Club Ride Ratings

[li10up]

For some time now I've been wanting to suggest to our Club Prez that we need to revamp our ride ratings. I know I've seen some of the descriptions that other clubs use here on the forum but can't seem to locate them when searching. How do your clubs rate their rides?

Thanks.

[Kimmyt]

Lessee if I can remember....

D : Beginner rides, usually rank beginners, several low-mileage loops to allow people to tailor the length of the ride to suit them

C/C- : Beginner ride, a longer length (15-20 miles), speed around 9-11 mph

C+/B- : 11-13 mph some small hills

B/B-: 14-16 mph moderate to some larger hills

B/B+: 16-18 mph larger hills

A: 18-20 mph hilly

A/AX: Expert ride, fast. usually meet n go, no specific ride leader.

Thats all I can remember, and don't quote me on exact speeds, etc.

k.

[indysteel]

Our club rides aren't rated per se. For the weekend rides, we get a short description in our newsletter of the ride, e.g., "mostly flat with some rollers," which gives some indication of the terrain. The description will also note approximate ride lengths. For every weekend ride, there are short, medium and long (and sometimes extra long) routes. For instance, there might be 20, 35 and 55-mile options. The medium and long routes are usually SAGed. We get maps for the ride and the routes are Dan Henry-ed. Ride leaders do not do the ride, but instead man the SAGs and sweep the course by car, looking for anybody who might be stranded or lost. There is no set pace for these rides. If you're fast, you go fast. If you're slow, you go slow. However, you have to be prepared to ride alone because it's really easy for the group--even when it's sizable--to get spread out.

The club also offers "sociable," "breakfast" and "dinner" rides, where the reported pace is supposed to be slower, say 12-14 mph, and touring rides, where there is no SAG support or Dan Henrys. The intent with these rides is that everybody more or less ride together. Ride leaders are instructed to stay with the slower riders.

For our weekday "training" rides, the club indicates the average speed of the group, but these are pretty rough estimates. From what I can tell, most of the training rides end up having A and B (and sometimes C) groups. The As might average 23+ mph, while the Bs might average 18+ mph. The averages are vary as the season progresses, too. Because the routes are Dan Henry-ed, you can still just go at your own pace, but they're really intended to teach people how to safely ride in a fast pack.

Perhaps our club has it easier when it comes to grading rides in that Central Indiana is mostly flat. There's only a handful of rides--mostly in southern Indiana--that warrant a warning about being challenging. Other rides are judged more by length than terrain.

[limewave]

Co-ed rides:

X--Beginner rides, on bike path, out 45 minutes and back. Slow pace.

C--25 miles, 16-17 mph, some hills

B--40 miles, 20-22 mph, some hills

A--40 miles 22-25 mph, some hills


Women's Ride:

B--14-16 mph, 20 mile loop

A--18-20 mph, 20 mile loop

[lauraelmore1033]

from my club. We seem to be more conservative about pace and tend to have a " no rider left behind" policy:
PACE
Leisurely / Under 10 MPH
Social / 10–13 MPH
Moderate / 13-16 MPH
Brisk / 16-18 MPH
Strenuous / Over 18 MPH

TERRAIN
A Mostly flat / Norman Road
B Rolling Terrain / McClinchy
C Rolling steeper hills / Kitsap
D difficult/whidbyIsland
E Very Difficult / RAMROD

another local club (Cascade) bumps all the categories up one level of speed with "super strenuous" at the top. I hear no end of complainyd from people who get dropped from rides of any pace category

[michelem]

The following is taken directly from our ride schedule:

A: Mostly steep grades: strong riders only

B: Steep/Moderate: Some relief from steep grades

C: Moderate: Hilly; a challenge for the average rider

D: Moderate/Easy: Rolling hills, a challenge for beginners

E: Easy: Some gentle rolling greades, but no problems

F: Flat: If any route is really flat

Distance: Represented by actual number of miles

Pace will range in "miles per hour" between about 10mph on easy short distance rides to 20+ mph on hard long distance rides. Generally, the pace increases as the difficulty (steepness and distance) of the ride increases. Riders tend to increase their pace as they gain experience, fitness, and are challenged by difficulty. Beginners and novices are strongly advised to select easy and short distance rides to start with, and progress up the grading scale with experience and capability.

