buddy just because he's a guy.

Could the issue be that your husband feels you're not spending enough time with him? If that's the case, then the issue might still be there even if your riding buddy were female.

Would it be possible for you to keep riding with the buddy but to go out on fewer rides with him, and go out on more rides with your husband?

I wish you the best. This is a difficult situation, but to be honest, I think your husband is not being very fair to you. But that's just my two cents.

DarcyInOregon

06-22-2007, 08:13 PM

I think you are lucky to have a male riding buddy. It is special to be able to have riding buddies of any sex.

One of my friends is a younger male. I can't ride with him because he owns some sort of strange granny type of bike that folds up and has tiny tires, like something a granny would cycle around to get from the dining hall to her apartment at a retirement complex. His cycling speed is about 6 mph. My average speed is more than twice as much as his top speed.

So I think you are lucky. You have a friend who rides at your speed and your distances. That is real special to have. The problem isn't with you, but with your husband.

Like Lisa, I've been married a long time and we've both had close friends of the opposite sex. It is normal in a healthy relationship to have such friends.

I hope you get it sorted out. You don't ever want to lose a biking buddy.

Darcy

Mr. Bloom

06-22-2007, 08:34 PM

Any relationship is only as strong as each member's willingness to provide edifying support to the other.

If this is a point of consternation in the relationship, then it is not edifying and will only have a negative impact.

Is this allowing the "insecure" one to dictate who your friends are? or Is it your willingness to submit yourself a discretionary relationship for one that is a true long term commitment? I believe the latter. I also do not believe that the fault is necessarily his 'insecurity' as you each have a stake in the strength of the relationship and a responsibility to nurture each other in your challenges.

I do not begrudge Silver having male friends that I know and trust.

I would have serious problem with her continuing a male friendship that I had problems with...regardless of the reason.

Triskeliongirl

06-23-2007, 06:23 AM

My first reaction was that your husband is being ridiculous, but then I put myself in his shoes, which I can a little cuz in our family my husband is the stronger rider. Recently a new gal from cali moved here and started riding with our club. Being used to the cali mountains, she was able to hang with the two fastest men on a recent ride, my hubby included. They both joked after the ride how they 'could have dropped her' but hey, that would be unfriendly given she is new to the club and did such a great job keeping up, they didn't want her to ride alone, while the other fellow (who is also very happily married) also commented 'and she is hot.' Well, while I was a tad jealeous that I can't do what she can, it didn't really bother me since she was with both of them, and I was out there too. But, if my husband started making plans to ride exclusively with this women, it would bug me (and I have been married 20+ years). The way we handle the strength difference is that we ride with a club that has rides of varying distances starting from the same spot. That way we drive to the ride together, talk about it after together, but just ride with our respective peer groups. I just always do one distance shorter than him.

I think whether you think your husband's feelings are rationale or not, that he is your husband and you have to respect how he feels. Jealousy is not a rationale emotion. Is there a club you could ride with that has riders of variable ability. I am sure he would be less jealeous if you just hung with a GROUP of faster men, vs this one specific guy.

lph

06-23-2007, 06:41 AM

I have the dubious pleasure of being able to see this case from both sides...

My dh has a female climbing buddy that I'm jealous of. She is smart, an ex-colleague of his, funny, charming, 5 yrs younger than me, oh, and I forgot to mention - gorgeous. Guys flock to her like moths to a flame. No, I'm not worried that my dh will do anything wrong, but I'm not happy about the idea that on a sunny afternoon he's out having a terrific time at a climbing crag with this girl - instead of me.

I know my reaction is irrational, and I've stressed it many times to him that it's MY problem, not his, but I asked for one thing - that he invite her home for dinner so that I could get to know her too. And for me it helped just making myself visible to her, if that makes sense. And it helps actually seeing them together, and seeing that they relate to each other on a purely friendly level.

On the other hand, I have a biking buddy who I find very funny and enjoyable to be around, and I noticed my dh looking kind of unhappy when I mentioned going biking with him. I asked dh to come along, but he was afraid of getting dropped...

I then made a point out of getting biking buddy to come inside before the ride to "have something to drink", so dh could see that this is just an average-looking guy, 15 yrs his senior, slightly overweight, who happens to love biking - and not some hot, young athlete... ;)

Point is - jealousy is irrational, but it's also a very painful and humiliating emotion. If you care for your partner you try to lessen his jealousy if you can, without ratifying it.

margo49

06-23-2007, 07:00 AM

Tricky situation.

You could try telling him you would not think of leaving your *bike* for a man; since you love riding so much you aren't going to be doing anything else but riding.
Btw, how does your bike feel about this?

northstar

06-23-2007, 07:20 AM

Marriage can be so fragile, especially when dealing with egos. Can you advertise somewhere for a female riding partner?
I would be jealous too.

I'm in this camp.

My DH and I don't do things alone with someone of the opposite sex. Groups are fine, but neither of us is comfortable with one on one.

Call us old fashioned if you want. :)

Python

06-23-2007, 07:52 AM

I'm going to quote my husband here. He always says:

"If you don't have trust within a relationship, then you don't have a relationship".

Tuckervill

06-23-2007, 08:16 AM

First, I don't think jealousy is an irrational emotion. The reason we are jealous can be irrational, but sometimes jealousy is the only rational response.

I'd like to know the back story. How'd you meet the guy? Did you know him before your hubby?

I agree with whomever said you should invite him to spend time with you and your husband. I think a lot of men think men can't just 'be friends' with women, and are suspicious of any man who claims they can. Maybe they can connect one on one and your husband can learn to trust the guy.

Karen

salsabike

06-23-2007, 08:17 AM

One of the things that I like about my spouse is that he likes women as human beings. I would probably feel a little jealous/insecure at first if he had a woman riding partner but I would also consider that my thing to deal with, because I would know it didn't mean anything beyond a riding partnership. And he might feel the same--a slight initial twinge, then he would remember that he knows who I love; and that would be an end to the worry.

It bothers me a little that people think their feelings of jealousy, even when they are without a basis in fact, should control the relationships and friendships their SOs are allowed to have. I guess everyone has different ideas of what's okay or good in a marriage. It's important to me to be married to someone who is able to love me without needing to control everything I do, and who is able to know that I love him.

kelownagirl

06-23-2007, 09:01 AM

Everyone makes such good points. I think the quote I like best is this:.

"Point is - jealousy is irrational, but it's also a very painful and humiliating emotion. If you care for your partner you try to lessen his jealousy if you can, without ratifying it."

Mr. Bloom

06-23-2007, 09:53 AM

and I've stressed it many times to him that it's MY problem,

LPH, I don't believe it is YOUR problem. I really believe that if the two of you are in it together, then any problem that one of you have is a problem that BOTH of you have.

He has a responsibility to not disregard your concerns. Is it irrational to believe that every person is capable of messing up?

"U" is only half of "US"...it's not all of "US"

I'm going to quote my husband here. He always says:

"If you don't have trust within a relationship, then you don't have a relationship".
Personally, I think this is a narrow perspective...while I agree with what you've said, it doesn't go far enough. There's having trust and then there's being constantly tested in that trust. No matter how strong any metal is, stress will cause it to break over time. I trust that a plane is safe...but I know that a plane requires constant maintenance to remain safe. Likewise with any relationship.

Thorn

06-23-2007, 10:31 AM

Fascinating thread....it some respects the general thread doesn't match the usual "tone" of TE. I would have thought there would be more answers along the lines lph and Lisa and less that lean towards getting rid of the friend. Hmmm.....

Personally, I'm a geek. Always have been. Always will be (I suspect). Since I was a kid, I've had friends who were male. DH has friends who are female. Neither of us has problems with this. My life would not be as rich if I thought I couldn't have friends of the opposite gender. I wouldn't try to control DH's life by dictating friends and I wouldn't want DH to dictate mine. It comes down to trust.

Like jobob, I wonder if the problem really isn't that the riding buddy is male so much as it is that you're spending a lot of "fun time" without him. If the latter is the case, then as his fitness improves, perhaps the problem will lessen? One would hope this is the case--jealousy is not healthy in a relationship. Better to find out the underlying cause than just treating the symptom.

LBTC

06-23-2007, 10:34 AM

This is a very interesting thread. You've given us only the smallest amount of information and each of us is colouring our response with our own experiences and feelings. Hopefully there is something in here that helps you work through this.

DH and have been together a very long time, 20+ years. We just discussed this idea and his thought is: it depends on the guy and the dynamic I have with him.

