compact double v triple? (my new bike!)

[RussianHillGal]

After an all-day bike shopping trip with a very patient girlfriend/TNT cycling coach and 3 weeks of peppering my cycling friend with questions and spending countless hours online, I was convinced I had caviar tastes on a filet mignon budget, so I decided to take a break from active bike shopping and tagged along today on another gal's bikeshopping expedition to a boutique LBS. I was just there to watch/look/listen, and of course, as we were getting ready to walk out the door, the sale tag on a pink and silver flash caught my eye. Three minutes later, I was in love!!!

Giant TCRw 2006, Shimano 105, aluminum with carbon fork. About $300 more than the Dolce I looked at last week, but this bike has better components - and it is SEXY!

There is a reason this LBS (Bike Nuts in the Marina district of SF) is so highly recommended - the service is impeccable! This place doesn't advertise, and the only pressure to buy came from my girfriends who could tell I was in LOVE!

The TCRw comes with a compact double. The LBS guys said they could swap it out for a triple and install it for almost an even swap. So the decision really comes down to preference, not price.

I am 33, haven't been on a bike in 20 years (yeesh!), and would say I am average fit (just finished a 25k xc ski marathon with Team in Training, as a total beginner Dec 06 - but I am slooooow - and not terribly coordinated). Short legs. 5'1. Have probably 15 pounds that need converting from fat to muscle. :rolleyes:

Plan on riding with my cycling girlfriends in the crazy hills of Marin County - Sausalito/Tiberon/Larkspur - the goal is to train for the Marin Century. Apparently 30-50 miles/day is the norm with "the girls", so that will be my training target.

Would appreciate your thoughts on whether to keep the compact double or swap it out for the triple. If triple, are there any things I should keep in mind so I can discuss this intelligently with the LBS guys?

I'm going back next Saturday for my first hour-long fitting (I get another fitting for FREE with these guys after I've spent some time on the bike and my fitness level has improved - how's that for awesome service?) Am so excited!!

[aicabsolut]

Know what the grades you'll be riding tend to be?

What's your easiest cog in the cassette? Is this a 50/36 compact or 50/34?

[sarahlou]

I have a triple crank set on my bike and love having gear options. If the store is willing to change them over for no real charge then I would do it. If you choose to do it down the track it will definately cost. Are they going to give you the same level of components- front derailleur, shifter & crank set? Check on that before you decide. Triple is ideal for the hilly country you want to ride in.

[RussianHillGal]

The Giant site says the cranks are : FSA Gossamer Mega Exo, 34/50 T. So I'd basically be missing the biggest & the smallest gears.

Grade : It looks like an average of 5.5% - up to 6.7% for the hard parts. Not quite sure what this means, but that's what google gave me. Also, the Marin Century has 6250 feet of hills.

I'm far more concerned about finishing than about finishing fast. But it would be nice to be able to keep up with the rest of the girls. :D

[traveller_62]

RussianHill,

I just had this conversation with my brother in law last night about gearing for his bike!

I've been riding an FSA 50/34 compact double for over a year now. My training partner rides with a triple. I must admit that while I like the compact double there are times when I wish I had one more gear to go to on a long steep climb at the end of a 4 or 5 hour ride!

Since you are just getting into cycling after some time off I guess I would recommend the triple to start with. The weight difference isn't probably going to be a big factor and having more gearing options on hilly terrain could make your ride more enjoyable.

Whatever you choose, enjoy that beautiful bike!

-traveller

[Veronica]

Which version of the Marin Century do you plan on doing, the new one with Mount Tam or the old one? There are sections of Tam that are more than 6%. I'd guess more like 12% and the last bit is even steeper.

V.

[BabyBlueNTulsa]

I'm with the other ladies on this... and I can personally attest a triple is really nice to have in hilly terrain! (yep, NE Oklahoma is hilly!) I'm not too proud to admit its nice to have when others are grinding up in their double! :P

When you get stronger, you COULD decide not to drop down into the 'granny'...but somethin tells me it'd STILL be nice to have on occasion! ;)


P.S. That is one beautiful bike!!!

Edit: I just found this page with a great explanation of gearing (and lots of other items related to choosing a road bike). After reading your initial post, it got me wondering about how to understand MY components. Thanks! Hope this link helps you too! ;)
http://chainwheel.com/page.cfm?PageID=85

[ehirsch83]

I'm interested on everyone's thoughts of compact v. triple.

I have always thought of the triple as the granny gear...
but I am moving from Fl to New Mexico next month and will probably need to change out of my double. My SO has already moved there, and he is still climbing away in his double, but he has those long lean climbing legs(he is also a masher with his gears and i am much more of a spinner).

my thoughts on this is to go with the compact, but i am used to the flats....

[madisongrrl]

The TCRw comes with a compact double. The LBS guys said they could swap it out for a triple and install it for almost an even swap. So the decision really comes down to preference, not price.

I am 33, haven't been on a bike in 20 years (yeesh!), and would say I am average fit (just finished a 25k xc ski marathon with Team in Training, as a total beginner Dec 06 - but I am slooooow - and not terribly coordinated). Short legs. 5'1. Have probably 15 pounds that need converting from fat to muscle. :rolleyes:

Since you haven't been currently cycling, go for the triple. There is no shame in it. When you get to be a stronger cyclist you can always upgrade to a double. What size is the rear casette and also the chainrings up front, and what would they change it out to?

[Veronica]

Where does this shame idea come from in having triple?

V.

[Triskeliongirl]

Congrats on the beautiful bike! From where you live and ride, and given your current level of fitness, I would recommend the triple. I have ridden both, and while I currently have compact doubles on both my bikes, I have had to pair them with a mountain cassette and derailleur in back to get up everything I want. and then I feel at times the gears are further apart than I'd like. A compact double is easier to keep in tune, but if I had it to do over I would get a triple. As you get stronger, you can always go to a tighter casette in back and/or just use the granny for emergencies.

p.s. I agree with the recommendation to do it now while the cost is minimal. Doing it later will cost you a lot!

[jobob]

Darned if I know ! :rolleyes: I don't feel "shamed" in the least for having a triple.

I used to use the small ring a lot to get me up hills.

I've gotten a lot stronger, and I use my granny a lot less now, mostly if the grade kicks up to around 10% (oh, who the heck am I kidding, 8%, or on a yuck day like today, 6% :p ) or if I'm really tired. It's nice to have.

