Creepiness? Or just friendly?

[teigyr]

I don't know if anyone else is like this but I get a bit strange about people following me too closely when I'm on my bike. If I know the person, that's one thing. If it's a stranger on the bike trail, it makes me a bit skittish. I'm not thinking that they are going to bash me over the head or anything but I worry about staying over completely (are they going to pass?) or slowing with someone behind me.

Yesterday, we passed a cyclist who we shouldn't have passed. I have a strict rule never to pass unless I can sustain the effort and stay ahead! DH doesn't abide by that rule. I was already worn out from an earlier workout and had to drop back a bit. The cyclist who we passed caught up to me and stayed alongside the latter third of my bike, he was next to me but near my rear wheel. DH finally slowed down enough and I sped ahead to say "hey, let's slow WAY down" because I couldn't get rid of this guy. We slowed down to 13, 12, 10, 9 mph then I finally stopped pedaling. The guy passed us.

We saw him later on the trail stopped to use the restroom. Later on in the ride he came back on my wheel and stayed there. DH was way ahead. I did the same thing until I stopped pedaling to make him go away. As he passed, he said "so, you're doing intervals today?" I said "kind of" but I wanted to say "no, I want you away because you're creepy." When the guy passed my husband, the guy didn't say anything to him.

I'm not so sure what the bike trail etiquette is and I know I've been guilty of seeing someone in the distance and catching up to them and then not being able to pass. I usually try to say something just so they don't think some strange person is hanging on their wheel. I also don't follow closely because it's rude! What are the general feelings on this? Am I just being paranoid or is it strange that someone would just hang there even when I slowed up substantially?

As the fates would have it, the guy was parked in the same parking lot as us. Even my husband said there was something not right about the guy, don't know what it was though.

[Dianyla]

It's true that this guy's behavior could be interpreted in two different ways, and both are completely plausible scenarios. Maybe it's just a complete coincidence that you kept crossing paths. Or maybe this guy is serious trouble... Either scenario is completely possible.

I would trust my gut instinct all the way on this one. An interesting book you may find interesting is The Gift of Fear (http://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/0747538352/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-9916890-9030357?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1175635334&sr=8-1), by Gavin de Becker. He explores fear in-depth and talks about how our instincts alert us to trouble and why we should listen to them. I can't recommend this book enough.

[Wahine]

I agree, it could be a complete coincidence.

But when I read your post, I thought creepy.

[lauraelmore1033]

I've had that happen on the Sammamish river trail. Well, not exactly that, but I'll look back and some ghosty guy has crept up behind me and is cruising along just behind my back wheel--drafting, I guess. It's not like I'm any speed demon, so it seems super creepy (I'm usually alone). What's he doing THAT for? I usually slow down to the point it becomes clear that I don't want him there, and then he speeds off and disappears in the distance. There's another guy on the same trail who seems to be the bicycle police. I've caught him skulking behind me at least twice and each time he's sped up alongside to aprise me of some issue my bike is having that I was well aware of before he too speeds off and disappears in the distance. Maybe there are just a lot of well meaning guys out there who are unaware of the concept of "personal space" and that it might also extend beyond one's bike. Or maybe they really are creepy. I donno.

[teigyr]

It happened on the Sammamish River Trail!!! This was an older guy with a short white beard. I'd say that it is coincidence that he was on the trail at the same time, of course, but why stay behind someone who obviously keeps checking over her shoulder out of concern? Especially when I slowed down to WAY slow, why not just go around? Especially if they CAN speed off and go away? And to have it happen twice? I can see catching up to me the 2nd time but why play the same game as before?

I haven't see the bike police person but if I do, I'll be sure to laugh at him. Problems with my bike are the least of my issues right now!

Dianyla, I put the book down in my Amazon list. It looks very interesting and has stellar reviews. I hate to be ultra-paranoid but there's something to be said for trusting instincts.