And he's right. One thing I've really learned over the years, after lots of bad experiences with people, is to trust my intuition. I may have no logical reason to like or dislike someone at the time, but invariably, if I feel uncomfortable about them, they will hurt me or DH at some point. Likewise if I really feel comfortable with someone right away, they may turn out to be a very important friend or contact. And I have to extend that to how DH feels also.

On the other hand, I tried to put myself in the other shoes and I know right off the bat that if DH were riding with a woman who was stronger and faster than I, that I would be jealous. But I would really just be jealous that she was stronger and faster! If it bothered me enough, I imagine that DH would not ride with her very often, but I wouldn't expect him to stop outright, unless she fit into that intuition thing I talked about.

I do realize, though, that if you are a particularly fast and strong woman rider, that in many communities there will not be women who can keep up with you, so, if you are going to have a riding partner of a similar speed and training capacity, it will have to be a man. This can't be disregarded.

Sometimes having a training partner is the best or even the only way to reach your fitness goals. It would be a shame to have to give that up for any reason.

Hugs and butterflies,
~T~

KnottedYet

06-23-2007, 10:48 AM

Maybe a tandem so you and DH can ride together sometimes?
Then perhaps he wouldn't be jealous of your other riding time when you ride without him?

teigyr

06-23-2007, 10:59 AM

We just discussed this idea and his thought is: it depends on the guy and the dynamic I have with him.

We discussed this last night too. DH's opinion was that if the guy was a womanizer with disregard to marriage, then that'd be an issue. My point was I do know some indiscriminate type males but they respect MY relationship with DH. So it all comes back to the type of person I'd be friends with. I wouldn't be friends with anyone who would sabotage my relationship and same goes for DH and his friends regardless of gender.

It's funny because I've been in relationships where I have had jealousy twinges but I don't with DH. It's not that I don't care but it's that we are completely open with each other and there is no doubt about our commitment or our feelings.

All that being said, DH will be concerned if we're out and a strange guy tries to talk to me. It isn't that he gets jealous (at least I think not) but he'll stand near me and clearly show that he is DH :D

liberty

06-23-2007, 11:15 AM

I am part of a club and have thoroughly enjoyed the rides and being "pushed" by the faster riders. It has helped me improve. I joined because I'm a single gal who got tired of riding by myself. There are ladies in the club, however the majority of them only do very casual rides (maybe 2-3 women race). I can't do the racers' training rides because they smoke me almost instantly, but I can do the intermediate rides. We're a smaller club, so a huge ride for the intermediates is about 5-6 people.

Without going into unnecessary details, a wife of one of the riders mentioned to someone that she was uncomfortable with the idea of her husband (or any of the married men) ending up on a club ride with a solitary female rider. Meaning just the two going by themselves. As far as appearances, it could be misconstrued; she was concerned for the guys' reputations. So the club finally decided that out of respect for the marriages in the club, any ride at which only one man and one woman showed up would automatically be canceled. I totally understand and agree with the decision.

Yeah, as a single gal, it means there are times when a ride I am planning on attending is canceled. But doesn't being part of a team mean you also look out for the benefit of your team members? I trust the guys in the club. I respect them greatly. And seeing them put their relationships with their wives before their cycling or race training only makes me respect them more. I would like a man who would do that for me.

I talked to my mom about the situation. My parents have a very stable, secure and solid marriage. Both have acquaintances and friends of the opposite sex. And both trust each other implicitly. I've seen them give up things for the benefit and welfare of the other. I don't know the emotional or personal issues which prompted the wife in my story to be uncomfortable. But for me it boiled down to whether or not I was willing to give up something (like a good, hard ride) for the sake of another. For me it is just an opportunity to practice the things that have helped my parents in their marriage.

Crankin

06-23-2007, 11:24 AM

I tried to put myself in the opposite situation; if my husband was out riding with another woman, for training, it would upset me. I am not particularly jealous and I know if my husband was out riding with a woman, it would be strictly for the riding! Sorry to say, that I do agree with Mimi. Maybe it's a generational thing. We both have many acquaintances of the opposite gender, mostly from work or other club type situations. But we don't go out and socialize with them separately. I mean, I'm probably not the best person to get an opinion from because I pretty much spend all of my time with my husband and most of it is spent riding! I do participate in group rides that he can't attend. One of the groups is mostly older people, my age and up. The guys there are amazing and very friendly, but they know I'm married.
On the other hand, I live in a place where it is very easy to find someone to ride with and we just had the conversation that it looks like the number of women riders out there has gone up 4X in the last couple of years.

Trek420

06-23-2007, 12:40 PM

Maybe a tandem so you and DH can ride together sometimes?
Then perhaps he wouldn't be jealous of your other riding time when you ride without him?

I like this idea if a tandem works for you.

It can allow riders of different abilities to ride together, or for both of you to ride further or faster than you could alone.

Another choice is do rides with him but you take a heavier bike, he's on road bike, you take the mountain bike.

Or do a once a week hammerfest and do rest days with him.

I rode with my cousin, also bikerz, mellisam. My cousin is simply head and shoulders better than any of us. But he was happy to ride with us, he would sometimes turn off route and simply climb a hill just for fun and then come back down and meet up. And this was his rest day :o

Would DH be ok if you did hill repeats while he simply climbs a hill? Some people just aren't ok with that.

I agree with others that a good "biker buddy" is ideal. When you find someone who rides your speed and distance it is great.

Jiffer

06-23-2007, 01:46 PM

If you want to keep your marriage, and keep it a happy one, lose the male riding partner. I'll probably get flamed, but this is an important issue to me. My husband and I make a point not to spend one on one time with people of the opposite sex, especially on an on going basis. We hang out with people of both sexes in a group setting.

This is not necessarily a trust issue or even an "ego" issue. Just a smart way to keep a healthy marriage.

By doing this, we eliminate any issues of possible jealousy, gossip from other people who might not know how platonic the relationship truly is and, of course, any possibility of infidelity. Most every extra-marital affair starts out as "just friends". Few spouses actually "plan" on sleeping with their "buddy" of the opposite sex, but the more time you spend with someone, the more opportunity you have of a spark getting ignited.

And above all else, the fact that your husband is not happy with this situation should be reason enough to avoid it. He should be number one in your life. His feelings and concerns should be more important than spending time with another man. He SHOULD be jealous of you spending time with another man.

The best advice I can give you as for a riding buddy is ... get a tandem! You and your husband can ride together and both ride at your own ability level. The first time I rode a tandem with my husband, I felt so much closer to him. It is something he and I can enjoy "together". Instead of going off and doing our own thing, we're together, working as a team enjoying each other's company. Having a conversation as we ride (unless we're breathlessly plugging away up some hill!) We still ride separately on our singles, but the tandem gives us a chance to come together again at our own ability.

So there's my two cents worth. ;)

Python

06-23-2007, 04:45 PM

Personally, I think this is a narrow perspective...while I agree with what you've said, it doesn't go far enough. There's having trust and then there's being constantly tested in that trust. No matter how strong any metal is, stress will cause it to break over time. I trust that a plane is safe...but I know that a plane requires constant maintenance to remain safe. Likewise with any relationship.

My husband and I met through our jobs. We were both taxi drivers and both of us were divorced. As any taxi driver anywhere in the world will tell you, you get propositioned at least 3 times a week. From my own point of view, there are times I could have had my pick of men - some very good looking ones too, and the same goes for my husband with female passengers. The bottom line is we instinctively trust each other and we love each other. Neither of us would bother with anyone else - we're happy with each other:) Maybe it's because we're older (and met when we were older) and don't have the same lack of confidence and insecurities that often younger people have, I don't know.

We're husband and wife, but we're also best friends too.

DarcyInOregon

06-23-2007, 04:51 PM

If you want to keep your marriage, and keep it a happy one, lose the male riding partner. I'll probably get flamed, but this is an important issue to me.

Jiffers, I don't think anyone in this forum flames another, at least not that I have noticed. For flaming you have to go to the male dominated cycling discussion groups.:D

Darcy

Irulan

06-24-2007, 12:56 PM

If you want to keep your marriage, and keep it a happy one, lose the male riding partner. I'll probably get flamed, but this is an important issue to me. My husband and I make a point not to spend one on one time with people of the opposite sex, especially on an on going basis. We hang out with people of both sexes in a group setting.

This is not necessarily a trust issue or even an "ego" issue. Just a smart way to keep a healthy marriage.

By doing this, we eliminate any issues of possible jealousy, gossip from other people who might not know how platonic the relationship truly is and, of course, any possibility of infidelity. Most every extra-marital affair starts out as "just friends". Few spouses actually "plan" on sleeping with their "buddy" of the opposite sex, but the more time you spend with someone, the more opportunity you have of a spark getting ignited.