[7rider]

I had a triple on my bike for 5 years. I recently rebuilt the bike and put a compact (50/34) on it. The bike lost a lot of weight in the process (the rebuild shaved over 2 pounds off the bike - not insignificant when it was already just a 20 pound bike.) and the drivetrain is much less complicated. Although I opted to keep a 12-25 spread in the back, you can play with the cassette to an extent and not lose any of the low-end gearing you would get with a triple.
Frankly, I'd rather haul a lighter bike with slightly less low-end gearing up a hill, than a heavier bike up a hill with a granny. But that's me. If you are reasonably fit, and the hills are moderate in your area, I think a compact crank should be fine. Have them put a 12-27 on the back, and you'll never miss the gearing over a triple.
My $0.02.

[Eden]

There is no shame in riding with a triple!

The only drawback to having one is that you are kind of stuck with it. Yes you can convert a triple to a double (and vice/versa), but by the time that you buy a new bottom bracket, new derailleurs, new cranks, etc. you usually have spent enough to nearly buy a new bike....

If you think you might outgrow a triple then go with the compact double, - its drawback is slightly less of a gear range as compared to the triple (especially at the top end).

btw - I think a lot of people who have triples don't think they could get by without the granny gears, but - a triple is often a 30-42-52, so if you don't use the granny ring you are climbing in the 42! a standard double is a 39-53, so its not really like climbing in your middle ring at all. With a compact double you are usually going down to a 36 or a 34 for the small ring.

[Veronica]

Have them put a 12-27 on the back, and you'll never miss the gearing over a triple.
My $0.02.

I have a compact double and I have a triple. I miss that very lowest gear when I am riding the mountains around here.

V.

[Veronica]

I wouldn't call the hills around San Francisco moderate.

V.

[Triskeliongirl]

I had a triple on my bike for 5 years. I recently rebuilt the bike and put a compact (50/34) on it. The bike lost a lot of weight in the process (the rebuild shaved over 2 pounds off the bike - not insignificant when it was already just a 20 pound bike.) and the drivetrain is much less complicated. ....

I bet you made other changes besides the triple to double to shave 2 LBS. I didn't find much of a weight change at all going from a triple to a double, although I agree that I like the mechanical simplicity (and if you end up having to put on a larger rear casette and longer cage rear derailleur you are adding weight in the back as you take it off the front). But I think for the poster in question, she is better off with a triple.

[spokewench]

I have a compact double and I have a triple. I miss that very lowest gear when I am riding the mountains around here.

V.

I ride with a normal double (not a compact); I have a triple on my cyclocross bike since I ride it off road and the extra gears come in handy there. I do not like how slow the triple is to shift up front in comparison to a double.

When I bought my carbon fiber giant I went with the normal double cause the bike is so light and I didn't need much more than than because of the lightness of the bike. This works for me for 99% of my riding. The only time I was wishing for a COMPACT double was in the mountains of Colorado last year on the 5th riding day of a 6 day ride - Bicycle Tour of Colorado - mountain passes every day and on average 80 miles or so per day. But, I still made it with my regular double. I have been riding a long time, but am not really a great climber, just a steady one.

If I had a choice between a compact double and a triple, I would go with the double. For me the triple is just not responsive enough when shifting and too heavy.

[Veronica]

I've never ridden in Colorado. I have ridden where the original poster rides. This is the profile of just one of the climbs around here, and incidentally one she may do on the Marin Century. It's not a moderate climb.

The original poster hasn't been riding for years. Unless she is already really fit, a compact double probably won't serve her well.

V.

[spazzdog]

I'm (surprisingly) with Veronica and jobob on this in regards to the original poster...

If she's just starting out, riding in any of the states with big bumps, go with the triple. It'll be far more satisfying to be able to finish a ride without blowing out a knee... believe me, her butts gonna be sore as it is. The triple will give her a break.


I say surprising above, not because I ever disagree with you girls (nope, not me :D), but because of my own "triple-avoidance-syndrome".

spazz

[jobob]

Have fun on Tunnel Road & Skyline today, spazz! :D

[jobob]

You know what, RHG? There are very good arguments for both the compact double and for the triple. You know your needs and temperment and fitness better than we do, and we can talk about what's better ad nauseum, but in the end you need to decide what's best for you.

Here are a few other threads where we hashed this all out - and there are a lot more where that came from...

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=6898

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=9187

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=9740

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=12463


Good luck on your decision. I don't think you'll go wrong either way (I'll always side for the triple, but I'm an old fart :p )

[7rider]

Well, you're right. I don't know what the hills are like where she's riding. And V., I would certainly not call that hill profile "moderate"! (That's why I load my response with caveats.) If that's a routine ride in her area, then a triple might be a viable option.
Here's a gearing chart where you can look at your gearing options. http://i1.net/~dwolfe/gerz/index.html
I think it's always good to have the numbers in front of you when you're making your decision. Look at the low end (and the high end) of your gearing options. Are you really losing anything? If you are losing more than you're comfortable with - then, sure - maybe it's worth it to opt for a bike with a triple. I think converting that bike to a triple might not be worth the added expense, when perhaps there are similar bikes in the Giant line that already have it. I don't know. I'm not familiar with their line (and haven't gone and researched it before posting this).
p.s. And yes, there was more to my rebuild than just the crank. There had to be to allow the bike to shift. And some of the rebuild was just bling.

[roadie gal]

I like up in the mountains of California. My old roadie had a triple, my new one has a compact double. I think I'm pretty fit, but there are still quite a few times when I wish I had the triple. I say go for the triple. The times you use the granny gear you'll really appreciate it.

[Triskeliongirl]

We need to bear in mind that this isn't so much about what each of us rides, or even what would each of us would ride in the original posters situation, but what would best serve the original poster with the information we've been given. I think given her current level of fitness, where she wants to ride, and the negligible difference in cost if she has them change it out for a tirple now, she will be best served by a triple, especially if its her only high quality road bike.

[roguedog]

Hey RHG!

Welcome to the Giant club.. and welcome to the Bike Nut one. Guys there are really, really nice and patient. It's how I ended up with my baby.. also a TCR.

I love my bike.

I bought it used from Huseyin since I didn't really want to spend that much on a bike.. and frankly cuz I think he just wanted me outta his store. I was standing there for hours trying to decide on a bike (and on whether to go with him or another bs).

Tell Huseyin that my black 03 TCR is doing great and that I've doubled the mileage on it since he sold it to me!

My bike did come with a double. A normal double... ok, ok, with a big honking cassette on the back that Huseyin put on for me. I don't know what a triple feels like..

I think as someone similar to your profile.. I'd go for the triple. And having grown up in Marin.. uh.. ya.. go for the triple. Gives you options. When you toughen up and have more mileage under you, then you can convert back if you really want to but I think for now, it's better to have options and to build up that confidence than to worry about weight (50-100 g) or whatever.