However, I don't care how "easy" or "short" a ride is, even those described as "EZ Rides" (EZR) are swept at 12mph; and, unfortunately, our EZ Rider leader recently moved away. :( When I was starting out, I called the leader of an E/D 30 ride, which I figured qualified as an "easy short distance ride," only to be told that I needed to be able to keep up a pace of 14mph to come along. :(

So, here are a couple of ride descriptions:

Clarksburg & Southerly Backroads Wander
Grade: E40 EZR
This will be a relaxed pace (12mph) flat tour around the delta south of Clarksburg. A good first longer ride if you've been stuck in the 20-30 mile rut.

Tuesday Evening Ride & Dinner
Grade: C25-35
Come join us on our continuing series of brisk paced (15-20+mph) Tuesday night rides. We will do some hills around Folsom, El Dorado HIlls, and Roseville. Lights are required front and rear.

Lincoln, Loomis, and Auburn
Grade: C65
This ride goes on out to Auburn and back with approximately 3,500 feet of climbing (Sierra College, English Colony, Shirland Tract). Brign water and $$ for a midway rest stop.

The Annual "Kill Bill" Ride
Grade: A75
Come join me for another one of my "Rollers" rides. This is the ride where I earned my title as "Kill Bill." This is a spectacular ride from Georgetown to Loon Lake and bck on Wentworth Springs Rd. The views of Desolation Wilderness are awesome. There is approx. 7,500 ft of climbing with a long, fast and fun decent on the return. There are no services available so I will have SAG support to carry your food and drinks. We will lunch at the lake's edge.

Hope these help!

[Blueberry]

Our club's classification is as follows:

Ride pace classifications: A 18+ mph; B 16-18 mph; C 13-15 mph; D 10-12 mph

All rides are swept unless they're advertised as "training rides." Faster riders are normally welcome unless they are "social riders" - in those rides, only a few people are given cue sheets and the entire group will re-group every few miles.

Carrie Anne

[Deanna]

Our club rates all rides based on three criteria, listed as 4/C/65-80 (Difficulty/Pace/Distance)

Difficulty Classifications

1- EASY TERRAIN MOSTLY FLAT
2 - ROLLING, EASY GRADES
3 - MODERATE GRADES
4 - HILLY, A FEW STEEP CLIMBS
4- VERY HILLY, LOTS OF LONG CLIMBS

Pace Classifications
A: relaxed pace; frequent regroups; waits for all riders. Over 26 minutes*
B: touring pace; regroups every 30-45 minutes;waits for all riders. 23-26 minutes*
C: brisk pace;pacelines likely;regroups every 30-60 minutes. 19-22 minutes*
D: aggressive pace; pacelines likely; slower riders may miss regroups. Under 19 minutes*
** These times are based on a local “speed trap” that riders can time themselves on to check their pace.

Distance Classifications
The last figure in the formula, stated in approximate miles. (If in doubt, leader should overestimate mileage slightly.)

[Eden]

Here's the Cascade ride catagories

Easy: Under 10 mph
Note: for rides described as HILLY, consider choosing a pace one step down from your usual comfort level

Leisurely: 10-12 mph
Steady: 12-14 mph
Moderate: 14-16 mph
Brisk: 16-18 mph
Strenuous: 18-21 mph
Super Strenuous: 22+ mph
Refers to the range of speeds on level ground without breaks. Downhills may be faster, uphills slower.

Terrain

These descriptions should be considered int he context of the pace and length of the ride.

Mostly flat: trails and/or mostly flat roads with a possible gentle upgrade.
Rolling: climbs are short and easy, not too numerous.
Some hills: a few short, steep hills, some moderate upgrades and/or longer gentle climbs.
Hilly: many true hills but none outrageous.
Extremely hilly: steep and long climbs with grades >9% and/or mountain passes.
Unlimited: "out of category"; only for those very sure of their ability to climb any grade, any length at the advertised pace.
Off road: significant unpaved sections.