And above all else, the fact that your husband is not happy with this situation should be reason enough to avoid it. He should be number one in your life. His feelings and concerns should be more important than spending time with another man. He SHOULD be jealous of you spending time with another man.
<snipped>

So there's my two cents worth. ;)

very well said. I think it's important in a marriage ( or committed relationship) to choose NOT do things that you know will hurt your partner, however well grounded you think your relationship is.

kelownagirl

06-24-2007, 02:53 PM

I love what Jiffer said - well put! Dh and I have discussed and we both really agree with you.

I like this idea if a tandem works for you.

It can allow riders of different abilities to ride together, or for both of you to ride further or faster than you could alone.

Another choice is do rides with him but you take a heavier bike, he's on road bike, you take the mountain bike.

Or do a once a week hammerfest and do rest days with him.

I rode with my cousin, also bikerz, mellisam. My cousin is simply head and shoulders better than any of us. But he was happy to ride with us, he would sometimes turn off route and simply climb a hill just for fun and then come back down and meet up. And this was his rest day :o

Would DH be ok if you did hill repeats while he simply climbs a hill? Some people just aren't ok with that.

I agree with others that a good "biker buddy" is ideal. When you find someone who rides your speed and distance it is great.

DH and I have finally solved our "unequal" riding abilities issue to both of our satisfaction because we really like riding together. On days when he feels like hammering and I don't (or can't), he does 4 minute intervals (rides ahead hard for 4 minutes, then turns around and rides back to meet me), and he repeats the intervals as long as he wants. We get to touch base every 5 minutes or so, I can ride at my own speed, and I don't feel alone out there (I am still freaked out about riding alone since I became allergic to wasps). I am amazed how fast 5 minutes goes too. We don't do it the whole ride, usually it's just the middle 1/3 but it works great. One other thing we sometimes do - he rides my pace for a 30-40k ride and then he does 4-5 hill repeats when we get home to finish off his workout. Of course, after a year of riding together, the days he doesn't get a good workout are fewer and far between. I'm sure the same thing would happen with your hubby.

So how about some feedback Melalvai? Can you give us any more background? Is this unusual for your dh or is he a little on the controlling side? That would make a difference to me too.

Melalvai

06-24-2007, 03:51 PM

Wow, I'm amazed at the discussion I sparked. Sorry I was out of town this weekend (being a cager unfortunately, not a cyclist, but we visited an old friend who had paid for a hotel room as our christmas present and we had an absolutely wonderful time).

Here is the long awaited background, and some responses.

I'm 33, we've been married 13 years come August, and 3 months ago I took this Road I course taught by, we'll call him Riding Buddy. I knew him sort of because he runs a yahoogroups list for commuters in our area. Almost immediately after the course I became a total biking nut! I loved the freedom I felt, how I own the road, the cars can't scare me, I know what I'm doing is right and I feel very safe, etc. (I recommend that course enthusiastically!!)

My husband didn't like that at all. I started going on long rides on the roads, not just the trails, and I posted on the list asking if anyone had any routes to recommend because I kept getting lost? Riding Buddy suggested I ride with him & his wife, and since then I've done several rides with him, his wife, and the two together. I ride with them about once a week. His wife is not up to distances over 40 miles, so the long rides are just him & me, or we all start out together and she might turn back early.

I would love for my husband to get to know Riding Buddy, but he doesn't want to. I wonder now if he was jealous before I started riding with him. Perhaps he blames him for my bike fanaticism.

My husband has made an effort to become more of a cyclist, probably out of jealousy. I ride a lot with him. I will go in to work an hour late if it means I can get a 1/2 hr ride with him. I would love him to increase his fitness, partly for his own health, and partly for my selfish enjoyment of going on more and longer rides with him. I would, and have, turned down a ride with Riding Buddy to go on a ride with my husband. I know I've gone completely nuts about biking and I am vigilant about spending time with my family (husband & daughter) both on and off the bike.

Riding Buddy is 5 yrs younger than me and very physically fit and attractive. I'm sure that doesn't help anything. He is not a womanizer and has traditional values (we have some fun political arguments) and I feel strongly that there is a line which if I crossed he would ride away as fast as he could and never speak to me again. I even mentioned (not in detail) that my husband was jealous just in case his reaction would be "jealous husband? See ya never, bye." but I was relieved when his reaction was more along the lines of "You gotta make your own decisions, I don't want to cause any problems". So if I decided to drop him he would be sad but understanding.

Tandem: that is one of my dreams. It would allow me to pick up/drop off my daughter at school, practices, etc without making her do the trip herself, and without me having to drive the car. It would allow us to go on long rides together. They are not cheap. I wouldn't object to selling the car to buy a tandem, but you can imagine that idea is not popular, besides, I do want to visit my family ocassionally, and to bike 200 miles, although I'm sure I could pull it off, would just take more days than there are in a weekend.

Club rides? clubs? Not so much in this midwest college town. :(

I waffle between "I should drop Riding Buddy because it bothers him" and "Why should I let his insecurities interfere with this friend?" My husband & I have talked about it...and talked...and talked... It seems like we talk it out and he's ok, then Riding Buddy & I go on a long ride and husband is upset. I have cancelled some rides because my husband said (when asked) that it will bother him. I also must admit that sometimes I have simply not said that I was not alone, and this is a step I really really hate, I am not a dishonest person and it bothers me tremendously to omit information on purpose to be misleading.

I can see from all the discussion that there it is, as I have already found it to be, not simple. I am confident that we will work through this, and I do not think the answer is as simple as "lost the Riding Buddy". I respect both my feelings and my husband's. His jealousy is a fact and I will not paint it wrong or unreasonable, on the other hand I know I will be resentful & angry if I give up a good riding partner to his insecurity. We have been through worse experiences, not jealousy but we have had other situations of resentments & expectations that were touch-and-go and I don't feel that our relationship is crumbling over this. Just getting a bit knocked around.

One way or another there will be some good stories out of all this to tell my grandkids and great grandkids just before I pedal away, leaving them in my dust.

Melalvai

06-24-2007, 03:53 PM

Is this unusual for your dh or is he a little on the controlling side?
I'd have to say unusual for him, although not completely uncharacteristic.

Melalvai

06-24-2007, 03:59 PM

My husband and I make a point not to spend one on one time with people of the opposite sex, especially on an on going basis. We hang out with people of both sexes in a group setting.
I should note that in the past, he has had a female friend here & there whom he hung out with quite a bit (RL, online, both). I don't have a problem with that, but then, he wasn't a born again bicyclist (or any other fanaticism) who she had "converted". So, in his shoes...I do not know how I would feel or react.

Melalvai

06-24-2007, 04:03 PM

This is a very interesting thread. You've given us only the smallest amount of information and each of us is colouring our response with our own experiences and feelings.
Yes, this has been awesome, and I am amazed at the lack of flaming. :)

Sometimes having a training partner is the best or even the only way to reach your fitness goals. It would be a shame to have to give that up for any reason.
I should mention that I do not have specific goals, like to complete a certain distance or reach an ave speed or finish something in a certain time. When I ride with Riding Buddy, my goal is to have a challenging ride, whatever that ends up being. When I ride with my husband, my goal is for him to have an enjoyable ride. When I ride by myself, my goal is enjoyment.

Melalvai

06-24-2007, 04:07 PM

Btw, how does your bike feel about this?
That's the best question yet!! My bike wants to go fast. It thinks I ought to ride much more often, with everyone or by myself! It wants me to spend money on really good lights so I can ride even the dark trail at night, and get clipless pedals. It wants me to spend money on supported rides (centuries and the like) and go touring. It wants more friends in the garage (tandem, spare bike for when its in the shop) and it wants that big old gas eating thing out of there!

It is such a demanding bike. :)

mimitabby

06-24-2007, 05:05 PM

Mela
you seem to have a good understanding of the problem. And your husband can see intellectually that jealousy isn't helping, but feelings don't just disappear as we all know. they are there. So since he is intellectualizing, that will help.
THe other thing is the time thing.
I think that was the biggest gripe i had when DH was riding a lot and i was home with the kids. He could have been cycling with ugly dudes, it didn't matter. He was out on the bike and i was home stuck with chores (but i didn't want to ride at that point either)
look for used Tandems. Deals happen. I've seen them. Don't sell your car, you're going to want it in the winter :)

Kano

06-24-2007, 05:23 PM

Almost immediately after the course I became a total biking nut! I loved the freedom I felt, how I own the road, the cars can't scare me, I know what I'm doing is right and I feel very safe, etc. (I recommend that course enthusiastically!!)