My newbie, unknowledgeable, .002 :)

[lacyliz]

I went through what you're going through - what gearing to get- did all the research, asked new roadies, old roadies, my LBS etc. I ended up really learning a lot about gearing/gear ratios from various websites.

I ended up getting the TCRw with the compact (34/50)- and swapping out the cassette to a 12-27 (instead of the standard 12-25 that comes with it). This gave me all but the very lowest gear from my old triple (I had a 30/39/52 with a 11-28 cassette). The compact shifts gears easier and supposedly does not wear out so quickly. It is, as others have said, lighter.

Conrats on your new bike - it's beautiful!

[SadieKate]

We need to bear in mind that this isn't so much about what each of us rides, or even what would each of us would ride in the original posters situation, but what would best serve the original poster with the information we've been given. I think given her current level of fitness, where she wants to ride, and the negligible difference in cost if she has them change it out for a tirple now, she will be best served by a triple, especially if its her only high quality road bike.I couldn't agree more with Triske and all the women who actually ride in the hills of Marin. Until you know what the grades and climbs are like here, the person's fitness level or other challenges (such as knee and back health), you can't really make a accurate recommendation.

One thing I do is look around at the strong and fast riders who ride these hills every day and put in the lots of miles and guess what? They're riding triples. They're riding triples with a 30 inner and a 29 to a 34 cog. Sorry, but a compact double with a 34/50 does not give you the range of a triple. Many of us use 24-26 inner rings. Until you know the hills of the California Bay Area, it's tough to understand the challenge.

Realize that a claim of 5.5 percent is the average not the maximum. You can easily run into sections of 10-15% that added into the entire climb are stated as an average of 5.5%. The top of Diablo is 17-18% for a long enough period that only the strongest riders can stand. Coleman Valley from the west - oy vey. And pavement condition can cost another gear. Northern California roads can be horribly rough which just makes them harder.

If in doubt, get a triple now while you're coming back to cyling and building strength. You can swap to a double much more cheaply, but if you put in the miles and climbs that it sounds like, you'll be loving that triple. Having a few extra gears now will help you get up hills and build fitness. You don't have to use them if you're strong enough, but if you don't have them you could be walking instead.

Sheldon Brown provides some great info and you can calculate gear inches easily.

http://sheldonbrown.com/gears/

BTW, all this talk of weight. If you run a touring triple (aka compact triple) with a 26-36-48 chainrings and a smaller cassette, I truly doubt there is much, if any, weight difference -- and that smaller cassette provides much more closely spaced gears for the times you're on flat roads and still have low gears for the climbs.

[maillotpois]

I have been riding for years. I am in good shape and am a strong climber and long distance rider. Most of my riding is in Marin, Sonoma and Napa counties.

I have a triple and use EVERY SINGLE ONE of those gears. :cool:

At least two people on my Death Ride team are regretting their compacts and going for an XT setup in the back to try to compensate. I have a friend who's a powerhouse and misses his big juicy power gear in his new compact set up. I love that power gear and would never give it up! :D

[IntenseRide]

I bought my first road bike last month and have ridden it twice. I have a double with a 53/39 set-up and I'm a fit 'mountainbiker' but here in Minnesota I'm unsure as to the hills and what there is to ride road-wise. After reading this, I'm wondering if I should have gone with a triple, but was told since I'm a strong rider I wouldn't need it. The bike is 17.3 pounds and riding it up hills hasn't proven an issue...yet. I figure long rides will tell. I'm wondering if my LBS will still swap it for a triple. This is great information!

[aicabsolut]

I started out with my current bike as a complete noob, and I'm not a natural climber. I have an FSA 50/36T compact crank and Shimano 12-27 cassette.

I really suffer on grades around 12%. I would need a triple for any consistent hills above that. However, I rarely use the 36x12 gear on hills (6-9% usually) anymore. And a 34T small ring is definitely easier than the 36.

I'm not sure I'd particularly want to do 18% hills even with a triple :o , but I wouldn't underestimate your climbing ability with a compact.

[Veronica]

How long does it take to climb a hill? To me hills take less than 15 - 20 minutes to get over. And yeah, I don't need a small gear for those.

But the long, sustained climbs we have here, the ones that take an hour or two, or sometimes even more, to get over... Oh yeah, I want a small gear on those.

V.

[SadieKate]

It's not the grade only. It's grade plus length of the climb plus length of the entire ride. A climb that is easy in the middle of a 30 mile ride may be a killer at the end of a century.

Even the pros use triples at times.

[Eden]

Even the pros use triples at times.

Very, very rarely - they really are a liablility on a race bike - though you will find that the pros get their bikes tailored to the day that they are riding them on. If they are riding a very flat course they will have a very different bike from when they are riding a mountainous one, both in gearing and other things as well. For most of us mere mortals, we need to find the setup that gives us the most flexibility to do all tasks.

My personal experience was going from a triple to a standard double. When I did not have a bike that truely fit properly I *needed* that triple - and it was even mt bike style gearing.... Now that I have a lighter bike that fits properly I find that I can climb anything thrown at me without hurting my knees (even double digit grades seated) with a standard double and fast too - but I am very small and light which suits me to climbing. I test rode a compact double and I could tell very quickly that I would be missing those top end gears - here's where the small and light becomes a liability - I need to chase downhill a lot... Personally if I was not racing I might go with a compact. If I was touring and carrying weight I would want the extra gears a triple gives you.

[SadieKate]

Very, very rarely - they really are a liablility on a race bike - though you will find that the pros get their bikes tailored to the day that they are riding them on. If they are riding a very flat course they will have a very different bike from when they are riding a mountainous one, both in gearing and other things as well. For most of us mere mortals, we need to find the setup that gives us the most flexibility to do all tasks.Yep, but they do use them at times and the rest of us can neither do the tailoring of a bike for each ride nor have the fitness and power/weight ratio of the pros.

[RussianHillGal]

My very humble thanks to the generous women on this board!!

Veronica - the hill profile was intimidating, but also exciting to see. I definitely see alot of training in my future!! :p

I will definitely ask the LBS for a compact triple and work on getting into shape.

RogueDog, I'll be sure to tell Hussein that you and the bike is doing well!

Embarassing moment: I was so excited about having a bike soon that I to GG Park today and rented a bike - just to test out if i still remembered how to ride - and promptly went HEAD-FIRST into a parked SUV and banged my head/shoulder into the car. :eek: Thanks goodness I had on a helmet and was only going about 2 miles/hour. Just my pride is hurt! Will make sure to not venture out with cars again til I get a bit more confidence on two wheels!