I try to rationalize the whole thing. Maybe because women are more "at risk" than men, we are more sensitive to someone being too close to us? I don't think men would get the same reaction from having a guy stay on their back wheel. The way I see it is I can be a spazz when I ride. I unclip around corners, I slow over bridges, I am a hazard :D Therefore, I try to be very aware of who's behind me. That and, of course, I would prefer not to be bashed over the head.

[Dianyla]

Dianyla, I put the book down in my Amazon list. It looks very interesting and has stellar reviews. I hate to be ultra-paranoid but there's something to be said for trusting instincts.

I try to rationalize the whole thing. Maybe because women are more "at risk" than men, we are more sensitive to someone being too close to us?
As much as I try to maintain a gender-balanced view of life in general, the fact is that a very large percentage of violent crimes are committed by men against women. Women are more perceptive of risk because more risk exists. So many times I've tried to talk myself out of feeling threatened by a situation, telling myself "I'm sure it's nothing" or "I'm sure he's just trying to be nice". But now I know it's better to listen to that gut feeling and use it to motivate you to change the situation somehow.

One thing that you could say to a guy like this is to just bluntly tell him to stop drafting your wheel. This approach gives him the benefit of the doubt that his real intention was merely to draft behind you so you aren't being completely insulting. And even if it is a little rude, it's better to be rude to someone who's pushing your creep button than to end up raped or dead. :(

[spokewench]

As much as I try to maintain a gender-balanced view of life in general, the fact is that a very large percentage of violent crimes are committed by men against women. Women are more perceptive of risk because more risk exists. So many times I've tried to talk myself out of feeling threatened by a situation, telling myself "I'm sure it's nothing" or "I'm sure he's just trying to be nice". But now I know it's better to listen to that gut feeling and use it to motivate you to change the situation somehow.

One thing that you could say to a guy like this is to just bluntly tell him to stop drafting your wheel. This approach gives him the benefit of the doubt that his real intention was merely to draft behind you so you aren't being completely insulting. And even if it is a little rude, it's better to be rude to someone who's pushing your creep button than to end up raped or dead. :(


One of the tips that are given to women is this. Most rapists or attackers will not attack a woman that looks like or acts like she will fight or make noise or whatever. I believe in this and if someone was making me uncomfortable on my wheel, I would look them in the eye as I was riding along and tell them to go ride by themselves that I do not want company.

[madisongrrl]

This happens quite a bit to me and it's usually not a problem because I haven't run into too many weirdos. I think strange people will sit on your wheel because they are tired and they simply want a pull. Or sometimes, they just want chat with other cyclists. And sometimes people are just plain creepy and are trying to pester you. It's a good thing you had your hubby along.

If it were my situation and I didn't want some weird stranger on my wheel, I'd just slow down and tell him to go around ...and I'd say it with such a tone that I didn't come off like a b!tch, but that I made it clear that I don't want to chat and that the only option is to go around me. And I also might be ready to grab my pepper spray if I thought it was warrented.

Also, I think that many men don't understand about personal space....whether it is drafting off your wheel or walking too close to you on the sidewalk etc.

[lauraelmore1033]

It happened on the Sammamish River Trail!!! This was an older guy with a short white beard. I'd say that it is coincidence that he was on the trail at the same time, of course, but why stay behind someone who obviously keeps checking over her shoulder out of concern? Especially when I slowed down to WAY slow, why not just go around? Especially if they CAN speed off and go away? And to have it happen twice? I can see catching up to me the 2nd time but why play the same game as before?

I haven't see the bike police person but if I do, I'll be sure to laugh at him. Problems with my bike are the least of my issues right now!

Dianyla, I put the book down in my Amazon list. It looks very interesting and has stellar reviews. I hate to be ultra-paranoid but there's something to be said for trusting instincts.

I try to rationalize the whole thing. Maybe because women are more "at risk" than men, we are more sensitive to someone being too close to us? I don't think men would get the same reaction from having a guy stay on their back wheel. The way I see it is I can be a spazz when I ride. I unclip around corners, I slow over bridges, I am a hazard :D Therefore, I try to be very aware of who's behind me. That and, of course, I would prefer not to be bashed over the head.