[Eden]

One of the Cascade ride listings

Activities Calendar - Ride Detail

STP Training Series Rain or Shine Northend Edition
Start Date/Time: 4/26/07, 06:00PM
Start Location: Tracy Owen Station/Logboom Park, Kenmore
Directions to common starting points
URL (for more info): http://
Ride Leader Name: Saul Kinderis
Contact Phone: (425)402-3426
Second Ride Leader
Ride Leader Name: Orin Eman
Contact Phone: (206)618-0376

Recurrence: Weekly
Distance: 25-35
Pace: Brisk
Unsure what the pace or terrain means? Check here.
Terrain: Some hills
Map Available: No
Regroup: Occasional
Weather Cancels: Ice/snow cancels
Ride Description:
Come join us as we do a variety of rolling hilly loops and then head over to the Grillhouse or 3rd Place Books for post ride libations. Lights required.

[li10up]

Thanks for the ideas. What about this? Is it clear? I think our current listing is too ambiguous. My easy, moderate, etc. and someone else's easy are likely very different. I think this might help take the guesswork out of picking a ride.

[HappyAnika]

When speeds are listed, does this mean the pace you are riding at most of the time? Or the average that your computer says at the end of a ride?

For me these can be very different numbers. For example I can be mostly riding along at 17, but at the end my computer says 14 due to starts and stops, perhaps a steep hill where my speed went way down, and/or slowing to wait for people, etc. . .

[li10up]

Shoot! Now I need to figure out how to put speed into something like this also.

IMO avg. speed is the avg. speed your bike computer says. That way on any given route you know that you go x mph and so if the advertised ride says x++ mph then you will likely get left behind.

Maybe I should take out the distance and substitute speed???????

[Eden]

I disagree - like the Cascade rides I would classify rides based on speed for flat ground without breaks because 1. most people over estimate their own average speeds because they look at the speedo more often when they are going faster and 2. average speed is usually a bit of a liar - many of my training rides clock in around 15mph if you look at the computer average at the end of the ride, but that counts many stop signs and other things that bring that average down. The rides themselves are actually much harder with the flat ground averages being more like 18 - 22 mph...

[li10up]

I disagree - like the Cascade rides I would classify rides based on speed for flat ground without breaks because 1. most people over estimate their own average speeds because they look at the speedo more often when they are going faster and 2. average speed is usually a bit of a liar - many of my training rides clock in around 15mph if you look at the computer average at the end of the ride, but that counts many stop signs and other things that bring that average down. The rides themselves are actually much harder with the flat ground averages being more like 18 - 22 mph...

But since everyone has to do the starts and stops your bike computer would still be a legit comparison, wouldn't it?

[Deanna]

Shoot! Now I need to figure out how to put speed into something like this also.

IMO avg. speed is the avg. speed your bike computer says. That way on any given route you know that you go x mph and so if the advertised ride says x++ mph then you will likely get left behind.

Maybe I should take out the distance and substitute speed???????

I think all three criteria (Difficuty, Pace & Distance) are important. Though distance could be included as part of the description and not part of the rating.

[li10up]

How about this? The hors is a tongue-in-cheek thing.

[indysteel]

li10up, what's the difference between "B (hilly)" and "C (some hills)"? Otherwise, it makes sense to me.

[RoadRaven]

LOL, li...

A hors - casual ride????

that has me wondering!

[RoadRaven]

li10up, what's the difference between "B (hilly)" and "C (some hills)"? Otherwise, it makes sense to me.


They are having this discussion on BJ at the moment... when entering your ride you can choose for a hilly course between 'hills' and 'steep'...

There is nothing there for the rolling rides... they are not flat, but they are not really hilly either... I think li's C category is probably for those rolling terrains which arent hilly, but demand more of a workout and give a lower average than a flat terrain...

[Eden]

But since everyone has to do the starts and stops your bike computer would still be a legit comparison, wouldn't it?

You'd have to be riding the same course at the same time for there to be any comparison as far as average speeds go. There are too many variables on any given ride to make it anything better a very general comparison - how many times you have to stop or slow, what the wind conditions are like, if you are alone or drafting. I think that if you talk about a persons typical speed under ideal conditions - ie. flat without significant wind then it will be easier get an idea of what group you'll fit best with without having to know anything about the route you are about to ride.