Thanks again!!

[roguedog]

LOL, RHG. Well, at least it was only your pride. But it was probably a gorgeous day to embarass oneself...

I was in the south bay and it beautiful spring day. Just needed to be riding in it.. not stuffing my face.

oink.

[RoadRaven]

Back on page 1 Regina said something I agree with...

A compact with a 27-12 cassette is probably all you will need.

A compact is lighter, narrower and less subject to dropping the chain.

I have only ever had a double and my most recent bike (EMC2 Fem Etape Pro) is a compact and is all I need. Our house is 600 feet above sea levele and all rides involve going down the hills to get anywhere and therefore always involve the climbs to get home again.

Also... If you look through a gearage chart for a triple, you will see there are a number of duplications.

[Veronica]

Veronica - the hill profile was intimidating, but also exciting to see. I definitely see a lot of training in my future!! :p



That is Mount Tam from Fairfax to the summit and back to Fairfax, a truly beautiful ride.

V.

[Eden]

Yep, but they do use them at times and the rest of us can neither do the tailoring of a bike for each ride nor have the fitness and power/weight ratio of the pros.

ummm yeah - I think I said that.....

[ehirsch83]

Also... If you look through a gearage chart for a triple, you will see there are a number of duplications.[/QUOTE]



That is the whole reason why I have never seen the point in a triple! I forgot to mention that yesterday in my semi-glazed state.

[maillotpois]

Sure there are duplications, but I do not want to give up my power gearing 52/12 or my long hill gearing 32/28 - there is no duplication at either extreme end and I want those gears.

Greedy, I suppose! :rolleyes:

[Veronica]

You all do what you want. :)

Me - I'll stick with the gearing I have on my bikes. Heck, it got me through three double centuries so it must work all right for me. And in my world, it is all about me. :D

V.

[SadieKate]

Well said, MP.

Until you know what the grades and climbs are like here, the person's fitness level or other challenges (such as knee and back health), you can't really make an accurate recommendation.

Every single person who rides the same hills RussianHillGal will be has many years' experience riding centuries (or longer) and recommended a triple. These aren't newbies lacking fitness making the recommendation. Many of the strong male riders in this neck of the woods use triples. Those that don't are generally in split into two categories: 1) racers and genetically strong freaks and 2) idiots who due to their ego (or stubborness :D) prefer to grunt, groan and fall over on the climbs (assuming they haven't already destroyed their knees).

[spazzdog]

You go Ms. V.!!

I think it comes down to personal preference/comfort... or in my case, stubborness :eek: (I probably fall into SK's #2 category, except I only fall over when I'm off my bike)

spazz-of-the-broken-left-buttock

[jobob]

You all do what you want. :)

Me - I'll stick with the gearing I have on my bikes. Heck, it got me through three double centuries so it must work all right for me. And in my world, it is all about me. :D

V.

Ditto for me as well. It's all about V (err, me).

Enjoy whatever you end up getting, RHG. It'll be a lovely bike no matter what.

[GLC1968]

Coming in a little late here, but the original poster sounds a lot like me only 2 years ago and I wanted to share my experience. I have had 3 bikes...all with triples. I live in a hilly area where I rarely get a nice long flat section, but where super long hills are not the norm either. For my first 2 years of ridng (I'm a recreational rider), I used my granny gear quite frequently and I was in good shape. Now, I'm even stronger, and 100% of my riding near my home does NOT require my granny gear and as such, it sits idle.

BUT, when I head just a few miles west, my terrain more closely resembles what you girls in No Cal ride....hills that take hours to climb, grades in the double digits, etc. You better believe that I'm happy to have my triple then! My road bike is 19 lbs for short club rides and it flies up hills. When I load up for long (60 miles +) rides in unsupported areas, it's closer to 30 lbs...and that granny gear is a damn blessing.

My husband recently went through a double/compact double/triple debate as he bought a new (used) bike that came with a double on it. He switched to a compact, and didn't like it. Then he switched to a triple and now rides like I do...using the 'double' part around here and only using that granny gear when we head west.

Yes, if you are racing and every ounce matters, who wants to be carrying around that extra gear "just in case"? But for those of us who can save more weight by losing it off our bodies than by having a lighter crank set, a triple is quite often the best choice. :)

[Veronica]

Every single person who rides the same hills RussianHillGal will be has many years' experience riding centuries (or longer) and recommended a triple. These aren't newbies lacking fitness making the recommendation.

But SK that doesn't matter.

sarcasm on You need to save that two grams or whatever a small chain ring weighs and the two seconds in shifting. And really only FREDS ride triples. How could we be encouraging a NEW rider to use a triple? Everyone will laugh and point as she spins her way up those 18% grades. Don't you know you're supposed to stand and have a cadence of less than 30 when you crest these big climbs? You've heard them laughing at us haven't you? sarcasm off

Actually I usually get the question, "Where did you get such a small chain ring?" And despite the smallness of my chain rings (48/36/24 with a 12x27 and 46/33 with an 11X34), oh maybe I'm not a REAL cyclist, those are tiny I still routinely get into the high 40s on descents and the twenties on the flat. Low to mid twenties, but still the twenties. Yes, MPH.

I fail to see how a triple will hamper RGH's progress in anyway. I think a standard compact double on the MOUNTAINS she wants to ride will make progress tough. Right Spazz? :p

V.

[spazzdog]

Yes Veronica... (and my memory suddenly floods with scenes from Archie comics).

I would bet (and put my stubborness aside for a moment) that had I lived here when I bought my bike, it would have had a triple.

I did have my stock double changed out to a compact after my Cinderella visit back in 2005, which DOES make things easier here than they would have been otherwise. But, it isn't easy... and I do have to work harder.

spass-hurts... er, I mean spazz

[Veronica]

spass-hurts... er, I mean spazz


Sorry, but this made my laugh. I hope you feel better soon!

V.

[SadieKate]

V? Could you, purty please, go back and correct the grammar in my post that you quoted? I must have corrected it after you grabbed it for the quote and I just can't let that live for eternity. :rolleyes: (every single person has . . . )

Thank you.

That laughing you hear? It's those of us with triples who ride Cobb Mountain, Coleman Valley, and Diablo past those with doubles walking or careening all over the road just prior to falling over. Bwahahahahahaha!

Not laughing at spazz and her oobie though.:o Did you do it with style? Did you earn points?

[Veronica]

Oh I know! I know! Get a Rohloff hub, then there's no overlap and you can shift when you're not moving. You never throw the chain, you don't have a front derailleur, no rear derailleur to break... It's the perfect solution!