That sounds like the bike police guy!!!

[pooks]

Did he realize you were with your husband? That's doubly-odd, if he was behaving that way with your husband right there.

[Aint Doody]

I think I have to vote for CREEPY. Where are his manners if he's friendly?

[Triskeliongirl]

I think it is very important to follow your gut. If this guy made you feel uncomfortable, then maybe there was a good reason. I have been followed on my road bike by creepy men in cars. When it happens, I stop, text message the license plate number to my son with a just in case, look them straight in the eye, and inform them that I have just reported them to the police, and that they need to back off. I don't mountain bike so I am not sure the best equivalent thing to do, but obviously phoning either home or the park police are good options.

[wannaduacentury]

I don't know if anyone else is like this but I get a bit strange about people following me too closely when I'm on my bike. If I know the person, that's one thing. If it's a stranger on the bike trail, it makes me a bit skittish. I'm not thinking that they are going to bash me over the head or anything but I worry about staying over completely (are they going to pass?) or slowing with someone behind me.

Yesterday, we passed a cyclist who we shouldn't have passed. I have a strict rule never to pass unless I can sustain the effort and stay ahead! DH doesn't abide by that rule. I was already worn out from an earlier workout and had to drop back a bit. The cyclist who we passed caught up to me and stayed alongside the latter third of my bike, he was next to me but near my rear wheel. DH finally slowed down enough and I sped ahead to say "hey, let's slow WAY down" because I couldn't get rid of this guy. We slowed down to 13, 12, 10, 9 mph then I finally stopped pedaling. The guy passed us.

We saw him later on the trail stopped to use the restroom. Later on in the ride he came back on my wheel and stayed there. DH was way ahead. I did the same thing until I stopped pedaling to make him go away. As he passed, he said "so, you're doing intervals today?" I said "kind of" but I wanted to say "no, I want you away because you're creepy." When the guy passed my husband, the guy didn't say anything to him.

I'm not so sure what the bike trail etiquette is and I know I've been guilty of seeing someone in the distance and catching up to them and then not being able to pass. I usually try to say something just so they don't think some strange person is hanging on their wheel. I also don't follow closely because it's rude! What are the general feelings on this? Am I just being paranoid or is it strange that someone would just hang there even when I slowed up substantially?

As the fates would have it, the guy was parked in the same parking lot as us. Even my husband said there was something not right about the guy, don't know what it was though.

I'd say he's weird. I mean your dh wasn't far from you and he stayed tacked to your wheel-how rude is that? I err to the side of caution to just stay away from folks like him. and your dh maybe needs to stick to your wheel instead to send a message. I hope you never see this weirdo again. Jennifer

[lizbids]

I have to be honest, I wouldn't ignore a gut-feeling. I was walking back from the subway one night (9pm-ish), and this one man was literally coming up behind me and not walking around me, so finally I turned sharply on my heel and looked at him as if to say, "Back the f**k up, buddy." And he acted insulted. He actually said, "You don't have to be so worried; not all guys are out to hurt you." So I walked on and called over my shoulder, "But you're not a woman, are you?" Like I was supposed to soothe his ego! He got the point.
I'd rather make Mr. Creepy fake hurt feelings (or even have hurt feelings!) than be sorry for being "nice," which I think a lot of predators rely on. I'd rather be a cold-hearted b**ch and preserve my health, body and mind...and do you really care if a stranger thinks you're "mean"? Trust yourself...the world tells women all the time not to, and I think that's a shame. :mad:

[wannaduacentury]

I have to be honest, I wouldn't ignore a gut-feeling. I was walking back from the subway one night (9pm-ish), and this one man was literally coming up behind me and not walking around me, so finally I turned sharply on my heel and looked at him as if to say, "Back the f**k up, buddy." And he acted insulted. He actually said, "You don't have to be so worried; not all guys are out to hurt you." So I walked on and called over my shoulder, "But you're not a woman, are you?" Like I was supposed to soothe his ego! He got the point.
I'd rather make Mr. Creepy fake hurt feelings (or even have hurt feelings!) than be sorry for being "nice," which I think a lot of predators rely on. I'd rather be a cold-hearted b**ch and preserve my health, body and mind...and do you really care if a stranger thinks you're "mean"? Trust yourself...the world tells women all the time not to, and I think that's a shame. :mad:

You are so right. I've heard that decent men getting chewed out(didn't mean to show any harm toward a woman, but got in her personal space theory) by women taking care of themselves rather suffer the punishment and tell it later hoping that their own moms, sister's, wives, even daughters would do the same in a given situation. And I wouldn't worry about their feelings. a self defense course is an excellent idea too.

[Kimmyt]

I ride on the trail alot by myself, since my schedule never seems to match up with the group I used to ride with. Therefore, I always run into 'creepy guys'.

Usually, though, I can tell that they're not really creepy, that it's just my overactive imagination putting me in faux dangerous situations.

Sometimes I may really have a cause for worry. The homeless-looking people that stumble along the trail scare me, sometimes, because I don't know what they may do. So do the groups of kids that hang around and play basketball by the trail. Last year I heard of a cyclist who got mugged by a group of high school kids.

Sometimes people are just weird, and I know I'm being defensive by getting creeped out or angry at them, but I am very sensitive to personal space.

The other day I was on the trail and I came up on a guy riding a pleasure bike. He was not going very fast, so I passed him. He cocked his head as I approached, though, and I think he must have heard me about to pass him, and suddenly he sped up. That sucker was going fast! I had to really gun it to get around him, thinking that he wouldn't be able to hang long at that speed, but when I got in front of him he sucked onto my back tire.

It got me angry. 1) Because I had no idea who he was, and how well he knew how to handle a bike while he was inches from my tire and 2) I didn't know if he was doing it for some other reason. I slowed down, and he tried to talk to me, but I didn't say a word. He was in my space. I slowed down alot and let him get away from me, but when I continued my ride I ended up coming up on him again. The same thing happened this time! Finally I stopped riding all together, got off my bike, and watched him teeter off into the distance.

The thing is, I wouldn't have passed him if I thought he would speed up. I usually only pass people who i know I will drop quickly, because I hate to play leapfrog. I am perfectly fine with slowing down so that someone has more personal space, because I know how I appreciate mine.

But it was like this guy had no clue. Plus, I think his sudden bursts of speed were really just meant to impress me or something, although i could have cared less and instead ended up wanting to punch him in the face.

Anyway, the point of the rambling is, yes I have been in your situation before, and yes it upsets me. i don't like anyone on my tail unless I know them or they have asked to be there. My boyfriend doesn't feel at all the same, we've talked about it before, but I won't give in (neither will he). He doesn't care if a stranger drafts, but I hate the idea of anyone I don't know that close to me.

It could very well be gender-related, but it's probably more of a personality thing.

[Grog]

Quite creepy. Lots of cyclists on the road here, and once in a while I end up drafting off someone, or the other way around. Don't mind the chat. However I've had one creepy event (just a gut feeling) and told the guy I didn't want anyone drafting off me.

I suggest doing the same thing, telling the guy to either drop back or pass you, you're not wanting anyone on your wheel.

There's always snot rockets, also.

I like to imagine that a guy with bad intentions wouldn't find a likely victim in a woman who performs good snot rockets... !!!

[KnottedYet]

I've run into creepy white-bearded bike guy on the Burke Gilman Trail, so he obviously uses the whole of Sammamish and Burke.

His MO seems to be hanging on a woman's wheel until she stops her bike. Then he tries to chat or just hangs around until she starts riding again. (I could NOT get rid of him until I caught up with my group and made them all stop so he went by.)

He is creepy.

Next time I see him I'll yell at him not to draft and to go around.

[lauraelmore1033]

gotta learn how ta make me some of them snot rockets. Priceless suggestion!:D

[Grog]

Maybe next time someone has a "chat" with the guy, it would be worth mentioning that many women have reported having trouble with him and that if he doesn't stop being annoying he's going to be reported to the authorities?