And also - generally club rides regroup on hills, so its your speed on the flats that more determines what group you want to ride with. You can be speedy on hills, but have trouble keeping up high speeds on the flats.....

[RoadRaven]

You can be speedy on hills, but have trouble keeping up high speeds on the flats.....

LOL... or you can motor it on the flat but get
d
r
o
p
p
e
d

on hills... like moi!

[li10up]

LOL, li...

A hors - casual ride????

that has me wondering!

I did say tongue-in-cheek. :) But in reality...that's probably all the faster they would be going up that type of climb...if that.
----------------
I'm just trying to incorporate more descriptive descriptions...wait, that doesn't make sense, does it?
----------------
All I'm trying to say is it seems to me if your bike computer says your avg. speed is 14.2 mph on any given ride (yes, give or take, and taking in different conditions, wind speed, what you ate, the color of your jersey;) , etc. ad nauseum) then you probably wouldn't want to go out and try an advertised ride of 16 mph on a hilly route.
I think that if you talk about a persons typical speed under ideal conditions - ie. flat without significant wind then it will be easier get an idea of what group you'll fit best with without having to know anything about the route you are about to ride.
But some days the avg. speed of the same group will be 14 and other days it will be 20, depending on the route...it doesn't make sense to me to use your avg. speed on flat ground as the indicator of what your avg. speed is. Otherwise you will always just ride the rides that fall into your flat cruising speed...which may leave you way behind or put you way ahead of the group. I'm trying to see what you're saying but I'm just not getting it.

[makbike]

Here is the rating system used by the Louisville Bicycle Club. It is pretty simple when compared to those that have been shared thus far.

Ride difficulty ratings are approximate:
#1: Family/Beginner Ride
#2: Mostly flat to rolling, up to 1/3 hills
#3: Rolling, up to 1/2 hills
#4: Rolling, mostly hills, some long, steep grades and/or long mileage
#5: Mostly long, steep hills and/or extremely long mileage.

[Crankin]

When I post my rides to be published in the AMC mag and on line, I use average speed. But as was said before, some people lie or have no conception of what that means, so i get very specific with them when they call to sign up. I do mostly rides where we screen people and I had a really bad experience with a woman on the last ride we led. One of the problems is that we get a lot of people who live in or near Boston and they are not used to hills. So even though we do social rides and regroup, we ride at a good 15-18 mph pace on the flats but we tell the people that we do slow on the hills a lot. They have no conception of what a 5% or 10% grade means. So even if I tell them "strenuous climbs of a mile," they think they can do it. None of the riding I do is flat; it's mostly rollers and some big climbs thrown in. AMC uses 10-12 av is easy/beginner, 13-16 av is intermed. and 16 plus and/or over 50 miles advanced. We are leading our "new members" ride next Sat. and we are breaking it into 2 groups, one easy and one intermediate. Last year they didn't do this and one woman was so slow she was behind the sweep! It's a show and go ride and i am worried about the weirdos that might come out...

[li10up]

Robyn, that's why I'm trying to come up with more specific ride descriptions that the club can agree with. I want to start another group ride...call it moderate or intermediate. But I really want this ride to move along at a 15/16 mph avg pace which would be about 18-20 mph on the flats. I'm just concerned that some newer riders will think it's the same as the Easy/Beginner ride that I lead and will get over their heads...or the rest of the group will have to slow their ride to accomodate the slower riders. I have no problem going whatever pace we need to go on the Easy Ride - that's what it's for...to get new riders out. But I need to ride on a regular basis with faster riders to help me improve. I just want everyone who shows up for the ride to know what to expect and to enjoy it. I've been doing it just word of mouth with my riding buddies that I know ride about my speed. But I want it to be a regular/organized ride in hopes that I'll always have someone to ride with on whatever day it happens to be scheduled.

Eden, I've been thinking about what you wrote and I think I have a better understanding of what you were saying. Too bad there isn't just a standard of what "avg. speed" means. I can do 18-20 mph on the flats, no problem, but I just can't keep up on the hills so I would never show up for a ride advertised with an avg. speed of 18...cause my "avg" would fall significantly with hills factored in.