My husband didn't like that at all. I started going on long rides on the roads, not just the trails, and I posted on the list asking if anyone had any routes to recommend because I kept getting lost? Riding Buddy suggested I ride with him & his wife, and since then I've done several rides with him, his wife, and the two together. I ride with them about once a week. His wife is not up to distances over 40 miles, so the long rides are just him & me, or we all start out together and she might turn back early.

Mel,

are you SURE it's Riding Buddy that your husband is upset about?

Is your husband sure it's Riding Buddy that he's upset about?

Here's something entirely different to think about:

You've started riding on ROADS instead of trails. Roads are filled with CARS, and CARS are big, go real fast, and let's face it, if there's any sort of confrontation between a car and a bicycle, the car will win.

Is it possible that "I don't like you riding with Riding Buddy" is a way to avoid admitting "I'm scared crapless that something could happen to you while you're out there on the roads" ???

MINE says commuting to work is too far for me -- it's about half the distance of HIS commute and we ride that distance just to get a cup of coffee, and we've ridden down to where I work to meet friends for rides, so he KNOWS I can do it. I'm also not supposed to ride north of the freeway -- it's too dangerous for ME (though he does it every day) Oh, and then there's those delightful 30+ mph downhill runs: don't DO that! Then there was that other dandy: don't even THINK about moving your hands when you're going that fast! I think "that fast" was about 15mph that day.

You'd think MY DH could quit riding through the construction zone where "car back" is not just "car back" but "pissy guy in car back" cuz there's no WAY he can go around without taking out a whole bunch of orange barrels! (He took me through there yesterday, and the moment these guys could get around, they'd gun their engines and burn rubber to get around us!)

Karen in Boise

Batbike

06-24-2007, 06:02 PM

In fact, my top 3 riding buddies are male! At first, I never thought anything of it, riding with men, because female riders are few and far between and the men took me in and helped me learn to cycle ... all good. Then, after time, my DH started wondering (just a little) about these "mystery men" I kept talking to, talking about, and riding with. So, I made it a point to bring him to group social events (off the bike) and introduce him. Then, I bought him a bike so he could learn to enjoy the sport and my cycling friends. It helped.

As for my FAVORITE riding buddy -- he was dating a woman at the time who became jeolous of our relationship and it strained their relationship. We both decided to make "extra" efforts toward each others' SO. My DH began to get more comfortable with my buddy because he too had a friendly relationship with him ... all good. As for my riding buddy, he broke-up with his girlfriend and is now dating a women who is not insecure and has no issues with us riding together - all good.

Today, my DH and favorite riding buddy, along with a few other friends (including 2 women and another favorite riding buddy) all rode together. It was fun, we enjoyed each other's company, and had a great ride! OK, it has taken a few years and a little work to get to this point, but marriage still in tack and riding buddies still firmly in place! All good!!!

Zen

06-24-2007, 06:39 PM

Mr. Bloom

06-24-2007, 07:50 PM

I waffle between "I should drop Riding Buddy because it bothers him" and "Why should I let his insecurities interfere with this friend?" ...

and I do not think the answer is as simple as "lost the Riding Buddy".

I do bristle at the idea that he is automatically insecure because of his concern. I know of plenty of situations like you describe here that turned into something else, it "just happened". I would characterize him as CAUTIOUS, not insecure...but I assure you that by continuing to rub salt in this wound, his caution is becoming insecurity...and that insecurity will escalate to something else soon if this continues.

I do think it's as easy as saying "lose the riding buddy", but I also have a serious problem with the double standard in his behavior regardless of whether you had a problem with it or not.

Tuckervill

06-25-2007, 06:05 AM

IFjane

06-25-2007, 06:55 AM

You're 33, you've been married 13 years. You married when you were 20, still a girl.
You're discovering you're abilities and establishing some independence.
Riding Buddy is only part of the issue here.

The wise and wonderful zen has done it again. I completely agree (voice of experience).

The problem is, if you ditch the riding buddy you are compromising your goals/abilities/fun on the bike. In time resentment will grow (though you might not realize it at first - it will be internal). However, if you DON'T ditch the riding buddy, you also may be compromising your relationship with your DH.

Bat, I like the way your worked your cycling issues out. Maybe you could follow her plan, Mel?

lph

06-25-2007, 08:07 AM

I also think it's a personal choice what kind of relationship you want to have (the two of you). At some point you need to discuss things like:

Do both of you *want* to have friends of the opposite sex? Is this a better idea in theory than in practice? Would you prefer your partner didn't have them? Are you willing to suffer feelings of insecurity and jealousy to let him/her keep those friends? What can you do for each other to make it easier? What's your "comfort limit", and what would change it?

I'm sure you've been through a lot of these, but if you can keep it general, not specific, and agree on the main points, you'll have some answers, at least.

short cut sally

06-25-2007, 09:00 AM

I wanted to comment on this thread earlier but just didn't have the time to do so, I wanted to let you know about my riding and parteners. I started riding by myself, a few co-workers (female) started riding also, then we slowly got to know each other, and started riding together. We would plan day trips and I always tell DH the stories. We all got better bikes and a male co-worker started riding on occassion with us. DH was made aware. DH I don't think was happy, mind you 3 females, 1 male. The more the male rode, the more DH would comment, do you really need to ride, and you need to make your priorites, there are things around the house that need to be done, etc. Still continued to ride, it was something I could and loved to do and got me out of the house. (It should also be put in at about this time I was also learning how to become independant from him. He was always, what he said, ruled the house type of thing, and I never went anywheres on my days off, stayed home, etc. and I started doing things I wanted to do which I don't think was high on his list to begin with). So, he realized that the male co worker wasn't going away, then DH decided he wanted a bike. "it would be fun" The only time he rode was when the male rode with us. THen if the male rode anywheres near me, DH was right there, other than that, DH rode with the other females or with the male when we rode together. The male hasn't rode with us in almost a year, and DH has only rode 12 miles since with me. I've even told Dh that there are other males, whom he's met at work, want to ride with us, so he's aware that there are other men at work that ride, but then the comments start again that I spend too much time on my bike, and my priorities are different than his..yada yada.... But yet, he tells all my female friends that he wants to ride but just doesn't have the time when they ask when is he going to ride with us again. SO, in my case, I think it might be more than you are riding with a male riding partner, which doens't help. In my case, I think it was a whole combo platter going together. DH still makes comments to me that I spend way too much time on my bike, and should get my priorites set, even when I ride by myself. To which I reply that bike riding is my priority. His priority is work. We just have difference of oppionions, but in the end we still get along well, and look forward to each others company. I've asked him several times to ride with me or the group and get the same reply that he's too busy. ( we've been married 21 years). So, I sortof know where you are coming from. To make my relationship less taxed, I try to avoid confrontation and usually forgo the male encounters or just delete from telling DH that we as a group rode with a male, which I feel is not good. Good luck with your situation. HOpe things work out for you.

Dr. Liz

06-25-2007, 09:12 AM

Mel,

are you SURE it's Riding Buddy that your husband is upset about?

Is your husband sure it's Riding Buddy that he's upset about?

Here's something entirely different to think about:

You've started riding on ROADS instead of trails. Roads are filled with CARS, and CARS are big, go real fast, and let's face it, if there's any sort of confrontation between a car and a bicycle, the car will win.

Is it possible that "I don't like you riding with Riding Buddy" is a way to avoid admitting "I'm scared crapless that something could happen to you while you're out there on the roads" ???

Karen in Boise

I think this is a VERY valid point, and something that you need to talk with your husband about; we've got a couple of guys that we (together) ride with, and there are no issues, but he won't let me ride with them alone. Not a jealousy issue, but his fear that these guys aren't going to be as protective of me as he will be.

Of course, if there are other, deeper issues, then you've GOT to talk with him about that, too. Guys often clam up about 'sensitive' topics, but he's got to understand that if you two are to continue to grow as adults, you've got to talk about tough issues, and get to the root of them.

Not easy. I know. (Heck, it took my husband 3 tries/wives before he learned that talking about stuff rather than dwelling on it was a GOOD thing. Hopefully your husband won't learn it the hard way! :( )

spokewench

06-25-2007, 09:20 AM

There is kind of a double standard in our family - and probably because my husband absolutely will not look inward at the real reasons he reacts to situations. It has to do with the way he was brought up. Long story, not worth going into here.

In the past, I've had some bike riding friends who were male (only one or two of them, that my hubby knew really well) were okay for me to ride with on regular basis. If he did not know the fellow, it was just not okay even though hubby trusts my judgment with regard to people. He would usually not say, "you can't ride with that guy", but would get weird about me riding too much or something like that.

He also reacted this way to a male tennis person that I was playing with (much older than me and not appealing at all?), but he did not know him well either.