Can't help fantasize imagining the "conversation":
"Nice weather hey?
- Do you know that there's a lot of women in town who are really tired of having you suck their wheel?
- Uh..?
- If you don't leave me alone right now I'll have to report your behaviour."
[Creepy Bearded Man rides away.]

Obviously I'd make sure I strike conversation in a populated area.

And I would be tempted to drop an email to the trail authorities, if I was in Seattle...

[teigyr]

you know, I think this is the guy. We've (my DH and I) have been talking about it and it sounds like the same person. He did what he did to me but when he passed my husband, he passed quickly and said nothing. I had to pretty much stop (as knottedyet did) to make him Go Away.

I think all the advice you gave is wonderful. I should've been more assertive instead of passive-aggressive (ie just willing him to go away instead of saying it). My DH did ride ahead but that's ok. He's new to his bike and cycling and I would like him to learn his limitations and when you want to sprint, heck, it's fun! I was sore and tired and was simply not riding well. We did decide after this to each carry a cell phone instead of just one of us for those "just in case" situations.

I wonder if this guy's just lonely? I know when I pass people I try to say things like "hi" or compliment them on their bike or something. I still don't like it when people stay too close. I kind of started riding with the assumption that drafting is an invasion that you don't do without permission. I am also very aware about my personal space and like to keep a pretty good buffer between me and other people.

I will say this guy, while not being the fastest rider, seemed to vary his speed as it suited him. I think I had the gears to outride him but I didn't have the conditioning or the strength at the time.

While I like to think we're all equal in gender, I think men sometimes have less to worry about than we do. Even if it's just random scamming on the womenfolk, it's not appreciated and it's somewhat invasive. If the person wants to talk to us, why not just pass by, say hi, and let it go?

We did decide, also, that if/when we see this guy again, my DH will ride right behind me. Let the games begin! (DH saw the situation as when the cats play power games...hereby known as Kitty Games.)

[teigyr]

Got to practice the snot rockets! Normally I try to discreetly and demurely do it into my glove. I think, however, he is well deserving!

[Tuckervill]

I think he was enjoying the "view", which puts him high on the creep-o-meter.

My natural reaction would be to look back after I first noticed him and say, "How ya doin?", in a measured not-too-friendly tone, and then judge my gut based on his response. Then I'd stop where there were people around, and not engage him anymore, or take the first exit off the trail and head towards civilization or a crowded place. Of course, with hubby there (he's never in front of me, but if he was) I'd do my famous ear splitting whistle and hubby would be right by my side.

The bicycle cop guy would p*** me off, because 'hey, duckhead, I can HEAR my bottom bracket clicking, too! What do you think, that it doesn't drive me nuts with every pedal stroke, especially since I can't seem to figure out what it is?! What do you think I am, an imbecile?" :(

Karen

[VeloVT]

I agree with everyone that you should trust your gut about creepy situations. I also probably tend to be a bit over-reactive about perceiving creepiness in strange men though...

I do have a question about this "riding behind a stranger" issue though --

I was riding the other day with a girl from one of my classes. She was struggling along on a mountain bike with underinflated tires... working really hard. After accidentally losing her a few times, I suggested she ride ahead and I would follow (since I certainly wouldn't want to always feel like I needed to catch up). This went well and we continued for most of our loop this way, until the last section which is a gradual, but very long hill. She was really struggling and told me to go ahead and she would catch up. I didn't really feel good about doing this, but she insisted. So I went ahead, then at a certain point slowed down quite a bit, to look behind me (I didn't want to get too far ahead). As a was coasting uphill looking behind me, some guy in full kit from somewhere, full skinsuit, booties, matching windbreaker, etc, fancy bike, rear mounted bottle cages, passes me. This piques my competitive devil a little bit (dude, don't think you're that much faster than I am just because I'm a girl on a pink bike coasting uphill) and I catch him and stay with him for about a mile. We were going fast -- a pace I could sustain but one which had me working. It was fun... I was not right on his wheel, I would say half/three quarters of a bike length behind. At that point I pulled into a driveway to wait for my friend (we were riding on a somewhat busy road that is popular with cyclists for its rolling hills, wide shoulders and gorgeous views). I didn't announce my presence or try to talk to him, it's possible that he didn't even know I was there, since I never saw him look back (though I could hear him shift so presumably he could hear me shift as well).