V.

[spazzdog]

For style and points commentary, one will have to place an inquiry with Trek420... I think she saw the entire move.

And I've never walked up a hill... yet. As for Diablo, I've been there once - made it up about 6-7 miles then went down. I'll keep trying though, hopefully inching my way up as the season goes on.

The butt is best when standing at this point. Thankfully my work chair is an ergonomic wonder with a comfy butt cushion. The JEEP ride this morning was not as pleasant (ouch!)

spazz

[maillotpois]

V? Could you, purty please, go back and correct the grammar in my post that you quoted? I must have corrected it after you grabbed it for the quote and I just can't let that live for eternity. :rolleyes: (every single person has . . . )

Thank you.

OMG. That's just super funny.

(Resisting urge to insert all kinds of disgusting grammar violations in above-quoted language....)

[SadieKate]

Glad to provide you the entertainment.

It just slays me when someone quotes me before I correct my own mistakes. I guess it is my own special form of engrish.:o

Ah, I see Ms V took pity on my plea. :)

[spokewench]

V? Could you, purty please, go back and correct the grammar in my post that you quoted? I must have corrected it after you grabbed it for the quote and I just can't let that live for eternity. :rolleyes: (every single person has . . . )

Thank you.

That laughing you hear? It's those of us with triples who ride Cobb Mountain, Coleman Valley, and Diablo past those with doubles walking or careening all over the road just prior to falling over. Bwahahahahahaha!

Not laughing at spazz and her oobie though.:o Did you do it with style? Did you earn points?

Now, Now, let's not get carried away - I can ride Diablo including the top in my regular double and I don't even wobble! So, maybe, I'll be giggling as I pass you if I ever get out there to ride diablo again!

[SadieKate]

In the middle of a century? Then you would be one of those genetic freaks I mentioned because even the racers can be grunting and careening at the top.

[spokewench]

In the middle of a century? Then you would be one of those genetic freaks I mentioned because even the racers can be grunting and careening at the top.

Nope, just climb a lot

[RussianHillGal]

But for those of us who can save more weight by losing it off our bodies than by having a lighter crank set, a triple is quite often the best choice. :)


I love it! That's definitely me! :p

Veronica, DOUBLE centuries, wow, I can only dream!! Thanks for the gearing specs, now I know what to ask for on Saturday! :D

[jobob]

Wow, spokewench, you're really strong. I'm very impressed.

[Veronica]

Thanks for the gearing specs, now I know what to ask for on Saturday! :D

I don't know if you'll be able to get something that small with STI. I use friction shifters.


I have bad knees and am not a little person. :) With just under 21% body fat I weigh 152. But with that gearing, I have yet to meet a climb I can't do while seated. To be able to finish a double century I need to keep my HR down, which for me, means not standing on a long climb. I actually tend to stand on the flats for the butt break and the stretch.

Have fun shopping!

V.

[spokewench]

Wow, spokewench, you're really strong. I'm very impressed.

No, really just stubborn! I didn't mean to brag but was challenged by Sadie's post. Don't get me wrong, I do have to stand at the top of Diablo, I just don't wobble! I think it is stubborness and good balance! If all you've ever ridden with is a double on a road bike, you make do!

[RoadRaven]

Have fun shopping, RHG

Here are my specs too if you are interested.

On my road bike I have a compact... 50/34 in front and 27-12 (10 speeds) in back. I climb with relative ease on this bike.

On my TT bike I have an 'ordinary' double... 5053/39 on front and 26-12 (10 speeds) on back. This bike is a bit more of a grunt to climb on - but I usually ride flat courses on it.

Have fun shoppong - what ever you decide on we expect DETAILS!!! :D

[Veronica]

Now, Now, let's not get carried away - I can ride Diablo including the top in my regular double and I don't even wobble! So, maybe, I'll be giggling as I pass you if I ever get out there to ride diablo again!

Wow! That's great. You should sign up for the Devil Mountain Double then.

RHG hasn't been riding for twenty years like you have. I believe her post said she had not been on a bike for twenty years. So what works for a twenty year veteran is probably not best for a new rider.

What works for someone with short, sub two mile steep hills, is probably not appropriate for steep 10 - 15 mile hills either, especially not for a new rider.

Now in three months she may be coming back and saying, "Oh you were all wrong! The best way to climb a hill is on a Vespa!" :p

I look forward to seeing you on Tam RHG.

V.

[maillotpois]

So RHG - you are doing this with TNT? Or just under the "supervision" of a TNT coach friend? I ask because I know some of the coaches in the SF area, and was just wondering if we might have friends in common.

I'm one of the 2 head coaches (but the only one who matters :cool: because the other's my husband) for the Redwood Wine Country Death Ride team. I've been working with TNT since 1999.

I know RWC did the Marin metric as a training ride last year. Don't know if they're doing it again. I'll probably do the double, but as V mentioned, if you do the "Mt. Tam century" you'll ride basically the first half of the double course, which is very cool.

[Veronica]

Have fun shopping, RHG

Here are my specs too if you are interested.

On my road bike I have a compact... 50/34 in front and 27-12 (10 speeds) in back. I climb with relative ease on this bike.


I'm curious... how long are the rides you are doing on this? How long are the hills and how steep? I know you said you are 600 feet above sea level. But is it a mile to sea level, five or twenty?

I ask because if all your rides look like this... a double is perfectly fine. This is all short steep rollers and you can grunt your way over. But if you are doing terrain like the other profile I posted, back on page 1 I think... you're super strong and shouldn't be giving advice to new riders. :D

V.

[GLC1968]

RHG - I meant to include this in my earlier post...my triple is pretty standard. 52/42/30 in front and 12-27 in back. But point of note, I also have a 9-speed and new bikes now come with 10. :D

I've not ridden mine on a 15%+ grade yet, but it works great in the 8-12% range. I will be breaking that 15% threshold on May 5th though (at mile 85 :eek: ), so I'll let you know how it goes.

[SadieKate]

But if you are doing terrain like the other profile I posted, back on page 1 I think . . . And doing it in the middle of a 100 mile ride as the original poster stated.

[spokewench]

Wow! That's great. You should sign up for the Devil Mountain Double then.

Now in three months she may be coming back and saying, "Oh you were all wrong! The best way to climb a hill is on a Vespa!" :p


V.

Veronica: I'm not into doubles, but what is the Devil Mountain Double?

Maybe I could ride it on my boss's VESPA!

[aicabsolut]

I'm curious... how long are the rides you are doing on this? How long are the hills and how steep? I know you said you are 600 feet above sea level. But is it a mile to sea level, five or twenty?