But, last year, I have a girlfriend (who actually is known in town for fooling around with married men) who we were all training with to get ready for the Tour of Colorado. Mark would ride with her on days when I was working and it didn't bother me a bit. I trust him!

For some reason, he just is not as confident in himself and I guess, I am in myself. So, I have come to the conclusion that this is not going to change, i.e. his confidence will not increase, (we have been married for a long time!) so I try to avoid these kinds of situations so he does not get weirded out.

So, yes, I do compromise in my marriage, but I do wish that all things are equal as far as emotions go. The reality of it is, that all things are not equal as far as emotions go so we deal with the issues as they come.

spoke

Batbike

06-25-2007, 10:10 AM

as I read more and more of this thread I am COMPLETELY amazed at the male-female issues everyone is sharing ... who would have thought that riding a bike with other cyclists, no matter what the gender, could be such an issue!! :eek:

It is bike riding ... an aerobic exercise that takes some or most, if not all of an individual's energy to preform -- who's got time for anything else?!! :rolleyes:

OK, maybe the issue is NOT WHEN riding, but forming a relationship WHILE riding -- I get that. If fact, I have one riding buddy who has made it clear he would like more than "just riding buddies" and I know his wife and kids!! Needless to say, I nipped that in the bud quickly and told other riders in our core group about his intentions -- they too took him aside to discuss his issues. YES, they are his issues and not mine. Have I told my DH -- NO, because I don't need DH to "create" issues with male riders that aren't there. Most riders ARE MALE and most riders JUST WANT TO RIDE. ;)

Male or female, we all have one thing in common -- the bicycle. Personally, I don't see how gender needs to effect the love of the sport. If you ride well with someone, enjoy their company while riding, and the whole experience promotes the love of the bike, why not ride with them? Of course, if there is "outside bike chemistry or misguided thinking" than that needs to be dealt with immediately -- go with it, ignore it, or deal with it. As women working hard to improve our bodies and mind through cycling, it is important to stand-up to those who interfere with the passion of cycling; it is important to be empowered, standing strong for ourselves and what we need and want from cycling. I hope no woman allows a SO to dictate how, when, where, and with whom they ride. If cycling is your passion, then embrace it and feel empowered to keep riding -- with whatever gender keeps you riding, as long as you feel good about it and it meets your needs ... feel the power!!! :)

ladyicon

06-25-2007, 11:13 AM

I think that you have to decide which is more important to you (now, now, be sensible). It is not his fault that he is jealous, you would also be jealous if he rode off with a woman and left you behind. I suggest you find a female riding partner. It may be hard to find a riding buddy, but is is even harder to find a good man!!!
You never know if you tell you husband "you are right dear, I won't ride with so and so cause I love you and respect you", you never know, he may feel so bad about pulling you away from riding that that he will insist on you riding with him.
Good luck, and remember, good men are hard to find!

Zen

06-25-2007, 11:16 AM

This is short, to the point, and worth reading

Why Do I Get Jealous?

How to control the green-eyed monster
By Dr. Scott Haltzman, http://www.hitchedmag.com

Question: Why do I get so jealous when my partner talks to other people?
Answer: When you first connected with your partner and looked into their eyes, it felt like he or she was the only person in the room. As you get deeper into your relationship and call yourselves a couple, the realization hits you: You and your partner are not alone on this planet. There are others! Are they a threat?
When we are in a committed relationship, we assume the connection we have with each other will be strong enough to fend off outside threats. In some ways, this you-belong-to-me-and-I-belong-to-you mentality is sweet; it's the stuff of pop songs and poetry. But sometimes the intensity of that connection is too strong.
When one partner sees everyone whom his or her partner comes into contact with as a potential threat, it is
“a sign that jealousy has taken hold”
a sign that jealousy has taken hold. Shakespeare called it "the green-eyed monster," and once it gets a hold of your relationship, it sinks its teeth in and can rip it apart.
What causes jealousy?
If you've got strong feelings of jealousy, it's probably a sign that you don't have enough trust in your partner that he or she is being faithful to you. That lack of trust may be prompted by one of four factors.

* You may feel insecure about your self-worth. In these cases, either you've been raised to believe, or some part of your inner self feels, that you just don't measure up. Because you don't love yourself, you can't believe that others would love you, so you live in fear that your partner's "true" feelings will be revealed and she will leave.
* You're prone to cheating on your partner -- maybe even have done so. Knowing what you're capable of, you project that behavior onto your partner.
* You and your partner haven't yet figured out how to
“establish safe boundaries within the relationship”
establish safe boundaries within the relationship. Having a tight bond is about building walls around your love with windows that allow others to be part of it -- not doors where competing lovers can walk right in and disrupt your home. Because you don't know what's permissible within the relationship and what's not, you're constantly on your toes.
* Your mate is cheating on you. Cheating doesn't have to include sex; it often has to do with making emotional connections to others outside the relationship. If your partner is sharing things about your private life with attractive members of the opposite sex, it robs a sense of intimacy from your relationship and leaves you feeling vulnerable.

Knowing the factors that lead to jealousy is an important first step to getting things fixed.
“Put your focus on building trust”
Put your focus on building trust. If you've got some growing up to do, therapy may help. Both of you have to learn how to set boundaries in the relationship. That requires respecting your mate's definition of limits of outside relationships from the start.
Over time, as trust builds, you and your partner can redefine what feels safe for the relationship. After all, when you've got a great relationship, you want to share it with the world.
Want to read more articles from Hitched? Check out hitchedmag.com

Zen

06-25-2007, 11:18 AM

Good luck, and remember, good men are hard to find!

Yes, and so are good women. A relationship is a two way street.

DarcyInOregon

06-25-2007, 11:32 AM

as I read more and more of this thread I am COMPLETELY amazed at the male-female issues everyone is sharing ... who would have thought that riding a bike with other cyclists, no matter what the gender, could be such an issue!! :eek:

It is bike riding ... an aerobic exercise that takes some or most, if not all of an individual's energy to preform -- who's got time for anything else?!! :rolleyes:

Batbike, your entire post was well-written.

Everyone has a different opinion based on their perspective. I guess I am amazed at the number of marriages that might teeter if a spouse is put in close proximity to a member of the opposite sex, therefore the opinion is that one's spouse should never be put in such a situation.

It is like a step back in time, taking away all of the advances women have made over the past 100 years. Seriously, is a female detective not supposed to work with a male dectective? Is a female executive not supposed to hire a male assistant because they will be alone together, day-after-day? Is a female Navy officer not supposed to go in a submarine because she is the only female? Is a female astronaut not supposed to go up in the space shuttle because she will be isolated with only male companions?

I've only thought of a few examples of every day life where men and women work together, closely and intimately, because it is their profession and their job. For this situation, it is like Batbike said, "It is bike riding." It would be ridiculous for a spouse to declare that the married partner should give up a profession because of working with the opposite sex, and the same is true of cycling.

What is next? The female racers should give up their training coaches because they are male?

Darcy

GLC1968

06-25-2007, 11:50 AM

Wow, wow, wow. I haven't been around in a few days, and I've missed this thread! The first thing I noticed is how civil everyone is being. It's so nice to have a place like TE where people can discuss as adults differing opinions/experiences and ideas!

This thread has been eye-opening for me. It's made me appreciate my husband and our biking relationship all that much more!

I've had relationships with jealous men in my past. My husband has had the same. We didn't meet until we were in our mid-30's, so we'd both 'been around the block' so to speak. We knew that when we met, we'd found something special almost immediately and we really, truly understand and trust each other. Jealously of the opposite sex really doesn't play a role in our relationship because not only are neither of us jealous people, but we both trust each other completely. That said, I know that I'd be jealous if my husband found another woman to ride with not because I'd be afraid that he'd cheat or that a friendship would develop into something else (which I find laughable), but because I want to be the person he rides with. This is because biking is as important to me as it is to him and it's something we've shared for 2 years now.

BUT, if I wasn't interested in biking and he wanted to ride with another woman...I'd be fine with it. I know that I'd be fine with it because he's done this exact thing but with tennis. He met a woman through an online service (about sports) and he wants to meet up with her to play. I don't have time for tennis anymore so I'm totally ok with it. And I know he feels the same when the situation is reversed. I ride at lunch at work all the time and 9 times out of 10, I'm riding with a guy from work. In the past, it was almost always with the same guy because we had a similar pace. Not only was DH fine with it, he's now asking why I never mention this guy anymore. When I told him it's because he's not riding anymore, he says that's too bad. No jealously whatsoever.