At the time I was unsure if it was "rude" to follow a stranger like this -- would my behaviour here fall into the same creepy/annoying category as this white-bearded guy???

[quint41]

I didn't read all the posts, but I did see one that I have to agree with .... ladies, if you feel uncomfortable, SAY SOMETHING. As girls, we are raised to not make waves, to not speak up, to be nice all the time. I'm not saying we have to been nasty, but we DO need to learn to speak up. If a guy did not like the way someone was behaving on a ride, you'd bet he'd say something. He wouldn't necessarily be rude about it, but he'd speak up!

I don't like people drafting me. I'm not a strong enough and confident enough rider yet. There are only a couple of people who I will allow to draft me, but they are well aware of my ability, and they are very experienced riders. Others who try to draft me, I simply turn and tell them that drafting makes me nervous, would they please move away, thank you. I've never gotten bad feedback for doing that.

(I used to watch my girls play softball. Never fail, in the outfield, two girls would run for the flyball and at the last minute, they would both stop short and the ball would hit the ground. One dad, who is a psychologist, called it the "you first" method of playing outfield ... "You first. No, really! You were there first, I insist!" Put two boys in the outfield, and one might end up with a concussion, but the ball would definitely be in someone's glove!) :p

[missymaya]

I agree with the rest of the ladies that this was a definately a creepmaster. I ride the trail everyday to get to and from work and in the early mornings it's not bad but in the afternoons you get some homeless people fishing and some suspicious charaters and a few months ago a woman was attacked and raped there. I make a note of what they look like and where they're at and ride as far on the opposite side as possible. Usually these people are harmless but I don't know if any of them will try to hurt me.
I haven't been in this particular situation but if it were me, I would definately say something and say it forcefully and loud (not yelling loud but loud enough) so that he should get the point to back off. If he still doesn't get the point pull out the cell and make a call and let the creep know that your notifying authorities about him. If DH is with you, use that to your advantage. I'm not saying women are helpless, but there is power in numbers and DH would probably scare the creep off.
Hope this creep backs off and safe riding.

[Geonz]

The "when is drafting okay?" question is a real "it depends" one. When somebody passes you and you catch up and draft a little from a not-too-close distance... many people (myself included) don't mind, though it *is* crossing into personal space.
I think teigyr's story and Kimmyt's stories are good ones to sort of compare and contrast. Kimmyt's guy was tacky... but a fairly common "this guy doesn't know when to rein in his ego" thing. I suffer from the same thing but I've got my mirror, so when you're gaining on me from behind I'm going to speed up *then.* I'm too proud and introverted to draft off ya; if you pass me I may let you get a bit ahead and then put on the speed just so you *know* I'm strong (and try to refrain from actually beating on my breast) ... but Ack! Pass you??? Not likely.
Teigyr's story, though, crosses the "normal" threshold. A: he's different for men and women. B: he "drafts" at slow speeds. Let's face it, they folks who are speeding up for ego reasons generally *want* to blow by me so when I slow down, they will speed up and be proud. This guy is not drafting - I don't want to *know* what he's doing.
I'm not saying eveyrbody should be normal, and he might not have a lot of control over his normalness. However, he needs to know our culture's social rules and learn to abide by them in public places. Could be the authorities have already spoken to him and wish more people would speak up... maybe he's got a caseworker. He may be lonlely, but he's certainly not going ot make friends with his current behavior patterns so it might be doing him a favor to convince him they need to change...

[Grog]

At the time I was unsure if it was "rude" to follow a stranger like this -- would my behaviour here fall into the same creepy/annoying category as this white-bearded guy???