I ask because if all your rides look like this... a double is perfectly fine. This is all short steep rollers and you can grunt your way over. But if you are doing terrain like the other profile I posted, back on page 1 I think... you're super strong and shouldn't be giving advice to new riders. :D

V.

That graph could totally be done with a compact double. I do stuff like that all the time with a 50/36 12-27. That graph isn't nearly as bad as the earlier one in that a lot of the hard hills are only around 200ft gains. I don't get out to that terrain as often as I'd like to do 65+ mile rides, but I can hang on for 50 just fine. With a 50/34, there'd be no problem at all. My cadence doesn't go below 60rpm on a hill.

[Eden]

I did this one last year. It is one of the harder days of racing (at least available to people at my low cat) you'll find in this area - caveats abound - this is a race and most of the people who choose this race climb well.

My gearing for this race was a standard 39/53 on the front, largest on back 27. I was very tired at the end of this race, but never wobbled or fell over. I'm not going to suggest that everyone go out and buy a standard double right off the bat. Nor will I suggest that everyone would be happy with one in the long term. Just do your homework and see what kind of rider you think you will be. Of course its hard to even know until you go out and do it.

I did go the route of buying a triple on the first bike I bought in about 15 years in 2005, and then discovered racing - so I did end up replacing that bike in only a year. Coming off of my 90's vintange Trek I would have laughed out loud if you suggested that I wouldn't need a triple so it really seemed like the right thing to do. New lighter frames and the fact that I could actually buy a small enough bike made a difference I could never have imagined. Honestly I don't know if I had a compact double in the first place if I would have kept that bike or not, but swapping the triple would have been more exensive than I could have justified for that frame.

[teigyr]

Veronica,

Those look like the Aids Ride terrain charts. If so, I did it on a double but had a larger cassette in back. Also, I was in shape back then.

Everyone has far more experience than me so I'm trying to stay out. That being said, I have a compact double. I love it, it shifts better than DH's triple (and I've never lost a chain) but it does have its limitations. I'm thinking about putting a larger cassette on the back because I have a 12-25 as of now. If someone is out of shape, even a compact double will be a challenge sometimes. So...I'm not regretting the compact double whatsoever but I can see why people would ride a triple.

bowing out now :)

[Veronica]

http://www.caltriplecrown.com/images/DMProfileS.jpg
This is the elevation for the Devil Mountain Double. To the top of Mt. Hamilton is 13,000 feet of elevation gain. There is another 7,000 between Hamilton and the end.

By themselves, these are all hard climbs. Diablo, I think, is actually one of the easier ones. The backside of Hamilton averages out to 8 or 9%. Sierra Rd's average is around 10%. Those sections where it flattens out to 5 or 6% are a welcome relief.

http://www.caltriplecrown.com/images/MtTamElevation.jpg

This is the chart for the Mt. Tam Double. RHG plans on doing the first 100 miles I believe. On this ride I think the worst climb is after the Santos Meadow Rest Stop. It's a very steep climb up Rte. 1. It's short and if you had not already climbed Tam, wouldn't be bad. If you didn't have 50 more miles to go (or in my case 150!) I'm sure it could be done on a standard double.



V.

[Veronica]

That graph could totally be done with a compact double. I do stuff like that all the time with a 50/36 12-27. That graph isn't nearly as bad as the earlier one in that a lot of the hard hills are only around 200ft gains. I don't get out to that terrain as often as I'd like to do 65+ mile rides, but I can hang on for 50 just fine. With a 50/34, there'd be no problem at all. My cadence doesn't go below 60rpm on a hill.

Ahhh... that's my point. The second graph is rollers, not our typical terrain. That ride was 90 minutes away from me, probably two hours away for RHG. And she plans 100 miles.

V.

[SadieKate]

All I know is I try not to make gearing recommendations for areas in which I don't live or ride. I look at the gearing used by riders that I think are my peers ability-wise (not racers, not genetic freaks, etc.) even if they are in better shape. That tells me what gear range I need to consider and then I determine what components are necessary to provide that range. And a widely spaced cassette just so you can run a double absolutely sucks on flat terrain.

If you're racing, you have a whole different rationale for choosing components.

And if you only ride 50-60 miles distance at most, I don't think you can understand what gears one may need at mile 99.

[spokewench]

http://www.caltriplecrown.com/images/DMProfileS.jpg
This is the elevation for the Devil Mountain Double. To the top of Mt. Hamilton is 13,000 feet of elevation gain. There is another 7,000 between Hamilton and the end.

By themselves, these are all hard climbs. Diablo, I think, is actually one of the easier ones. The backside of Hamilton averages out to 8 or 9%. Sierra Rd's average is around 10%. Those sections where it flattens out to 5 or 6% are a welcome relief.


V.

Wow, those are really hard rides for 200 miles. I've ridden all those climbs on the Devil Mountain Double and some of them are pretty hard! I agree with you, Diablo is probably one of the easier ones, it never gets hard except right at the top.

I'm not a long distance rider though. 100 or so mies is enough for me and I call it quits. Don't like to be on the bike that long.

[RussianHillGal]

I was on the TNT xc ski team (Winter 06-07) & just signed up for the TNT Nike Women's team. So yes, I’m just being “supervised” for the cycling (I don’t think I could fundraise for 3 events in one year). I'm so looking forward to Saturday!!:D

[Chile Pepper]

Great discussion. What an eye-opener! I'm riding with a 42/52 chainring and a 13/26 cassette (seven cogs) (friction shifting). I haven't fallen over yet, but it sounds like it's just a matter of time. I see an upgrade in my future....

[SadieKate]

I don't know if you'll be able to get something that small with STI. I use friction shifters.
V.Sure you can. It is a function of the curve of the front derailleur matching the size of the rings and then the tooth differential between the large and small. With Campy I can have a 24 tooth differential (26 inner and 50 outer on the Litespeed, 26 to 48 on the Kelly, 28-52 on the Mercian). I think Shimano is about the same but the spec's would say.

[Veronica]

I've never researched what can be down with STI or Campy. Hate to give advice on something I know very little about. :) You're the gear guru SK. I was hoping you'd say if it could be done.

V.

[SadieKate]

It's my way of maximizing my potential. Ask MP how she achieved that 28 inner chain ring. I may not be able to keep up with her on the road but I can do better maths.:D

[aicabsolut]

Ahhh... that's my point. The second graph is rollers, not our typical terrain. That ride was 90 minutes away from me, probably two hours away for RHG. And she plans 100 miles.

V.

Gotcha.