I will say that I have a feeling that your husband's 'dislike' of your riding situation is probably multi-faceted. It's not likely just about the guy you are riding with. It sounds like it's probably partly that, partly that you are out doing something that he's not involved with at all, partly that you have found a new passion that he's not party to, partly that you are going to be getting in better shape and going places by bike that he can't go. Had you developed a close riding relationship with your buddy's wife instead of your buddy, I'd guess that your husband would still feel some resentment or jealousy. It may be different, or it may be less, but I'd bet it would still be there.

Unfortuantely, outside of what you are doing (talking), I don't really have any helpful advice. It's always hard when one member of a relationship finds a passion that the other member doesn't share. It requires adjustment and change for both parties and it can be difficult. Keep those lines of communication open and good luck!!

indysteel

06-25-2007, 11:52 AM

I say all of the following with the caveat that I've never been married, so I can only speculate as to how I might deal with a similar situation if I were married. However, I have been involved with men with close female friends, and have generally taken the approach that until I have some concrete reason not to trust the situation then whatever issues I have with it are a product of my own insecurities and, therefore, more or less "my" problem to fix. Asking someone to pacify those insecurites by getting rid of the friend would likely prove to be only a temporary fix as the insecurities would just manifest themselves in some other way. And if there really is some larger trust issue, getting rid of the friend would again just mask the problem. In fact, I'm of the opinion that demanding someone disavow a relationship with a member of the opposite sex for no other reason than it just makes them feel threatened, is just the type of behavior that can ultimately lead to infidelity--maybe not in the shortrun, but over time.

Building and maintaining trust, it seems to me, isn't about eliminating all forms of temptation. For one, that's just unrealistic. For another, in my opinoin, infidelity is more often than not a byproduct of what happens within a marriage, not because of what happens outside of it. In that sense, the energy spent worrying about exes, coworkers, friends at the gym and riding buddies could be better spent nurturing and growing the relationship in more positive ways or, in some cases, working on yourself.

I'm not suggesting that Mel not listen to her husband's concerns or pay them any heed, but I would encourage both of them to identify what they're really about. Are they about his insecurities as a cyclist? Fear that she is looking elsewhere to have some of her needs met? Fear about her getting hurt on the road? Insecurities about his own attractiveness or manliness? Fear that they're growing apart? Assuming they're able to identify the real issue--which will admittedly require some honesty and introspection--then finding a solution that actually addresses it may obviate the need to "lose the riding buddy." Maybe he just needs reassurance that she finds him attractive and sexy. Maybe they need to come to a better understanding about what a healthy, balanced marriage means to both of them and whether it can or should include outside interests and people. Maybe he needs to admit that some of his insecurities about their respective athleticism are his to work through with her encouragement. Maybe he just needs to get to know the riding buddy himself.

And if she does decide to "lose the riding buddy," there's nothing wrong with making that decision for the health of the marriage, as long as it's a decision made voluntarily and not because of threats, compulsion or ultimatums.

Jo-n-NY

06-25-2007, 12:03 PM

My situation is the opposite. My husband rides with a female friend of ours. Actually she was a customer of his and he knew her before I did. They both have Thursdays as their day off and I have weekends. As I still do I take my vacation days on Thursdays to ride with them but needless to say, vacation days only go so far. Anyway, the only thing I was jealous about was that I am in work and they are riding. :mad:

He would call me a couple of times through their ride to let me know he was thinking of me and tell me where they rode to. However, she has become my cycling buddy and very good friend, actually she is my best friend now and the person I ride my organized rides with. But when I ride on the weekends, I feel guilty because my husband isn't with us, but I am sure as time goes by this will all pan out so we can all ride together all the time.

~ JoAnn

margo49

06-25-2007, 12:32 PM

It is bike riding ... an aerobic exercise that takes some or most, if not all of an individual's energy to preform -- who's got time for anything else?!! :rolleyes:

This is what I was getting at in my previous post.
Like the Zen monk said "I ride my bike to ride my bike"

xeney

06-25-2007, 03:29 PM

This is sort of an interesting and timely thread for me. My husband and I have been together since 1994, so whatever jealousy issues we had back then (and I for one had plenty) have long since been worked out. His best not-me friend is a woman, and in some ways they probably spend more time together than we do, because they work together and go to lunch together every day. But she's my friend too and I have no issues with that relationship -- in fact, I fully support it and the extent of my jealousy is that they go to a lot of restaurants that I am too busy to visit, and they never bring me take-out.

Right now, though, I am unable to ride, and we are not spending any fun time together, mostly because I am not having any fun ... I'm just working, getting the house ready for a baby, and sitting around with my damn feet up wondering whose dumb idea it was to have a baby in August. I can barely walk two blocks, much less get on a bike or go hiking or do any of the stuff that we usually do for fun.

Meanwhile, he's joined a cycling club and going for long rides every weekend. The fact that there are women in the group doesn't bother me (I have joked about the fact that he is spending his weekends with hot young chicks in spandex while I am here turning into Shamu, but it is really not an issue, and in fact one of those young chicks is probably going to be our part-time nanny); I am mostly jealous of the guys. Because he rides with them all the time, and I am not riding at all, and I am petty and bitter and I want to go have fun and let him sit around with his feet up for a change.

For me, irrational sexual jealousy -- i.e., the idea that he might run off and screw some young thing if I let him out of my sight or "allow" him to interact with other women -- is my own problem, one I am glad to rarely experience these days, and one that I would not tolerate in my partner if the tables were turned. But sadness and a feeling that you are being neglected because your partner is having all of his or her fun with other people, that's a different issue, and one that does need to be addressed. So I would say that it is really important to figure out which of these things is going on.

(My husband has been very adamant that we take the grandparents up on their offers of babysitting once the baby arrives, so that we can go back to riding together even before she is old enough to tag along, and we should be able to resume other stuff like hiking as soon as I am recovered and the baby can hold her head up in the carrier. So our situation is, I hope, temporary, but I am pretty cranky about it right now.)

pooks

06-25-2007, 04:07 PM

For some reason, he just is not as confident in himself and I guess, I am in myself. So, I have come to the conclusion that this is not going to change, i.e. his confidence will not increase, (we have been married for a long time!) so I try to avoid these kinds of situations so he does not get weirded out.

So, yes, I do compromise in my marriage, but I do wish that all things are equal as far as emotions go. The reality of it is, that all things are not equal as far as emotions go so we deal with the issues as they come.

spoke

I think this is an important point. There are all sorts of things that "should" be true of any relationship, and the jealousy/control issues we're talking about are certainly right up there at the top -- nobody should have to deal with this.

BUT -- marriage, unfortunately, is between two imperfect people, each of whom has baggage and faults.

(And having married young, I also know the issues of each person growing/changing and putting strains on the relationship. It's a lot different when you've done most of that growth and change prior to marriage.)

While I agree that nobody should be controlled by another's jealousy, I also believe that we are sensitive to those we love and respect. Each of us has deal-breakers in our marriage, and will look at somebody else's marriage and say, "I would not put up with that," but whether we realize it or not somebody else might think the same about our relationships.

Longwinded, but just trying to make the point that a couple of others have already. The presence of a good riding buddy isn't worth a lot of marital strife unless you've already drawn that line in the sand and decided, "Either he learns to accept stuff like this or else, because I can't live this way."

If it's that big an issue, then of course there's more going on there than just the recent bicycling issue.

I'm not sure I'm making sense -- just got back from a long camping trip and my brain is fuzzy. But I agree with everyone else, this has been an illuminating conversation. (I agree with everybody. How common is that?)

lph

06-25-2007, 10:56 PM

Longwinded, but just trying to make the point that a couple of others have already. The presence of a good riding buddy isn't worth a lot of marital strife unless you've already drawn that line in the sand and decided, "Either he learns to accept stuff like this or else, because I can't live this way."

well put, pooks

Tuckervill

06-26-2007, 06:02 AM

(My husband has been very adamant that we take the grandparents up on their offers of babysitting once the baby arrives, so that we can go back to riding together even before she is old enough to tag along, and we should be able to resume other stuff like hiking as soon as I am recovered and the baby can hold her head up in the carrier. So our situation is, I hope, temporary, but I am pretty cranky about it right now.)

As a mom of three, I think your husband should give up his long rides on the weekends for now. You may feel just a little cranky about it now. When that lack of sleep kicks in and he's still feeling entitled to long rides on Saturday, your "little" cranky could turn ugly real fast.

Having a baby means giving up stuff. He should start practicing now, if only out of respect for you.

Karen

margo49

06-26-2007, 06:58 AM

Yeah, at least till you're less hormonal - like in about 35 years! But let's not get sidetracked here.

Tuckervill

06-26-2007, 07:28 AM

:D :eek: :D

K.