It doesn't make you creepy (Geonz's answer is great) but it put you at a potential risk of hurting yourself, especially if 1) the guy doesn't know you're there or 2) the guy doesn't know how to draft someone else (and don't be fooled by the fancy clothes and bike, it doesn't mean much).

If there's a hill and he stands up (or sits back down), his bike will sort of "jerk back" (actually it's only slowing down while you keep pretty much the same pace) and you can bump into his wheel. Or if for some reason he brakes suddenly or even coasts, at the moment when you were not 100% attentive, you can also touch his wheel (or worse). He'll be fine, but you'll go down.

I don't think it's especially rude to draft off another roadie, but I find it really important to let that person know you're there. I'd really be mad if I someone drafting off me crashed in traffic because I didn't know they were there.

[smilingcat]

Polite thing to do is always ask if you want to draft someone.

If an idiot decide to draft off of me without asking, its a big "CLUE" that he doesn't know how to ride. I usually give the draftee a dirty look and if he still doesn't get it, I ride like Wilma until he goes away. Usually slowing down alot. I don't resort to snot rocket. Last thing is to piss off the guy behind you.

Being drafted by someone you don't know is very unsafe. Tell him to go away.
And kimmy's run in definitly gets my creepo alarm going in my head. If you are strong enough, drop him. And if you are not, stop and make a phone call. And even if you don't connect, pretend you are talking to your hubby or BF. Works like a charm.

shawn

[Eden]

I can see it in a couple of ways. Sometimes paths are so crowded that it can be nearly impossible to pass safely so you end up hanging out behind someone waiting. Really you should try to back off so that you aren't breathing right down someones neck in this situation, but everyone has their own personal space and some need more than others to feel comfortable.

Sometimes I end up behind other people because I'm supposed to be out doing a zone 1 recovery ride and I know that if I pass this person/group that I'll end up going much faster than I want. I try to hang out at a respectable distance and often someone in that group will drop back and chat. At 5 feet and female I'm not exactly a picture of threatening either though.....

Now when you are clipping along on a quiet trail or road and you pass someone who then latches on to your rear wheel and sits there saying nothing.... rude - or sometimes just clueless. Just try to be sure when you pass someone you do it decisively. If you pass and slow down the person you passed will often unconsciously speed up a little and next thing they know they are drafting you, whether they know how or not. Of course there are always those guys whose egos won't allow little ole 5 foot me to show them up and try to involve me in a silent "race". Those are the worst ones. Get off my tail dude and if you have to pass like I said do it decisively don't pass me then slow down - that's just annoying and now suddenly I'm drafting you and I don't want to be. (of course I kind of think its fun when some guy blows by me, but can't maintain that speed for more than a little bit so past I go again in a mile or so. I usually don't see those ones again since they burned it all up to pass me the first time)

[mimitabby]

Yay Eden! you are my hero.. (I would love to pass some more guys )

[Dianyla]

I was just thinking of another interesting way you could handle this, if you're coordinated enough to ride and use your cellphone at the same time.

Wait for El Creepo to start sucking your wheel. Pull out your cellphone and call police non-emergency dispatch (or, make a "pretend" call if you don't want to actually call someone). Then in a very loud voice that he can hear describe how there is this really creepy guy following you too closely on the Samm bike path and start describing him and your location on the trail. Maybe even slow down and glance back at him a few times while describing his build/height/stats and what he's wearing and what he's riding.

Yeah, that oughta do it. :cool:

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

Wait for El Creepo to start sucking your wheel. Pull out your cellphone and call police non-emergency dispatch (or, make a "pretend" call if you don't want to actually call someone). Then in a very loud voice that he can hear describe how there is this really creepy guy following you too closely on the Samm bike path and start describing him and your location on the trail. Maybe even slow down and glance back at him a few times while describing his build/height/stats and what he's wearing and what he's riding.

Yeah, that oughta do it. :cool:

Gee, I guess SO! :rolleyes: :D :eek: :p

I pass guys on bikes all the time.