As for the 100 miles part, if I kept training for it instead of training for short road races and crits, I would still keep my compact for the rolling terrain. I can hit a hill at mile 50 and feel better than I used to on a hill at mile 20. With the right training and enough calories, that shouldn't be the big factor. For me, climbing 1000 feet at a time, as opposed to a couple hundred, would be the deciding element.

[SadieKate]

Exactly! The ride on Saturday was roller after roller after roller. I used my granny for two short sections that were longer because the granny was there but I probably could have made it fine without it (a low of 40x28), but change that to a climb up Mt. Tam? Oh no, I love that little ring. Gives me lots of options for changing up my cadence.

[7rider]

Wow.
Has this poor thread fallen into a phallic display of "My hill is bigger than your hill"!
Yipe-ers.
I seem to recall the original discussion being about "compact" or "triple" on a bike that already came with a compact.
Buy that bike, and end of discussion.
So, I think the better question is: is it worth it to convert that bike to a triple? What would be gained?
The discussion here is all about low-end gearing - a fair discussion when you're talking about a new rider who lives in an area where there are hills. Or mountains. The top end is almost irrelevant.
So....that's why I said. Look at the charts. Look at what your low end is for THAT bike (it was a Giant, yes?). How is that bike geared? Has anyone even discussed it?? Is it more cost effective for a purchaser - who really loves THAT bike - to swap out a crankset (and f. derailleur and shifter) and go with a triple. Or, is it better to put a bigger cassette on the back, say a 12-27? From the look of the chart I posted, a 32-25 combination of a triple would be nearly spot-on with a 34-27 on a compact. So you've lost nothing.
If you want a 32-27 on a triple, or gearing even lower than that, well, maybe it's not worth it to buy THAT bike, and RHG should be looking at another bike.

[Veronica]

Wow.
Has this poor thread fallen into a phallic display of "My hill is bigger than your hill"!



No, not at all. Those are the climbs the original poster will ride. The hill profile was an attempt to show why those of us who ride those hills regularly gave her the advice of get the triple.

RGH if you'd like any more info from me, feel free to shoot me a PM.

V.

[spazzdog]

All you billy goats wit da pit-churs... be so kind as to copy them into the newly created Elevation thread.


purty pleez wit "name-that-guilty-pleasure" on top :o

spazz-tic

[maillotpois]

It's my way of maximizing my potential. Ask MP how she achieved that 28 inner chain ring. I may not be able to keep up with her on the road but I can do better maths.:D

That has been working well, BTW. (Don't want to jinx it before the 400k, but it passed the 300k with flying colors). For those who care, my Colnago/brevet bike was only 9 speed with a 26 tooth cog, and I really wanted something cushier, because in the 600k I did last year (on my Merckx with a 10 speed 28 tooth cog) I found myself in the small ring on the FLATS. (I know, I know, but seriously, ride 375 miles in 30 hours and then see how wimpy it really was.) Anyway, SK suggested throwing on a 28 tooth inner ring and a 12-28 cassette. I was worried about the 28/42/52 combo, but it is working great.

Again, no jinxing here before the 400 people!!

[SadieKate]

Cool. You be the bungee cord and I'll do the gear inches anytime.

[maillotpois]

Whew. Sometimes I have flashes of math brilliance, but not often.

I think perhapd a dry French rose is in order.

[RoadRaven]

I'm curious... how long are the rides you are doing on this? How long are the hills and how steep? I know you said you are 600 feet above sea level. But is it a mile to sea level, five or twenty?

I ask because if all your rides look like this... a double is perfectly fine. This is all short steep rollers and you can grunt your way over. But if you are doing terrain like the other profile I posted, back on page 1 I think... you're super strong and shouldn't be giving advice to new riders. :D

V.


My rides are not centuries, that is true... though I have completed hilly centuries on my double. My training rides do mostly tend to be 20-50km long, my road racing about 30km, my time trial races 20-25km.

Sea level to my house is about 6km, with two 5-700metre climbs of about 10-11% gradient.

I guess I am not trying to give advice, but rather my opinion. I know if I had knee trouble I would probably shift to a triple if it had better gearing than my EMC (50/34 front and 27-12 on back)... and i tend to agree with Regina re whether a triple will be a real adavntage over what a well set-up double can give. I sometimes wonder if a triple is a mental adavntage to conquering hills, and I will be the first to admit any mental adavntage is never to be under-estimated.

I am also the first to admit that I have no desire to do regular centuries - metric or imperial, let alone doubles that climb mountains. I cannot advise or give my opinion on the best way to get to the finish line. I remain continually in awe of the women here who not only complete such rides, but then choose to do them again!

However, I do also look at what the cyclists in the races I love to watch use, and although I will never be elite, I figure that if they can climb, or TT, or do crits on whatever the gearing is they have - then in all likelihood I can too - only much much more slowly :p

I apologise if my opinion caused offence, however, I do think a new rider should go into a bike shop or into a race with a variety of ideas to think about and choose from. That was all I was trying to provide. A different viewpoint.

[crazycanuck]

eek: That elevation :eek:

Crazy-will stick with the oh nowhere near comparable Perth hills-Canuck[/SIZE]

I bow down to you California ladies. I didn't know California was so moutainous!

C

[Trekhawk]

Exactly! The ride on Saturday was roller after roller after roller. I used my granny for two short sections that were longer because the granny was there but I probably could have made it fine without it (a low of 40x28), but change that to a climb up Mt. Tam? Oh no, I love that little ring. Gives me lots of options for changing up my cadence.

Im still re-living the fact that I actually passed some people on those two short sections and yes I was in my granny.

Trekhawk who wouldn't be without her triple here in Northern California.:)

[Kano]

I'm fairly new, compared to the amazing women I bow to here, but there are hills all around us in Boise, and while I don't exactly head for them yet, my immediate response to the IDEA of a bicycle last spring was "better have plenty of granny gearing for the hills" and when we looked at road bikes for me this year, I flat out refused to consider the one that didn't have a triple, even though it rode beautifully! DH frowned a bit cuz it was going to cost more, but he rides with me, and knows -- I'll use all those gears! (so far, I've just played to make sure they work! we haven't been to "my" hill yet with the new bike -- he hasn't been at all yet this year)

Karen in Boise, who wishes the wind would go away!

[Aggie_Ama]

I have been staying out of this because I think the locals give the best advice. BUT I will say as a triple rider the confidence factor is a biggie. In Texas we have a lot of just nasty steep hills. Nothing like these mountains, but I will find that I am in my smallest gear. Even when I was very strong last year I still needed the granny on occasion, but I haven't met a hill in Texas I couldn't climb. When I shopped for my new bike I just didn't have the confidence for a new shifting system AND a compact double. Some of it is physical, some of it is mental. But my bike makes me happy and that is that.