Melalvai

06-26-2007, 08:44 AM

Yes, there is more than jealousy & insecurity, he is more concerned about my safety than I am, and doesn't buy into "I'm more likely to die of disease off my bike than injury on it" (even though that is true). There is also the adjustment of him not being in this with me, he said "I'm afraid you are going places I can't and don't want to" meaning partly a given bike trip and partly the biking in general.

Friday I told him "Get over it" (about the jealousy) and...after initially anger, he did, basically. In fact he said "I don't know how, tell me what to do," and I said "Go for a ride with Riding Buddy" and he said "Gee, you don't pull your punches, do you?"

Not overly burdened with tact or common sense, I managed to cause another disruption practically the next day, by leaving our daughter at home (he was in class) for a night bike ride. She is nearly 12 and she said she was ok with it, I had my cell phone, I didn't go more than ~30 min away home, albeit circuitously, and she could call me if she wanted me to come back. So now in addition to everything else I'm neglecting my responsibilities. :P

jobob

06-26-2007, 08:49 AM

Not overly burdened with tact or common sense ...

Oh, that made me laugh. I may need to steal it for a sig line one of these days ! :cool:

LBTC

06-26-2007, 08:53 AM

Sorry to not be more supportive, Mel, but, if your daughter has not previously been left home alone like this, then a person could consider this to be reckless behaviour on your part. It seems to me that your situation calls for more communication, not less. An evening ride may be fine, leaving your daughter at home in cell phone contact may also be fine, but if it isn't discussed with your husband, her father, before the fact, I can see this to be cause for some problems.

Do your best to put yourself in his shoes and try to figure out what would work for you to feel more comfortable in the situation. See if you can work with him towards that.

Peaceful supportive butterflies headed your way,
Hugs,
~T~

SouthernBelle

06-26-2007, 11:04 AM

12 years old is certainly old enough to be left for 30 minutes. I was baby sitting at that age. And that brief a time is a good start, esp since mom had her cell with her.

I think there are control or security issues here that it's beyond the abilities of this board to cure.

pooks

06-26-2007, 11:52 AM

It's illuminating to see how many different reasonable reactions there are to the issue.

Crankin

06-26-2007, 12:19 PM

Both of my sons and myself were earning money as babysitters at age 12. In fact, my son who raced bought his first bike with babysitting money. They are not that old that this was in the "olden days." I believe that kids today are WAAAY too overprotected. Of course, you need to teach them responsibility along the way, as they grow, so they are ready for the next step each time.
Tuckerville, take your in laws up on that offer. My husband and I didn't ride back when the kids were little, but you can be sure we went out alone or with friends almost every Saturday night. You do not have to sacrifice your own interests totally when the baby comes. Sure, I did all of the "mom" stuff, but we both worked, we spent time together without the kids, and my kids grew up to be very independent and normal adults despite the fact that their parents left them with a babysitter...
I only we wish we had taken up cycling when they were little and did the trailer thing, etc.

LBTC

06-26-2007, 01:47 PM

oops, I should clarify

I don't think 12 is too young to be left alone, I just think that both parents should know about it in advance. If I would normally be home with the dogs, and I were going out, I would let DH know and I'd let him know if the dogs were in or outside in the back yard....just communication, not necessarily control.

Hugs and butterflies,
~T~

Tuckervill

06-26-2007, 02:08 PM

whoa nellie! It's not ME who's preggers, it's Xeney!

whew. :eek: :p

But no, I think hanging out as a couple without the baby is perfectly okay. I just think Xeney's and her hubby are heading for a parting of the minds on whether long Saturday rides are still okay. I just think it'd be best if he got used the idea of giving some things up ahead of time so it won't be such a shock later. ;)

Karen

xeney

06-26-2007, 04:34 PM

I appreciate your advice but I really don't see the point in both of us being miserable if we don't have to be. I was kidding about the petty crabby thing (well, not kidding, but acknowledging that I am being petty by begrudging him). He went through three long periods of forced inactivity due to injuries, two of them much longer than my pregnancy-related inactivity, and certainly nobody ever suggested to me that I should stop having any fun and just sit by his side so we could mope together. In fact, all the advice I got was in the opposite direction -- take care of yourself, spend time doing what you love in addition to spending time caring for him, etc.

My swollen ankles are not going to feel one tiny bit better if he is at home watching television when there is no earthly reason that he can't go for a bike ride instead. That seems like a recipe for making him resent the baby before she's even here.

margo49

06-26-2007, 09:12 PM

I don't think 12 is too young to be left alone, I just think that both parents should know about it in advance. If I would normally be home with the dogs, and I were going out, I would let DH know and I'd let him know if the dogs were in or outside in the back yard....just communication, not necessarily control.

~T~

I think so too.
Also when your relationship is already under stress such situations just add fuel to the fire and b4 u know it everything (not just the sh*t) is hitting the fan and there seems No Way Forward (except out the door!)

Andrea

06-27-2007, 08:24 AM

Glad to see you told him to get over it!

I'm the only female racer on my team, so I'm always riding and traveling with the guys (even had to share a hotel bed once). My man isn't the jealous type at all, plus he's met all of the guys I race with, so it doesn't really bother him.

Of course, I wouldn't have married him if he'd been the jealous type, either :rolleyes:

Tuckervill

06-28-2007, 06:29 AM

hurleygirl

06-28-2007, 07:08 AM

Wow. I missed the start of this but I have been in a similar situation.

Background: Husband and I are fairly equally matched on the bike. He's a better climber. I go faster on flats. We ride together often. I also go for a regular group ride without him.

Even more background: I am very independent and do lots of stuff without him. He's never once voiced any kind of concern about this. He's not a typical male in so many ways.

Here's the story: There was a regular group "Hill Ride" on Wednesdays with a bunch of "A" level riders. I am not at that level, but it was a regroup ride and they never seemed to mind waiting for me - I was always the last person to the top. They kept inviting me back. Even my husband had gone to this ride, but not recently.

Despite their encouragement, I felt guilty about making them wait for me and wanted to get faster. So I was talking to another one of the slower hill climbers, and we decided to do hills on a different day to improve our abilities. I invited my husband. He declined. (He has taken a dislike to driving to rides - and to get to hills we need to drive). A few weeks of training with my new "hill buddy" went by - my husband was invited to the ride every week but always turned it down.

One day, I got a double flat. I got home and told my husband the story of Mark (hill buddy) and I trying to change the tires - it's actually a funny story but that's for another post. Husband said "so who's this Mark guy?" I told him I know him from other group rides, we're the slower ones on the Wednesday ride, etc. Husband said "I think it's inappropriate that you're riding with him".

Okay, red flags. I explained that he has been invited to every ride and I don't think there's anything wrong with the situation. He pressed the issue. I was taken aback at first because he's never expressed any kind of concern like this before. But I finally decided to drop Mark as a hill buddy - as much as I enjoyed the rides and wished my husband was there too, I figured it was a small price to pay to keep my husband happy. I'm still confused by his reaction, because it's out of character for him.

Crankin

06-28-2007, 07:24 AM

Sorry, Tuckerville for assigning the pregnancy label on you! Xeney, I agree, having your husband sit and mope with you won't help you. I had to be at home, resting for the last 6 weeks of one of my pregnancies. Let's just say that I was not a nice person. It was like one day I was at aerobics and lifting weights and working, the next day, locked in my house. So I can sympathize. This was before vcrs, so i spent my days reading and watching old movies on public TV. My friends had a rotating schedule of visiting me and then my mom came and stayed with me for a month, because I couldn't really run after my other son who was 2. I threw a plate at my husband because I was so pissed!!! Then, when I realized my 2 year old started crying because he had witnessed violence perpetuated by me, I snapped out of it and just counted the days until delivery.

pooks

06-28-2007, 12:03 PM

Wait.

I'm not supposed to throw plates at him?

Who made this rule?

Crankin

06-28-2007, 02:41 PM

Very funny. I have not told that story to hardly anyone. I don't think most people who know me would believe it. Hormones can make you do anything!

mimitabby

06-28-2007, 02:59 PM

Robyn, you said it. Including getting pregnant!

margo49

06-28-2007, 08:40 PM

Yeah there is no bottom to what you would do hormonally.
OTOH, I guess there is no top either
(think: mothers lifting cars off run-over kids)

Long live hormones!

Mr. Bloom

06-29-2007, 07:32 PM

I'm still confused by his reaction, because it's out of character for him.

Hurley, I applaud your flexibility and understanding. I'd suggest that perhaps he never made the connection that it was a two person ride and person #2 was a guy...Personally, I would have been caught off guard by that and probably would have reacted the same way...