(in my car)

[KnottedYet]

I was just thinking of another interesting way you could handle this, if you're coordinated enough to ride and use your cellphone at the same time.

Wait for El Creepo to start sucking your wheel. Pull out your cellphone and call police non-emergency dispatch (or, make a "pretend" call if you don't want to actually call someone). Then in a very loud voice that he can hear describe how there is this really creepy guy following you too closely on the Samm bike path and start describing him and your location on the trail. Maybe even slow down and glance back at him a few times while describing his build/height/stats and what he's wearing and what he's riding.

Yeah, that oughta do it. :cool:

Considering at least 3 of us on this thread have had encounters with creepy biking white-bearded guy, I think a real phone call or two are in order. I assume that whatever city we are in has jurisdiction over their part of the trail?

[teigyr]

Would the police do anything? What would be reported? I just know through personal experience that the police end up making me feel stupid and like I over react.

When I was in California, I went out for a late night walk/run. Making wise choices wasn't one of my strong suits! This guy started tailing me in his car. He was going the same speed as me and he had tinted windows. He tried to block me crossing the street and as his window started rolling down, I screamed and hightailed it the other direction. He sped off. I got his license plate number so I called the police. What they asked me was:

Did he touch you? Did he threaten you? Did he actually do anything to you?

I tried to explain that if it came down to him touching me, I might be dead. They said that there is nothing they can do unless the guy does something to me. They wouldn't even do a police report.

Fast forward to up here. A few months ago the phone rang at 4am. I answered it (DH was in the shower getting ready for work) and a voice said "in 30 minutes you will die" then they hung up. I *69'd the number but it was private. I called the phone company and initiated a trace. DH called the police and waited with me until they came. The police basically did the same thing and said it was probably just a prank and to let it go. They wouldn't even talk to the phone company to get the number -- apparently it could only be released to the police. I don't know...what basically amounts to a death threat is not a prank. I was almost in tears and the police looked incredibly bored and angry that they were called to the house.

I guess one thing to do with this guy is to get his picture and if enough people can identify him as harrassing them (but I don't think the police have the same definition of it as we do), maybe they'll do something? Or I guess maybe we could request extra patrols on the trail if they even patrol it.

I don't know. I guess I keep picturing the police with that same look on their face. It's the look parents get when siblings complain that the other one is looking at them. Or with my sister it was more like "she's on my side of the couch!"

[Derf]

I've run into creepy white-bearded bike guy on the Burke Gilman Trail, so he obviously uses the whole of Sammamish and Burke.

His MO seems to be hanging on a woman's wheel until she stops her bike. Then he tries to chat or just hangs around until she starts riding again. (I could NOT get rid of him until I caught up with my group and made them all stop so he went by.)

He is creepy.

Next time I see him I'll yell at him not to draft and to go around.

Ugh. You are all seeing the same creepy guy? Please carry mace or something and be careful. Men that do things like this drive me crazy. It's harassing.

[Grog]

Would the police do anything? What would be reported? I just know through personal experience that the police end up making me feel stupid and like I over react.

Police used not to take rape victims seriously, either.

We've come a long way, but it's still very difficult (including for rape victims).

I believe it must at least be tried. You must figure out who patrols the trails, and get to talk with someone there. If you can talk to a woman it's probably better.

It might be useful to remind them of Jenny Ewing and of that woman in Florida, whose name unfortunately escapes me.

Maybe some lawyer with criminal experience can help us, but I think that if you file an official complaint then they have to move their @$$. If that guy is creeping three TE women out, imagine how many more are freaked out about riding on those trails because of him!

[Eden]

He's probably under the impression that he's helpful and friendly - I wonder if posting over at the Cascade forum (our local bike club) would uncover him.....

[Dianyla]

He's probably under the impression that he's helpful and friendly - I wonder if posting over at the Cascade forum (our local bike club) would uncover him.....
Yeah, I was thinking about the CBC commuter forums... I only lurk there though.

[mimitabby]

Gee, it makes me want to start trolling that neighborhood to see if I could attract him (with others nearby for reinforcements)