Aggie_Very Proud FRED with a Triple on Carbon_Ama:D

[Ogresse]

Hi Regina,

I am about to inherit 2 great used 2006 bikes (long story with very happy ending, obviously!) in impeccable condition, one of which is a full Dura Ace carbon bike with 53/39 and the other an aluminum bike (w/carbon forks and stays) with Ultegra cassette, Dura Ace triple cranks, D.A. shifters and derailleurs (front is even a "D.A. triple derailleur"). On my old (old) bike I have an FSA Gossamer Mega-Exo 50-34 compact, which I love, love, love. I am in a really hilly area and to get into condition with the 53/39 was super tough. Now that I'm riding well, the 50-34 suits me just fine. I see no shame in triples at all (take care of your knees and enjoy your rides more my dears!!), I just don't want to deal with all the extra clicking around. A compact with a bigger spread in back has worked just fine for me and I enjoy the challenge.

Anyway, I wonder if you or someone else can advise me on this question: I want to replace the D.A. 53/39 on the carbon bike with a compact. Though I have this FSA compact on the old bike that I could use, I've heard that it is better to stick with Shimano when everything else is Shimano (and it is, even wheels and seatpost!), and have heard great things about the Shimano compact (and can even get it with 165mm cranks!). Question: if I get a Shimano compact, would it require just changing out the 53/39 and cranks or do I need to change shifters, derailleurs, or anything else (BB?)? I believe it is all compatible but since I want to do the work myself, I want to be really sure... (yes, my secret dream is to be a wench wrench). I am also not sure what, if anything, needs to happen re: bottom bracket. The 53/39 crankset is Shimano D.A. w/Integrated spindle, with Shimano Exterior Bearing System (and D.A. everything else). Another option would be to move the FSA over to the carbon D.A. bike - cheaper! - but I like the idea of sticking to all Shimano.

Which leads me to the second question...I would like to move the FSA compact from my old bike to the new aluminum-carbon bike with the D.A. triple. Here we go again -- what needs to change in shifters/brakes, etc. in order for everything to work smoothly?

Thanks so much for any advice you can offer! I really appreciate it.

- O :)


I had a triple on my bike for 5 years. I recently rebuilt the bike and put a compact (50/34) on it. The bike lost a lot of weight in the process (the rebuild shaved over 2 pounds off the bike - not insignificant when it was already just a 20 pound bike.) and the drivetrain is much less complicated. Although I opted to keep a 12-25 spread in the back, you can play with the cassette to an extent and not lose any of the low-end gearing you would get with a triple.
Frankly, I'd rather haul a lighter bike with slightly less low-end gearing up a hill, than a heavier bike up a hill with a granny. But that's me. If you are reasonably fit, and the hills are moderate in your area, I think a compact crank should be fine. Have them put a 12-27 on the back, and you'll never miss the gearing over a triple.
My $0.02.

[7rider]

[QUOTE=Ogresse;189226]Hi Regina,

Question: if I get a Shimano compact, would it require just changing out the 53/39 and cranks or do I need to change shifters, derailleurs, or anything else (BB?)? I believe it is all compatible but since I want to do the work myself, I want to be really sure... (yes, my secret dream is to be a wench wrench). I am also not sure what, if anything, needs to happen re: bottom bracket. The 53/39 crankset is Shimano D.A. w/Integrated spindle, with Shimano Exterior Bearing System (and D.A. everything else). Another option would be to move the FSA over to the carbon D.A. bike - cheaper! - but I like the idea of sticking to all Shimano.

Which leads me to the second question...I would like to move the FSA compact from my old bike to the new aluminum-carbon bike with the D.A. triple. Here we go again -- what needs to change in shifters/brakes, etc. in order for everything to work smoothly?
QUOTE]

Hi there.
My bike (a '99 Seven Axiom Ti) had full Ultegra 9-spd triple on it.
I rebuilt it with D.A. everything - EXCEPT the crankset which is an FSA SLK MegaExo compact (50-34). Going from a triple to a double required a new f.d. and shifter to handle it. It is generally required to get a compact-specific f.d. - one that can handle the big jump from 34 (or 36) to 50 teeth.
Since I also went from a 9-spd to a 10-spd, I got a new r.d. and shifter for the rear. The Shimano compact wasn't out yet when I rebuilt the Seven (October '05) - but was due at any moment. I just didn't want to wait! I have had no problems with compatibility. I did have the LBS put an "anti-chain-suck-thang" - or whatever they're called - on the downtube. No problems with chain suck, although if I'm not careful, I can throw the chain off the outter ring onto the crankarms with shift-ups. That's a user error and I need to watch where I am on the cassette when I make my shift.
Since I went to a MegaExo crankset, the BB came with it, so it was not an option to replace the Shimano BB (which was dead, anyway, and needed to be replaced).
So...in summary: I have a mix of FSA and Shimano parts and I've had no compatibility issues. Everything on the bike works fine. It's the rider who has the difficulty! :p

[RoadRaven]

Anyway, I wonder if you or someone else can advise me on this question: I want to replace the D.A. 53/39 on the carbon bike with a compact.

All I can say is I have a 53/39 on my TT bike and it is great. I can climb hills on it, I can wind up into a big gear on the flat.

On my road race bike I have a 50/34 compact... I climb hills more quickly on that because I spin and not grind so much (I'm a slow climber still). My only issue with it is trying to find the right gear when I am in the middle at the front and back...

They are both fab gearing. The compact would not be a good TT set-up for me, but it is ideal for road racing.

Dunno if that helps any, but thats my experience.

[SadieKate]

Ogresse, go to the manufacturers' websites and download all the tech support manuals for each and every component. This is the surest way to determine compatibility between bottom brackets, cranksets and front derailleurs.

A mechanic friend of mine told me just last week that he thinks both Shimano and Campy chainrings shift more cleanly, but since you own the FSA you may want to stick with it, especially if it is compatible with your current bottom bracket.

I don't know specifics, but you may want to do a little research on front derailleurs for compacts. Both the smaller curve of the chain ring and the larger jump are a challenge for many double front derailleurs so you may want to do some careful research.

Basically the best info is the manufacturers' websites that give the technical nitty-gritty.

[SadieKate]

I've heard that it is better to stick with Shimano when everything else is Shimano (and it is, even wheels and seatpost!), What? This is bogus marketing @#$%.

[Ogresse]

What? This is bogus marketing @#$%.

;) I have just never seen a bike with every single part Shimano...but what do I know? I guess I am easily impressed.