Melalvai

09-04-2007, 03:19 PM

This was such a popular thread I thought I'd fill you in on how it turned out.
I spent waaay too much time this summer riding with riding buddy and less & less time doing anything with family and as anyone could predict the relationship seemed to be heading in the direction my husband feared so I ended it.

Very sad to lose a good friend but it was clear to me at this point that was the happiest alternative.

Of course it would all be for naught if I didn't do something to shore up my home life. My husband is a lot more supportive of my bicycling and much more enthusiastic about joining me for rides. We're spending a lot of time together right now, like we're newlyweds or something.

I hate to say it, but Mr. Silver & others in his camp were right. :P

redrhodie

09-04-2007, 04:54 PM

I love a happy ending :p

Trekhawk

09-04-2007, 04:57 PM

Batbike, your entire post was well-written.

Everyone has a different opinion based on their perspective. I guess I am amazed at the number of marriages that might teeter if a spouse is put in close proximity to a member of the opposite sex, therefore the opinion is that one's spouse should never be put in such a situation.

It is like a step back in time, taking away all of the advances women have made over the past 100 years. Seriously, is a female detective not supposed to work with a male dectective? Is a female executive not supposed to hire a male assistant because they will be alone together, day-after-day? Is a female Navy officer not supposed to go in a submarine because she is the only female? Is a female astronaut not supposed to go up in the space shuttle because she will be isolated with only male companions?

I've only thought of a few examples of every day life where men and women work together, closely and intimately, because it is their profession and their job. For this situation, it is like Batbike said, "It is bike riding." It would be ridiculous for a spouse to declare that the married partner should give up a profession because of working with the opposite sex, and the same is true of cycling.

What is next? The female racers should give up their training coaches because they are male?

Darcy

LOL - this thread is very interesting and Darcy you really made me laugh with this post. Well said Darcy!!
My husband's last job was based on a ship overseas for six months a ship with not only men but women. When some of my acquaintances found out about this they were horrifed. They asked didn't I worry about him maybe fooling around with these women when he would be away for so long. I can honestly say it never crossed my mind. I can't live my life like that. I honestly don't believe people have affairs just because they are thrown together. I believe however that great friendships dont have to be reserved for people of the same sex.

teigyr

09-04-2007, 05:05 PM

LOL - this thread is very interesting and Darcy you really made me laugh with this post. Well said Darcy!!
My husband's last job was based on a ship overseas for six months a ship with not only men but women. When some of my acquaintances found out about this they were horrifed. They asked didn't I worry about him maybe fooling around with these women when he would be away for so long. I can honestly say it never crossed my mind. I can't live my life like that. I honestly don't believe people have affairs just because they are thrown together. I believe however that great friendships dont have to be reserved for people of the same sex.

And Trekhawk, I agree with you.

I think affairs happen not because of close proximity but due to problems in someones life or problems in the relationship. It is a sign that something is wrong. There are also people, of course, who just do that sort of thing with thought whatsoever but I'd like to think that's the minority.

I can see both sides. I also believe that affairs aren't just physical so if you were spending more time with your riding buddy (and this translates maybe into emotional intimacy) and not sharing things with your husband, that is a problem.

I met my husband through a male friend (who liked/s me) who still proclaims his affection but realizes I am married. I never even went out with this guy though we did do things as friends. I was never even tempted and I wasn't seeing anyone at the time! My husbands female friends came to our wedding as did my male friends. I was a bartender (ages ago) and when my customers would lament and say things like "I wish my wife were as cool as you" I'd remind them that she probably is, he is just seeing me as an escape and he had better figure out what's going on.

Ok, rant over. I'm glad that the two of you came to terms and that your husband realizes how important cycling is. I think that was a problem in the beginning. So maybe this could have been averted if he had supported you a bit more maybe. And for all my male friends/riding partners/coaches/whatever's wives, there is no need to worry :D

Mr. Bloom

09-04-2007, 07:08 PM

salsabike

09-04-2007, 09:05 PM

And Trekhawk, I agree with you.

I think affairs happen not because of close proximity but due to problems in someones life or problems in the relationship. It is a sign that something is wrong. There are also people, of course, who just do that sort of thing with thought whatsoever but I'd like to think that's the minority.

I can see both sides. I also believe that affairs aren't just physical so if you were spending more time with your riding buddy (and this translates maybe into emotional intimacy) and not sharing things with your husband, that is a problem.

I met my husband through a male friend (who liked/s me) who still proclaims his affection but realizes I am married. I never even went out with this guy though we did do things as friends. I was never even tempted and I wasn't seeing anyone at the time! My husbands female friends came to our wedding as did my male friends. I was a bartender (ages ago) and when my customers would lament and say things like "I wish my wife were as cool as you" I'd remind them that she probably is, he is just seeing me as an escape and he had better figure out what's going on.

Ok, rant over. I'm glad that the two of you came to terms and that your husband realizes how important cycling is. I think that was a problem in the beginning. So maybe this could have been averted if he had supported you a bit more maybe. And for all my male friends/riding partners/coaches/whatever's wives, there is no need to worry :D

Adding one more "I agree" to Trekhawk and Teigyr.

luv'nAustin

09-05-2007, 07:31 AM

Enjoyed reading this thread. Mr. Silver, I especially enjoyed reading your take on the situation. You have wonderful insight. Thanks for sharing.

Starfish

09-05-2007, 08:39 AM

Enjoyed reading this thread. Mr. Silver, I especially enjoyed reading your take on the situation. You have wonderful insight. Thanks for sharing.

I also appreciated Mr.'s last post on this thread...really true, IMO.

Melalvai, thank you for the update, and so happy for you that things are working out.

margo49

09-05-2007, 12:19 PM

Thanks for the update.
I'm sorry it turned out like this.
The older I get the more I think that one should be able to be "just friends" but the more I see that it doesn't happen very often at all.

teigyr

09-06-2007, 11:46 PM

Even the best relationships are not immune to this issue.

In a perfect world, with perfect people, this would not be a problem.

BUT, the world is NOT perfect and people are fallible too.

To take a "get over it" perspective with a spouse is naive and disrepectful.

In a relationship - whether married or not - when one suffers, both suffer. When that suffering (or pain, or confusion, or whatever) comes from one inside the relationship, then everyone is hurt.

When one spouse has an issue with third party relationships, it's my belief that it's not out of distrust of their spouse nearly as much as it is distrust of the third party.

No one wakes up one day saying "I'm going to compromise my relationship today". The compromises occur in little baby steps until suddenly "the leap" is not too far at all. I've seen it time and time again in my friends, and it pains me everytime.

I'm glad that there is a happy ending and that you shared your story with us.

I was thinking and thinking about this and was debating to myself for a while (I'm sure if strangers saw inside my mind they'd think I'm insane!) but I don't think we're so different here.

I can't think of anyone in a good relationship who would have a "get over it" attitude. I guess the feeling I got from the original post was that he (the husband) was being unreasonable. In my limited scope of relationships, we discuss. There are no edicts or judgments, but then again we mostly think alike. If he thinks someone is creepy, I tend to too. Also in any of my dealings with anyone, opposite sex or not, my DH is invited to go along. He is the most important person in my life but that's not to say we don't both have friends. Some are even of the opposite sex persuasion but I guess we're both ok with that.

Yes, if one person suffers, both do. I guess I've seen unreasonable jealousy though and I tend to look at life through that angle. Control solves nothing but thoughtful discussion and decision making does. I've seen unfounded jealousy destroy more than one relationship and no matter how truthful and open the person is, the mate or spouse still has doubts. There can be paranoia and control issues and I don't believe someone should closet themselves due to the insecurities of the person they are involved with.

If there is a problem with the third party, the trust (unless you think the third party is an axe murderer or something) resides with the spouse. I trust my spouse implicitly. I might be naive or silly though.

Maybe I seemed dead-set on not siding with the spouse but I'm in a relationship (now) where we talk about this stuff and we are pretty much in agreement about most things. Betrayal goes way beyond traditional "cheating" and both of us share what's going on in our lives with each other, not other people. A cycling partner would be a cycling partner and nothing else. I would trust my husband with any female friend of his (along with my female friends) and he has met all my male friends. I guess we both know we are the most important people in each others lives so there's really no threat.

I think for those people who have bad things happen by baby steps (and that is a good description), they need to think more critically about their lives. If I ever had any kind of "close" feeling to someone I'd start wondering why and I would try to fix any problems before they got worse. Then again, I tend to over-analyze, I guess.

And I am also glad that there is a happy resolution. I think there was a combination of things going on but it is good that both sides moved toward a middle ground.

There. Internal debate done :D